Has anyone read Mad Honey by Jodi Picout and Jennifer Finney Boylan

I loved the book

But I don't like being called cis or cisgendered. Which is how she was referring to women in the author's note. I'm not cis and hate that.
And the 'assigned at birth' jars with me

I always go to Sarah Stuart's The Lies They Tell website, and Twitter feed, get a really close description of the madness of the arts world.

What can one say after reading Sarah's corruscating take down of this preposterous book.

First of all, as she says, this carefully constructed PR that Jodi is a relentless researcher with all the facts laid out on the page is shown to be pure fantasy, she's a pure propagandist by what I read in Sarah's summary.

Secondly, what propaganda! That gender reassignment surgery is both seamless and indistinguishable from the real thing, all upside with no risk/side effects.

Then, a barely disguised nod to one of the most heinous figures in the trans medicalisation world.

All wrapped up thru her PR interviews cycle that the matter is closed, there is no debate, and that the devil is GC feminists.

You can literally see the denial and self absorption and fake kindness and denial of reality and railroading of women and self hypnosis, all wrapped up in one effete snob, Jodi being a bellweather of the middle and upper classes educated elites capture by this ideology.

That's before you even get to the lumbering presence of the co-author next to her, literally casting a misogynist shadow over proceedings.

extract

The problem for kids whose puberty has been blocked early isn’t just a lack of tissue but of sexual development. Puberty not only stimulates growth of sex organs. It also endows them with erotic potential. “If you’ve never had an orgasm pre-surgery, and then your puberty's blocked, it's very difficult to achieve that afterwards,” Bowers said. “I consider that a big problem, actually. It's kind of an overlooked problem that in our ‘informed consent’ of children undergoing puberty blockers, we’ve in some respects overlooked that a little bit.”

Nor is this a problem that can be corrected surgically. Bowers can build a labia, a vaginal canal and a clitoris, and the results look impressive. But, she said, if the kids are “orgasmically naive” because of puberty blockade, “the clitoris down there might as well be a fingertip and brings them no particular joy and, therefore, they’re not able to be responsive as a lover. And so how does that affect their long-term happiness?”

(Continues)

Bowers told me she now finds early puberty blockade inadvisable. “I’m not a fan of blockade at Tanner Two anymore, I really am not,” she told me, using the clinical name of the moment when the first visible signs of puberty manifest. “The idea all sounded good in the very beginning,” she said. “Believe me, we’re doing some magnificent surgeries on these kids, and they’re so determined, and I’m so proud of so many of them and their parents. They’ve been great. But honestly, I can’t sit here and tell you that they have better — or even as good — results. They’re not as functional. I worry about their reproductive rights later. I worry about their sexual health later and ability to find intimacy.”

Bowers knows what the loss of fertility and sexual intimacy might entail: She has three children, all born before she transitioned, and she spent a decade tending to victims of female genital mutilation. “Those women, a lot of them experience broken relationships because they cannot respond sexually,” she said. “And my fear about these young children who never experience orgasm prior to undergoing surgery are going to reach adulthood and try to find intimacy and realize they don’t know how to respond sexually.”

Continues: Interview with Bowers

As already discussed, the doctor Monica Powers is a thinly disguised insert of a real person.

Here's an interview with Bowers, explaining why the doctor thinks chemically interfering in children's development to stop puberty isn't reversible. Top Trans Doctors Blow the Whistle on 'sloppy' care

I am in a bookclub with my neighbours and this book was chosen a few months ago. It was a strange time for me to read it as I had just finished listening to the 'Witch trials of JK Rowling' podcast then joined Twitter and my world was turned upside down.
(Cannot fathom how all of this passed me by before then..... I was vaguely aware of JKR being 'transphobic' but wasn't sure why, my only outlook on transgenderism was sympathy for anyone in that situation, thought it was highly rare condition etc etc.)
Anyway, I was a bit manic for a while - my husband seriously thought I was going through some kind of perimenopausal episode - very hyped up about it all and was worried about how to not 'out' myself at the bookclub.
The book had been chosen by a neighbour who has an adult child who is gender nonconforming (I think he's just a very feminine gay man), so understandably she was tentatively curious and a bit guarded about discussions on the topics raised in the book.
I read this review of the book and it was so well done particularly with the reframing of the book as a powerful propaganda tool to JP's massive readership.
its worth checking out..... The transactivist movement is really so accomplished at spreading their message....

https://the-lies-they-tell.org/2022/11/27/review-of-novel-mad-honey/

In the end after a large glass of wine and too many hot nuts I just couldn't hold back, I pretty much gave a presentation on what a pack of lies it was and how we all needed to educate ourselves. I had been listening to the podcast 'Gender through a wider lens' at this point so I had a lot to tell them.
The Dr Monica Powers character is obviously based on Dr Marci Bowers of WPATH by the way.
I managed to not offend anyone but did shoot down a 'what about the third gender in Indonesia?' argument.... (was also halfway through Trans by Helen Joyce)

The next day I got a lovely message from one of the women thanking me for bringing all this to the group as it was huge learning for her too.

Nobody in the group is on twitter, everyone reads the broadsheet newspapers and listens to the national broadcaster..... for some being asked to put pronouns in their work email signature was the extent of their experience with GI.

so really I should be thanking JP as this book really spurred me on to spread the word.... (just not within earshot of my teenagers and my husband)
x

Read a couple of Jodi Picoult books, and found them easy to get through, interesting premises but mawkish, and lazy plotting to get out of difficult dilemmas.

JFB I've seen on Twitter and is frankly, deranged.

Not a chance would I waste my one and only life on their collective ploppings.

Yup, she has clearly drunk the Kool Aid.

I've just read this interview on Literary Hub;

Literary Hub: Who do you most wish would read your book?

Jodi Picoult: J.K. Rowling. She is one of the most vocal trans-exclusive radical feminists, and she seems to be using her platform these days to exclude trans women from the overarching category of “women”—claiming that being inclusive somehow diminishes women. She also, as a victim of abuse, points to trans women and alleges that too many are really just men hoping to get into women’s safe spaces to hurt them… when in reality, a trans woman is far more likely to be hurt than a cisgender woman.

I retweeted the thread mentioned earlier and JP has replied.

What a load of absolute horse shit. Embarrassed for the 'author'.

(Sorry - hadn't yet read the Twitter thread.😂 )

That twitter thread is hilarious. I thought the best bit was For WomenScotland's re-write.

Sarah Stuart of The Lies They Tell reviewed this on twitter.

twitter thread

I thought the best bit was the immortal reference to the continent of Africa as a country

excerpt from novel
"Dr. Powers," Jordan says, "can you tell us what you do for a living?"

"I'm a gender confirmation surgeon at Mills-Peninsula Medical Center in Burlingame, California. I'm on the surgical subcommittee of WPATH-the World Professional Association for Transgender Health. I perform pro bono reversals of clitoral circumcision and genital mutilation in Africa and other countries." Her lips curve.

"And I happen to be a trans woman myself."

I know Jordan has flown her in here to be an expert, to educate the jury. I watch them study her with unabashed curiosity. Some look patently surprised, as if the act of seeing a stunning woman and hearing her say she is transgender is already forcing them to reevaluate their opinions.

"What does it mean," Jordan asks, "to be transgender?"

"Trans people are people whose gender identity doesn't match the gender they were thought to be when they were born," Dr. Pow-

It was horribly written and boring. The actual 'story' was flimsily interwoven between large chunks of trans propaganda/wishful thinking and a comprehensive treatise on bee keeping.

Oh dear, people on Audible saying how great it is and what an education on trans issues 🤦‍♀️

Children who say that they are trans are incredibly useful, aren't they? Not only do many of the parents become fierce advocates, they take this into their work. JP is an author, but others are doctors, lawyers, corporate executives or charity workers. One person well placed stops discussion in its tracks. An author creates propaganda and on it goes.

"Jennifer Finney Boylan is male.

Sounds like wish fulfilment to me."

It is. As well as passing perfectly and having marvellous shags in a magical treehouse with the hunky jock and having multiple orgasms (I think the phrase "as wet as a harbour seal" alone should earn the book a nomination for those Craply Written Sex literary raspberry awards), the trans character is slim, beautiful, athletic and an accomplished fencer, very clever, well read and unsually musically talented.

One other thing that annoyed me - apart from the book-long TWAW lecture- is that
SPOILER ALERT*

the trans character turns out to have died from a combination of

• the hormone treatment (this is the pivotal evidence on which the court case hinges, but thereafter the book glosses over the fact that the artificial chemicals needed to transition the character fucked up a healthy body to the point of death like physically and chemically mutilating children is no biggie); and

• a bitch fight over a boy. Writer should have gone the whole hog and written it as a naked girls' pillow fight gone wrong for the full male wank-fantasy experience the book seems to be

Winston Blair recently did a long interview with a detransitioner (MtFtM), Alexander. s

Alexander says he now wonders if the photos the surgeon showed him before surgery were all fake. His result is 'nowhere near' a 'natural vagina'. He describes it as a wound (this is several years post surgery) that has caused him extreme pain and complications.

The book was published in October last year, so it must have been about a year ago that it was recorded.

I think one of the son’s transitioned (mtf) too!

Jfb was born male and married with two sons. Then had full surgery...I am no expert but ongoing hormone treatment is needed...and remains with the original wife. So would have personal experience.
Also Jim now Jenny is a respected academic...and would have academic works under both names.
I must read this...I got fed up with Jodi Picoult but the two authors is intriguing. Although having read replies it isn't very successful!

I used to work for the vice squad. We had a new officer transferred and he was shocked that one of our regulars was a transwoman. Same transwoman caught in the act with a customer (oral not full sex) and when arrested the customer wouldn't believe he'd been with a man. Once they convinced him they said he started vomiting. To be fair I knew them before they transitioned, not tall, very slim, nice hair. Don't know if it would have been convincing if it had been intercourse. Don't know about smell but definitely walked like a woman walks in very high heels.

I wonder how long ago it was recorded? Now it would be hugely frowned upon to have a natal female playing the part of a TW.