PIP

The ability to work isn’t considered in the PIP assessment. It assesses your ability to mobilise and a range of personal care and daily living tasks. You can work and claim PIP.

Former benefits adviser here. Assessors will ask claimants if they drive as a matter of routine. The reasoning is that if you can and do drive, you are displaying cognitive skills, manual dexterity, physical strength, multi tasking and concentration. These can all be used to disprove other aspects of disability being claimed. I always advised claimants that if they could only drive an automatic, or used specialist car controls to accommodate disability then it was crucial that they assessor understood this. I’ve seen many a PIP claim turned down because the assessor has successfully argued that the claim to a certain level of impairment has been disproved by the ability to drive.

Assessors will also ask if you have a pet. If you have a dog, unless you state otherwise they will assume that you walk it, and that can be used to deny a claim for mobility component. The ability to feed and generally look after a pet can also be used against a claimant in the daily living component too.

What do you mean?

Fibro - the gift that keeps on giving, it seems.

@ALongHardWinter what do you mean? Wpuld they not need to get hold of workplace? X

I am amazed that people still think that PIP is means tested.

@Pigeonqueen hi, im due to have my assessment, and feel like i will be judged because ive apied. Dont wanna be telling people in work because i know people just gossip etc . X

You’re right, it is ridiculous and woudn’t be tolerated as a valid method of evaluating someone’s ability in any other situation. But it does happen. I’ve handled many reconsiderations and tribunal appeals where someone’s whole PIP claim has been affected by the fact that they can drive, on the basis that their own estimation of their condition is wrong and they’re more capable than they’re admitting to.

When driving you’re displaying concentration, understanding of written instruction and signage, rules of the road, flexibility of movement in doing your observations before manoeuvring. They will even use the ability to use the foot pedals as an indication of physical ability. You’re also demonstrating physical ability to actually handle the car safely. All of these things can be used against you.

For example if you say you have difficulty concentrating because of a mild cognitive disorder, if it’s not enough to stop you from driving, that will be used to show that your difficulty doesn’t have a great impact.

If you say you have restricted movement in joints, your neck for example, or grip in your hands, again your ability to drive will be cited - movement of neck in observations, grip on the steering wheel, ability to control the car in general. PIP doesn’t consider the disability itself, but the impact of it on daily life and the ability to drive can be a gift to the assessor in minimising the overall effect of your condition. I’ve even known assessors to give claimants a stern lecture on the need to report such difficulties to the DVLA, which isn’t helpful.

I advise all claimants who drive that they will be asked about this, and to report any aids or adaptations they use to mitigate the effects of their disability on their driving ability - even if it’s only a switch to an automatic gearbox for ease. You should also report it if your condition means there are days when it affects your ability to drive, or stops you from doing it at all. And those claimants who drive adapted or wheelchair accessible vehicles with hand controls and other specialist adaptations should always make sure that they state in details what the adaptations are and what they’re for, otherwise you’ll be judged in the same way.

Of course it's unreasonable. There are more variables at play and being able to drive does not reflect ability in other areas. The 'you can do X so we think you can do Y' is a ridiculous method of assessing someone's disability.

I can drive, sometimes. There are times when I can't even leave the house to put my rubbish in the bin, should my variances be ignored because I 'can’ drive?

The driving question is attached to some very outdated and shitty opinions about disabilities.

I swear some people would like us all stuck at home with zero quality of life

I don't get the issue with being asked if you drive. That being said, it was decided that I could but had chosen not to. My parents were told when I was 4 I'd never meet the minimum standards for driving. Every consultant since I was 18 said the same. One said he sees patients who meet the minimum standards but when it comes to the test, they fail the eyesight checks. Due to the nature of my eyesight condition, it's harder to drive safely.

They ask it because it's evidence that you can see well enough, you can do things like follow a journey and have cognitive ability. I don't think that's unreasonable.

Hello fellow lupey!!!! I get it as I’m not allowed to bath etc on my own ( and I once forgot I was cooking and set a small fire!) amongst other things. Unseen disabilities are awful, not just in having them, but having people who think we “look fine”. Spoons to you!! 💐

@EpidermolysisBullosa im absolutely gobsmacked that you “only” got low rate mobility and no care awarded. Did you think about taking it to a tribunal at all? Surely with all of that evidence it is obvious how much help and support you need. The system is so flawed.

I’ve posted this on another pip thread and I feel almost embarrassed now to admit it but I have multiple physical and MH issues. I’m 45 and did not see myself as bad as I actually am and requested a pip form 3 times but never filled it in as I couldn’t deal with the stress. I did it again earlier in the year and yet again I didn’t fill it in but received a text for assessment which I found bizarre and felt i had nothing to lose.

assessment took over 2 hours on the phone and my assessor was absolutely lovely but I know that means nothing really and 2 weeks later I had received a large back pay and was awarded enhanced rate for both elements. I didn’t fill in a form or provide any evidence and that’s what makes me angry for people like you who have done all of the above.

pip has been utterly life changing for me and my family and I’m really grateful for it but when I keep on hearing these stories about how other claimants are treated it makes my blood boil. The system is outdated and needs a complete overhaul. Someone on another thread mentioned that there should be a descriptor for cleaning/laundry etc and I agree. Also the “ do you drive?” Question is often used as a way to trip people up ( I don’t drive ) and it’s wrong. I really wish that the whole process could be challenged and the forms updated to reflect how our struggles really affect us rather than it being a tick box exercise and then reviewed by actual medical professionals.

@thankyouforthedayz Yes. I was started down the CHC route, but it was decided home care with visiting healthcare workers on a needs basis, was more suitable. Hence I have the bed and some bits funded, but a lot's allocated to my PIP.
Care's very rationed here, and basic quality is an issue alongside so much emphasis on ensuring fraud prevention, that everything must center around that, rather than needs, even when scoring highs and lots of moderates.
Both Care commissioner and council are beyond loathe to issue personal health care budgets, as are the council with personal budgets for home care packages.

Lots of care companies here say their employees are able to meet basic nursing care needs, the reality is another story and the bar on what's acceptable is low. General expectation is swap your PIP for their services or find someone to take carers allowance and top it up, and in both cases, patchwork nursing care to back it up, with fraud prevention being the constant concern.

So much of what was assessed as needed just never materialized. Other parts became a minefield such as adaptations to the home which I was green lighted for but could never make happen. Working and my refusal to have males in to change my catheter etc throws up another problem (tbf that's entirely on me) and beggars can't be choosers etc. I know the theory of it all but the reality makes getting high rate PIP look easy. The whole system is broken and in the end the fighting takes more toll than accepting whatever you can get out of it.

How ironic: writing personal insults calling me a "hypocite", "horrible" and "nasty" and "judgemental" and then claiming I have "a tendency to be nasty". 🤣

My responses weren't to the OP. They were to horrific posts by other posters.

I can respond to any part of any post I choose to, thank you, particularly when it is making unpleasant insinuations that disabled people can't possibly have high care needs and manage to earn a decent salary and that there is something suspicious about this. If you were such a person, as you claim, I highly doubt you'd have written what you did.

Relieved to know you won't be responding to me anymore with further unwarranted personal insults. That's good news.

Wow, this thread took a turn.

mellowyellow, your sister sounds eligible for PIP from what you say.

a microwave meal doesn’t meet the standard specified by the DWP for the task, which is ‘a balanced meal prepared from fresh ingredients’ .

Going to work doesn’t mean at all that a person is able to complete the tasks to the required standard.

There are some very ableist views here. The system for claiming PIP is terrible. Outcomes are inconsistent. Assessors do lie and cheat. The DWP behave illegally. This is in no way the fault of anyone who has been successful in claiming and putting disabled people against each other detracts from the real issue.

We’re not playing disability top trumps here. The issue is with the system.

I haven't asked for it to be deleted. I was just sad and disappointed at some of the awful comments.

This thread took a dark turn, crikey.

Please don't get this thread deleted or comments deleted.

It should stand as evidence of what some people really think.

Could be a useful link tbh.

I have lots of disabilities but the main condition I claim PIP for is Epidermolysis Bullosa Simplex.

EB is a rare genetic disorder. There's about 500k of us worldwide and about 5k of us in the UK. It causes fragile skin which blisters and tears easily. I have the mildest form and my blistering is mostly localised to my hands, feet and mouth but I also get blisters on my thighs in summer and around my bra.

It affects my ability to walk. I can physically walk but I can't do so reliably, safely and repeatedly. If I walk too far one day I may not be able to leave the house for days. Walking is painful and I need to use aids to do so - dressings to reduce blistering and dressings to cushion blisters. The blisters are not self limiting like non EB blisters, they grow and grow and need to be lanced, repeatedly, which is bloody painful. I also have to alter my walk to avoid putting pressure on blisters, e.g. walking on the sides of my feet. I have to pace my walking and plan ahead. It's worse in warmer weather. I might fancy a trip to the shops on Sunday, but I have to go to the office on Tuesday and the doctors on Thursday and therefore need to save my feet. I sometimes go a week or more at a time without going out in hot weather.

I claimed PIP, with support from Debra, the charity for people with EB. I supplied a lot of evidence, statements from people who know me, like DH and from my community support worker from Debra. I supplied details of my reasonable adjustments at work, copies of my letters from the Rare Diseases Centre, copies of all my prescriptions etc. I was turned down.

I requested a mandatory reconsideration. The person who looked at it rang me up, clarified a few things with me and later awarded me 2 points for care and 10 for mobility. That means I get lower rate mobility at £26.90 a week.

It's been a god send. I have to wear special (expensive) silver socks in warmer weather. My dressings and creams for my feet mean my socks wear out much faster than normal and need to be replaced often. My footwear choices are limited, can't wear boots etc as not breathable. I basically live in skechers trainers. They wear out much more quickly than normal and need replacing often, partly due to dressings and partly because of my odd gait.

I also need to take buses and taxis for distances most people can walk. PIP means I can 'prove' I'm disabled. I can now get a disabled person's railcard. I can also get a freedom pass from my local authority so my buses, local trains and trams and the tube are now free. I can buy as many shoes etc. as I need without worrying about the costs.

I don't tell people I get PIP and this thread is exactly why. People only see me on my better days, the days I'm housebound for days on end, they don't see. The days I am crying with pain because my feet are dreadful (my record is 16 blisters across both feet, some about the size of a £2 coin and some between my toes). My DH does a lot of errands for me. Sometimes I have to bath as my feet are too bad to permit me to stand in the shower.

But I'm young, I look put together in public and I work full time, mostly from home with occasional days in the office (I have reasonable adjustments for WFH when I need to). So, I'm sure on the surface I look fine and like a piss taker for claiming PIP.

I refer to it as ducks! Lots and lots of paddling underneath the surface by carers ( me in this case) so that the person with disabilities can have as good a life as possible. No duck paddling results in failure and huge problems…. Those people without a duck- dear help them cause the system doesn’t make it easy…

Firstly, I agree whole heartedly that your sister should get POP and it's horrendous that she doesn't.

I just wanted to explain how someone could be in the situation that you described, working full time, going to the pub and get PIP.

My Ds1 has autism. He gets standard rate care and standard rate mobility PIP. He's at college at the moment, studying his obsession so he can do that ok. He could in theory work full time as long as he had breaks to do his obsession during the day. He has to be taken to and from college and everywhere else he goes because he can't cope with public transport. He was invited to someone's birthday celebration last year for the first time since people did whole class parties. This person also has special needs. His dad has to drive him everywhere he goes. I still have to tell him to wash, brush his teeth etc. If he goes somewhere like college he has to be picked up at the exact right time as if his Dad isn't there he will go wandering all over the place trying to find him. He can't remember to charge his phone or take his phone with him by himself. To someone who doesn't know him he looks very independent and not in need of PIP but there is a lot of help going on behind the scenes that most people don't know about.

@Elleherd have you applied for NHS Continuing Care? Daily Blood pressure and heart function monitoring, assessing and treating pressure sores and broken skin and applying dressings, physically moving fluid from you legs with ice and massage, recalibrating devices, assessing and dressing broken skin on your toes are Nursing not social care tasks. If you can't take adequate nutrition until later in the day you are at risk of low blood sugars. You mention you need similar care later in the day. I assume as you have a catheter, dressings and continence aids prescribed you are in touch with the District Nurses - get them to do a screen (you absolutely will screen in for a full assessment) and get legal advice and even representation at the Assessment meeting. CHC (never mind PIP) is exactly for people with needs like yours. Good luck.

I accompanied my relative to an assessment. It was approximately half an hour long and the assessor didn’t examine her physically and actually never touched her. Yet, on the assessment report, there were detailed results of so called physical examination including the degree to which she could bend her knees, flex her hips and rotate her ankles. All of which were noted as normal, despite the fact that she has two congenitally deformed hips and both ankles were surgically fused to stop degeneration due to arthritis, so immovable. The DWP cancelled her tribunal date when they realised she intended to fight all the way, and awarded her the right rate of benefit along with back pay. I think that says it all really.

@Nepmarthiturn i just checked, it is the access to work scheme. I don't know anyone who claims it but I was signposted by my HR director.