16 year old stepson's reaction to the Russel Brand sentencing

That's one of the reasons it is a meaningless term. Ive told my son that if he does encounter a woman saying "give it to me baby", he should probably decline.

Can I clarify that a man is more likely to be raped by another man than be falsely accused of rape by a women. The stats on a man being raped by a women are even less likely.

For the posters referring to 'enthusiastic consent', what does that mean? Back in my days of occasional casual sex, I'm not sure I've ever been vocally enthusiastic (like a porn star 'give it to me, baby ') or vigorously and enthusiastically driving the way. Nor explicitly said 'I consent to X'. What is meant by 'enthusiastic consent'.?

But that isnt very realistic and so I have a nuanced conversation about it. I don't think your rules are realistic or comprehensive enough for them to be useful.

I presented to you what I thought to be sensible precautions against false allegations.
All reasonable.

You rebuffed every one, thus the only advice I'd be giving if I were you is to not have casual sex full stop.

I was not being sarcastic at all.

Because there arent simple answers or rules of thumb that will cover every situation. That is what I tell my son.

All that you can be certain of is that there is a risk. Ultimately, you have to decide if the risk is worth taking. That will depend on the situation each time. There will be times where you conclude that the risk is acceptable, even though alcohol or unfamiliarity is a factor, and times you will not. Each time is different.

Not according to you there aren't.

Casual sex means, by definition, there is no real way of knowing the history of the person you are having sex with.

Right? Obviously right!

Thus all you can do - IF you are having casual sex with somebody-is ensure the consent is given and enthusiastically and that the person is not intoxicated. I suggested these things and you refuted them.

That is all you can reasonably do. What the feck else is there?
Signing of contracts? Cameras in the room?
Witnesses?

This. He's the one that should be the role model for his son.

Exactly.

I think casual sex carries the highest risk for a false allegation. There are ways to minimise that risk.

I actually can't tell if you're being sarcastic. Obviously the advice never to have casual sex in case you are accused of rape is unrealistic but not more offensive than the advice to women not to wear certain things, not to go places alone, or be out at particular times in case they get raped, is it?

My 15 year old tried to come out with the 'lots of women lie' shit last night, both me and my husband slapped that right down.

Oh well then if that's the case it's best not for any young man to have casual sex again. Or indeed any man.

I'm sure that you will agree.

"Do not have sex with women unless she is enthusiastic about it."

Vulnerable people can both be sober and enthusiastic. Still wise to say no.

"Do not have sex with intoxicated women. Ever. Not even one drink."

That's unrealistic. Both for casual encounters and ongoing relationships.

"I would suggest that a 'had a great time last night' text is sent after doing the above if sexually activity has taken place and hopefully she'll send a text saying 'and me.'"

This could be a fawning response by a victim and in no way proves consent where there is evidence and allegations that say otherwise.

That just opens up more dialogue dosent it. He can find a way to keep the conversation going.
If you say how you feel if you were raped shuts it down more.

My advice to young men would be to be sure that consent is given. Do not have sex with women unless she is enthusiastic about it. That's absolutely fundamental.
Do not have sex with intoxicated women. Ever. Not even one drink.
If she has taken any alcohol at all, politely excuse yourself from the date.

As an extra layer of protection., I would suggest that a 'had a great time last night' text is sent after doing the above if sexually activity has taken place and hopefully she'll send a text saying 'and me.'

This text should be saved. Never deleted.

I advise this not because most women lie, not at all, but as protection on the, admittedly slim, chance she changes her mind later.

Eh? I'm only responding to another poster who seemed to want involve herself in a bun fight with me.
You're the 'div' if you can't see that.
Try using the quote history function.

If you did you'd see that I utterly refute the suggestion that most women lie.

It’s tricky with Brand because there’s two elements of denial if you like. One is the track your stepson has gone down of assuming the women were lying which is easily done given how many women did consensually have sex with him at the time… He literally had women queuing up to shag him at the height of his fame. Brand’s dad has also adopted this position.

Then there’s the people who believe it’s all a wider conspiracy because Brand has flipped from being borderline communist maybe a decade ago to being far right. He’s always been fairly anti establishment either way and always called out the wealthy and powerful among us. Why they’d be suddenly quite so concerned about him spouting off on TikTok is beyond me but there you go.

There is a glaring issue with these stats and if you want to have a conversation about the issue with someone who is wholly doubtful like the SS, it's better to acknowledge it.

These stats come from cases where they have proven that the claim was false.

We know that most allegations of rape or SA do not make it to court because there is insufficient evidence and/or poor investigation.

What we do not know for pretty much the same reasons is how many of these allegations that do not make it to court were false. We can assume most of them are true for a variety of reasons. But we don't know how many are false.

That leads us to discuss with young men that indeed, the risk for some men in some situations to have false allegations against them is heightened. That is why we have to think about our choices and even if all boxes are ticked on paper in terms of the legality of consent, it's sometimes best to still say no.

I would be bringing this up with the dad, sternly.

I wouldn't. I'd be going in with the assumption that he's decent. That way he's much more likely to be on board. People don't like to be lectured. If that fails then, yeah, things get more difficult.

You can tell him that statistically as a man he is 230 times more likely to raped himself than to be falsely accused. Others have raised good points to tell him tok about how hard it is to actually even get to court let alone get a conviction.

I would be bringing this up with the dad, sternly. He needs to talk to his son. If he is also of the same thinking then you really need to question the type of people you are around and are raising your daughter around. It really is that serious.

I'd also add that a talk about how changing your mind can be really hard might be in order. Especially when you liked a person. It can feel like their behaviour reflects on you or that you were stupid to like them. I think the latter particularly where you have all these people coming out saying, 'Well, I knew he was a wrongun.' It can make it easier to believe he's been stitched up, so that you don't have to change your mind. But it's actually a sign of strength and judgement to change your mind when the evidence is added to.

The establishment are clearly out to get Robinson, Fox and Farage, that isn’t in dispute.

People like Brand had immense social media followings way in excess of any individual or organisation liked to government. He was the darling of the left for quite some time because of this but eventually fell out of favour from Covid onwards when his views because misaligned with theirs.

As for the comments about Glitter, Harris etc I’m at a loss to understand your point. Surely you aren’t dense enough to be suggesting the point being made is sex offenders are only ever pursued if they are public figures who oppose government?

Maybe. And definitely a good teaching moment.

But my first step would be to speak to my dh about what on-line material his son had been absorbing.

Nobody has said that no woman has NEVER lied.
OPs stepson suggested that ‘MOST’ women lie. Clear and utter bollocks.
These women did NOT lie and Russel Brand has been found guilty.
I’m not certain which micro hill you’re trying to die on here, or for what purpose, but you are making a div of yourself.