Burnt out teacher!

Feeling it this week. Between a deep dive into my subject, yet more cover and both my PPA periods being taken up with having to complete formal observations on my ECTs, Y11 intervention, mentoring, hundreds of parent emails (they have free access to our email addresses), data entries and a series of tests due, it feels I haven't stopped. Add to that end-of-term silliness by students and staff members basically being done at this point, it's been a shattering one, and we still have a week to go!

I'm also a HOD in a secondary school. We have period 6 on a Monday plus 1 or 2 meetings as well (it varies, but Monday can go until 4:15 or 6;15). I also have HOD meeting with SLT twice per term and the usual parents evening etc. Intervention is where I have put my foot down and said it runs on staff generosity- they are giving up their free time so I don't expect them to do it.

I'm not saying it's OK in terms of pay - I'm saying 50hrs isn't terrible per se. I would, however, say that a prison officer (similar wage - also underpaid in my view) will do 7 consecutive night shifts of 11/12 hrs each night but then will have a week off to recover. I wouldn't then say he is working an average circa 80 hr week. I guess you have to look at how many weeks that is spread across. My PA will work 45-50hrs per week for 47 weeks of the year - on a similar salary.

But equally there are an awful lot of jobs that are underpaid and, I agree, it's not right.

To me that doesn’t look too bad. I’m at school 7-15 until 6 every day x

Why the lol?

Many who work over 50 hours per week earn far more for doing so. How much do you earn?

I know I have 2 teachers in my family so I understand the workload and hours. I also work over 50 hours (as do many) so I can’t have sympathy for that lol

OP I can sympathize. I'm not a teacher but I work full time 8:30-17:00 all whilst juggling being a mum. I have a long commute so I need to leave the house by 7am and I'm not back until after 6pm. I'm just tired but at least I can say my salary is good.

I completely agree - so you have my sympathy. And no I do not think 30k is an acceptable salary - I'm sorry if that's how my post came across - I was actually saying the opposite!!

Yes we're not getting private school, wrap around care etc to do these hours are we on £30 k.

Huge difference!!!

The ridiculous thing is most teachers don't nec want extra pay as such just conditions that allow time to do the actual job. And less of the micromanaginf/ unnecessary pressure on teachers and students.

You think 50 hours for £30k is ok?

As I've said above, I do have complete sympathy because for teachers to be leaving in droves means there is clearly an issue.

But just to address the misconception that office based professions work 9-5 and aren't accountable for their time: in my profession we have to time record 7hrs a day billable time - so we account for every 6 mins for everything we can bill to a client - that doesn't include every time you get up from your desk, any admin/filing, any billing, any training, CPD, marketing etc so in reality you'll do at least a 13 hr day to record those 7 hrs. Our office has beds because the reality is people do just have to sometimes stay all night.

I don't think any oit this is acceptable or conducive to a working parent but I'm just adding context.

I think one of the major differences is pay - my job allows me a good lifestyle, private school so that I have excellent wrap around care and no money worries. I wouldn't therefore want to do 80/90 hr weeks for the pay teachers receive - it's completely wrong (50hrs I think is ok). Do you think you would all feel differently if you were just paid properly (i.e. find the conditions more acceptable)?

Yes so these will just be the hours being filled for her by meetings (when she can't do any work) or lessons / intervention sessions for which she will need to have created resources (think a PowerPoint of the lesson, worksheets, printing etc) - which she will have to do mostly outside the hours she's mentioned, for anything she teaches that week.

I have 150 minutes of PPA (planning, prep, assessment) time a week and it's not enough to avoid me working long hours at home. Add to that things we have to create for a tutor group and exam marking.

OP is also a HOD which means she's not only line managing people but will have a huge variety of other tasks on top of her normal teaching load.

Yes, so when you add in all the extra stuff that teachers have to do outside of actually teaching lessons and meetings, you'll understand that it'll take the OP well over full time hours.

The average teacher works 50 hours a week.

People voting YABU likely don't understand that you have hours of planning prep and marking to do every day that can't get done when these meetings / interventions are happening.

Teaching is not a family-friendly profession, the only exception is the holidays - I know so many teachers who have burnt out even part time with kids or left teaching entirely because of it.

I currently have no kids and work 7.30-4 on a good day at school, come home and work until 8.30pm, have dinner and go to bed. I have had to call in sick one day just to try and keep up with the assessment marking and tight deadline (every teacher I know has had to do this). I have had to have ECGs more than once for one of many physical effects of anxiety from work.

My new school has us doing only 10 hours of intervention over the year, only two morning briefings a week, and department and pastoral meetings after school alternate (I'm still doing the hours above). I would like to go part time after we have children but even so I don't find this a sustainable profession, it's repeatedly affected my health. I do understand the misconceptions, people probably think the hours we're at school is all we do. And even then don't understand the relentless pace of it (I'm a career changer and have worked in corporate and charities before so feel I can compare).

You would have a far better work life balance doing a 9-5(.30) esp if flexible hours or remote working are on the table.

Looking at the hours from a different profession they seem like normal full time hours
In teaching the contract is usually 32 hours a week, term time plus 5 PD days though with reasonable time outside those hours to complete duties.

What the OP describes would likely take them well outside the directed time budget and they still have a lot of their classroom duties and their leadership work to complete in their own time.

And this is why I left teaching! Those who never taught have no idea.

Some pp need to remember it's not a race to the bottom. Start another thread about how difficult your career is if thou believe you don't have time to eat, wee or breath.

Looking at the hours from a different profession they seem like normal full time hours

Yikes. I think I'd probably rather spend Saturdays umpiring in the rain!

@PickledMumion it depends on the school. Minimum 10% PPA is in the STPCD but the rest is up to the school.

Would anyone mind telling me what's a standard teaching load for a classroom teacher and/or a HOD in a state school?

I'm in an independent at the moment, and the extra curricular and saturday expectations, and evening boarding duties during the week, are getting me down. But our standard timetable is only 38 teaching lessons out of 50, with one or two meetings on top. I also get an extra 4 period allowance per fortnight for HOD (3 for smaller departments).

Seems normal IF within start time for directed time? If not then no!

Yep. I've been looking at local authority roles at 27-30k which is so much less. But also thinking it will be a lot less hours and boundaried work... So possibly a higher hourly rate!!

Sendiass was even less. I was so surprised. But the work involves sitting talking to people one on one so far less intense.

I’m also an HOD and a Mum to 2 young children.

On my timetable it looks as though I have 5 free periods per week, but I’ve only had this once this academic year. Most weeks I have to cover 2 lessons, and other weeks it has been 1 lesson. Most weeks therefore I only get 3 hours PPA, which for an HOD is just not correct. Any time I raise this issue with the person who arranges cover and my line manager, they tell me I’m under allocation and therefore they’ll use me in this way.

I’m now in talks with the union about the above, and about a couple of other things I don’t want to mention on here.

I also have a tutor group 5 days per week for 30 minutes each time.

Each week we have:
A 10 minute briefing.
1.5 hours of CPD & meetings

Every fortnight there is also some kind of meeting for HOD’s.

They keep on telling me I need to run an after school club, but I keep on telling them I can’t fit it in, especially due to my own childcare needs.

I am working every single night at home for at least 2 hours, but usually for about 4 or 5 hours from 9pm until 1 or 2am. If I’m too tired to get it all done and start dozing, I set the alarm on my phone for 4am and go to sleep and get up at 4am and do some work.

The behaviour and attitudes of the majority of the people I am supposed to teach are atrocious. Most of the time I cannot get the class to be quiet so that I can give a basic instruction or actually try and teach them something. I’ve been told to fuck off more times in this school than in my whole teaching career.

There is no TA support available despite three quarters of my students in most of my classes having SEN and/or behavioural needs.

I really can’t go on like this, mentally and physically it’s draining and I’m ill as a result.

I’m looking for another job. I’m desperate to escape teaching altogether, but I need to earn a least £48,000 to make this dream a possibility. I have applied for a number of education-related roles that are non-teaching, but I don’t even make the shortlist. Most of the salaries for non-teaching roles who expect you to have been a Teacher are so much lower than Teacher salaries, so most of them I can’t apply for as sadly there’s nothing left for my family and I to cut back on.

I feel utterly desperate and completely depleted. I just don’t smile anymore.

No, I’m one of the other professionals OP asked about. NHS

You work those hours in a school? Including all the planning, marking, meetings m, data analysis and admin?