What's going on with Genspect?

Lisa Muggeridge. She got hounded out of everywhere when she should have been hired by pretty much everyone.

An example of being wary about who you are platforming is Julia Malott.

In the last conference, a shining example of a totally normal 'trans woman' just attending a conference. Nothing to see here.

Months later, advocating for men taking drugs to breastfeed.

Yeah. Perfectly normal.

Not meant to be off topic. I'm just trying to understand what's going on with Genspect.

Can anyone remember the name of the woman, she was a (ex?) social worker with a child, who did some videos about safeguarding and gender ideology probably about six or seven years ago?

Her surname might have been McKenzie, but it's not Lisa McKenzie.

She told an anecdote about how during her training, someone had made a comment about 'well, how do we know what's normal anyway?' and the tutor had spelt out very clearly why adults knowing what's 'normal' and not permitting their judgements to be clouded was absolutely central to safeguarding.

It's not about one person being at one conference. It's about a clear, coherent and thought through approach to what is necessary to keep children safe. Predators groom adults before they groom children - that's how they get access.

No we did not

So is the idea that simply accepting the presence of an overtly AGP man at the conference was dangerous to children - indirectly, even though there were no children there - because it "gives credence to the concept of gender identity"?

Just trying to understand here.

This is how Genspect defines itself on its website:
Genspect is an international, non-partisan, interdisciplinary professional and educational organisation devoted to advancing a healthy approach to sex and gender.
By 'educational' I don't think it means schools, so it doesn't interact with children.

And this is what it says about safeguarding:
Genspect’s position on safeguarding.. is about protecting those who are not able to give informed consent to life-changing decisions: overwhelmingly, children. This aim is central to everything we do, including our goal to prevent ideological interference with empirical research into gender distress, our advocacy of non-medicalized approaches to addressing gender distress, our support groups for families of young people experiencing gender distress, our dedication to raising awareness of the high incidence of comorbidities and same sex attraction in young people reporting gender distress and our criticism of gender-affirming models of care. About — Genspect

Their objectives/ 'original aims' are also listed on that page.

I find it useful to go back to what organisations say, when assessing what they do.

@EatMyHead repeated here especially for you. It should explain the importance of safeguarding. I'm astounded you find the protection of children "perplexing".

Thank you. So someone tell me what exactly is the problem then?

Oh sorry, this must be more of that "pure garbage". Just can't help myself.

Were you looking on the appropriate Irish site? They're registered there I believe, not in the UK.

Someone said further up the thread that they found the information quickly and easily.

Genspect's accounts are on cro.ie
like if they were in the uk they would be on Companies House.
That is where accounts go.
Genspect operates as a cuideachta faoi theorainn ráthaíochta, a company limited by guarantee.
Its accounts are up to date.

This is my concern too WarriorN.

I know I keep going back to that Twitter Spaces with SOM that was posted a while back in the thread but it's a perfect example of the kind of thing we're talking about.

A concern is raised and instead of calm reflection and discussion those bringing up the concern are met with minimisation, dismissal and aggressive defensiveness of the "How very DARE you!!!" variety. It really is quite the eye opener.

@EatMyHead accounts and information about directors etc should be available on the companies house website. Or charities commission if a charity. I could not find them on either. You may have more luck.

I must admit I find the whole discussion about safeguarding - with its emphasis on children - perplexing.

Perhaps there's some evidence that men with AGP are all a terrible threat to childrens' well being, and the two must be kept apart from each other at all costs. I suspect not, but perhaps . . .

But that's irrelevant, because the conference was not aimed at children, and there's absolutely no reason to believe that children would have been there.

Contrary to what some have claimed here, Genspect's mission statement is not specifically about children. It's about gender. Yes, obviously how society's attitudes towards gender, treatment for gender dysphoria and so on affects children is going to be a major part of that. So for any situation where Genspect is going to be directly interacting with children, it would be reasonable to assume they have a robust child safeguarding policy in place.

But a conference like this is not such a situation.

And incidentally, your prattling on about "garbage" when all I've done is calmly demonstrate that your assertion was wrong (there's no law or established practice saying that accounts should be published on organisations' websites), and that you have provided no evidence for your criticism of Genspect (that their treatment of their accounts is any different from that of any other organisation of the same type) is incredibly childish. You're making yourself look foolish.

If you actually have anything to say that changes either of these points, then simply say it.

Every thing on our website is about safeguarding, safeguarding is a culture not a policy and safeguarding runs through every single thing we do.

We do not have contact with children. We produce resources to help parents challenge poor safeguarding and we advocate for better understanding and implementation of safeguarding.

I think I may have explained this to you before.

And where are the accounts of a not-for-profit company "meant to be"? (presuming you mean according to the laws that govern how such accounts are treated).

Wherever it is, are Genspect's not there?

You know that if that's true, they're breaking the law and can be prosecuted, right?

Like I said. Pointless.

Weirdly enough, Safe Schools Alliance don't seem to have a publicly available safeguarding policy.

@ResisterRex Does every organisation that challenges gender woo need to have full safeguarding policy? I see Genspect has a safeguarding policy, but I can't see these policies on other sites - maybe I'm missing them? Does Fair Cop need one? It doesn't seem to have one. Nor does Transgender Trend nor Sex Matters. Nor does Let Women Speak.

FML

Genspect doesn’t work with children and so all the references to safeguarding on this thread are pretty ott

More garbage.

Charities' and political parties' accounts are where they're meant to be. If you haven't found Uni accounts then you've not looked. I found Notts and Liverpool's very easily yesterday. Nothing is hidden. Nothing is behind a paywall. Nothing is a blog calling people names for asking questions.

You don't get this. I just hope you do not have a job which necessitates you getting it.

Excellent post Terry.

Some of this is about how they respond to queries/ criticism about appropriateness and understanding safeguarding. Defensiveness and denial is anti safeguarding.

@ResisterRex
Purest garbage, based on a wilful misunderstanding of my posts as regards Genspect and their post attacking people who ask how they’re funded and who funds them.

OK. It shouldn't take you long to point me to all the websites of organisations of a similar structure to Genspect, who have their accounts published on their website then.

UK parties’ accounts are on the Electoral Commission page...

That's right, on the Electoral Commission page. Not on their website.

charities’ accounts are on the Charity Commission page...

That's right, on the Charity Commission page, not on their website.

and universities publish their own.

Yep, though not on their websites, AFAIK (though I've never looked).

So exactly what part of "I've never seen an organisation - charitable, political, academic or otherwise - that publishes its accounts on its website" is "purest garbage"? Nothing you've said here has contradicted it.

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "publish". Different organisational structures have different sets of laws they have to obey regarding accounting. Most involve submitting a set of accounts, usually audited and approved by some authority within the organisation, each year to a central body which makes them available to the public. Have you any evidence that Genspect have not done that, in accordance with the appropriate laws for their organisation type? (As far as I can tell they're a not-for-profit registered company, though I don't know exactly what that means in Irish law).

There are obvious reasons why most organisations don't go any further than that, or any further than they legally have to, with the "publishing" of their financial details. They're similar to the reasons why you don't publish your personal tax returns all over the web.

It is not too much to ask that instead of attacking people with questions, they’re open and transparent (as I’ve now said a number of times now and not sure I can bear repeating it all again).

As soon as you provide some evidence that they're NOT open and transparent, to a normal and legal degree similar to other companies operating under the same framework, this will become a question worth answering.