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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to take my son into the female changing room?

941 replies

JustKeepSwimmingAlong · 20/11/2023 18:36

I’ve taken my kids swimming tonight, both have separate swimming lessons and I swam with one while the other had theirs. Eldest is male, 9 and has multiple additional needs including ADHD, ASD and some physical disabilities which means he struggles to change himself. Youngest is in nursery so can dress herself but does need supervision. We got out the pool and realised all the changing rooms were full. There were 8 classes on over multiple pools, as well as general swim on at the same time. There’s only two family/accessible changing rooms and the others are all individual. There were literal queues for the large changing rooms.
I then noticed people going out of the group change. I’ve not used it before, but there was a male and a female changing room, so we went in the females. There was no one in it so started laying out the kids clothes and getting them to shower. Got them out the showers and started to get them dressed and people started coming in. There were a couple of mums with young girls and boys, and then a teenager looking girl came in by herself. She immediately came over to tell me that we were in the female room. I explained my son needed help getting changed and the changing rooms were full, but this room had been empty so we’d used it rather than standing wet and cold waiting for a changing room.
We were nearly Finished and my son was fully dressed when she arrived. He sat next to me, facing the wall and we left within a few minutes. During this time, she did get changed, so we didn’t delay her. Now I’m wondering if I was unreasonable?
I don’t want to make anyone uncomfortable, but I really don’t know what else I could have done in the situation? There’s too many classes and too few changing rooms, and we need a larger/accessible one, but they’re the only ones with baby change so they’re really
Popular. The lessons are every week so now I’m wondering what I can do next week? Would I be unreasonable to keep using the group change if there are no other options available?

OP posts:
CrotchetyQuaver · 20/11/2023 23:42

It sounds like it was very busy there. The young girl is entitled to her opinion but by the sound of it the women's communal changing room was not your preferred changing area and you went in there because there wasn't anywhere else free. So it sounds like you dealt with the situation very well in the circumstances

JustKeepSwimmingAlong · 20/11/2023 23:40

@sollenwir ive already said I won’t be doing it again, I did feel uncomfortable and didn’t want to make anyone else feel like their space was invaded. I’ve also explained that there are no signs regarding ages of children allowed in the changing rooms so I had no way of knowing the 7/8 year old age that others have mentioned on here. I’ve been reading all the comments and whilst I understand where you’re coming from, and have agreed that I won’t do it again, I think you’re being a bit harsh on this comment? I wasn’t sure about the rules, I was in a very difficult situation, I’ve asked for advice and agreed to take it on board and to change my plan for the future

OP posts:
TomeTome · 20/11/2023 23:39

CremeEggSupremacy · 20/11/2023 23:31

OP absolutely knows she could and should have left when the girl spoke up and likely came on here to hope everyone said it’s fine.

The way I read it she’d got her boy dressed and was quickly finishing up with her other child and presumably her own clothes. Then left smartly but is concerned about it.

@sollenwir You've chosen one quote. Overall her comments look like she feels justified and wants us to agree. subsequent posts didn’t read like that to me. The “one quote” is a chunk of the original post.

sollenwir · 20/11/2023 23:33

TomeTome · 20/11/2023 23:29

From @JustKeepSwimmingAlong ‘s opening post
Now I’m wondering if I was unreasonable?
I don’t want to make anyone uncomfortable, but I really don’t know what else I could have done in the situation?

does this really sound like someone who thinks they found a good solution?

You've chosen one quote. Overall her comments look like she feels justified and wants us to agree.

CormorantStrikesBack · 20/11/2023 23:33

JustKeepSwimmingAlong · 20/11/2023 23:18

No, to make a reasonable adjustment the school allow him to wear his PE kit all day when he has PE so he doesn’t have to change :)

My question wasn’t to you. I already knew your ds has additional needs.

sollenwir · 20/11/2023 23:31

CormorantStrikesBack · 20/11/2023 23:29

Exactly. Someone else said they were.

I mentioned small child in relation to smaller children being allowed in opposite sex changing rooms. I don't think 9 is a small child, though there can be a lot of variety in a ability at that age.

CormorantStrikesBack · 20/11/2023 23:31

Robinni · 20/11/2023 23:27

@CormorantStrikesBack

9 year old autistics usually have the reasonable adjustment that they arrive into school in PE gear and do not get changed out of it.

In fact many schools now have all the kids in the class follow this, for ease of time and so that those with reasonable adjustments don’t stand out.

I wasn’t talking about kids with additional needs. I was responding to a comment where someone said 9yos needed to be with their parents. Generally they don’t. Obviously kids with special needs are an exception but ime there are a lot (not all) older kids in the changing rooms who this doesn’t apply to. Yes, I know not all disabilities are visible, etc , but these are kids and their parents who I know.

CremeEggSupremacy · 20/11/2023 23:31

TomeTome · 20/11/2023 23:29

From @JustKeepSwimmingAlong ‘s opening post
Now I’m wondering if I was unreasonable?
I don’t want to make anyone uncomfortable, but I really don’t know what else I could have done in the situation?

does this really sound like someone who thinks they found a good solution?

OP absolutely knows she could and should have left when the girl spoke up and likely came on here to hope everyone said it’s fine.

sollenwir · 20/11/2023 23:29

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She took a male, above the allowed age, into a female only changing area.

TomeTome · 20/11/2023 23:29

sollenwir · 20/11/2023 23:22

I haven't once dismissed or ignored the plight, because it's a really important issue!
All Ihave said is that taking males above 7/8 into female spaces is never the answer.
Also, I'm not sure OP does know it wasn't a good solution, because she's only really tried to justify it and not taken on board how it's really not a good idea (so far at least).

From @JustKeepSwimmingAlong ‘s opening post
Now I’m wondering if I was unreasonable?
I don’t want to make anyone uncomfortable, but I really don’t know what else I could have done in the situation?

does this really sound like someone who thinks they found a good solution?

CormorantStrikesBack · 20/11/2023 23:29

caringcarer · 20/11/2023 23:23

A 9 year old is not a small child.

Exactly. Someone else said they were.

CormorantStrikesBack · 20/11/2023 23:28

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Yes but the teachers aren't generally helping the kids get changed. So they manage. Any other fear is hysteria over sexual assaults/paedophiles stalking changing rooms.

sollenwir · 20/11/2023 23:27

TomeTome · 20/11/2023 23:23

Many parents do go in to help on PE day and some children have TAs and some wear their PE clothes all day as a reasonable adjustment. Most of us would much prefer our children could manage without that help.

Sorry just to clarify, I was referring more to the helicopter parents who fuss unnecessarily over kids who are actually fairly able to change themselves, not the SEN parents who are worrying that their child is getting enough support to do PE at all, and wish they could make things easier for them.

Robinni · 20/11/2023 23:27

CormorantStrikesBack · 20/11/2023 23:17

Would you go into school and help your 9yo get changed for PE?

@CormorantStrikesBack

9 year old autistics usually have the reasonable adjustment that they arrive into school in PE gear and do not get changed out of it.

In fact many schools now have all the kids in the class follow this, for ease of time and so that those with reasonable adjustments don’t stand out.

aibupregnancy · 20/11/2023 23:26

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Gotosleepnow2023 · 20/11/2023 23:25

All that happened was that you tried to look after your son, you did what you thought was sensible at the time. A girl pointed out that it made her uncomfortable, which is completely fair enough, but was never your intention. Now you feel bad and you're reflecting on it so that you don't upset anyone again. You were a normal mum in a difficult situation, we've all been there and have had to adapt. You'll do it differently next time and find a solution. Sounds entirely reasonable to me!

sollenwir · 20/11/2023 23:25

Robinni · 20/11/2023 23:23

I’m wondering would we all be discussing this with the same strength of feeling if we weren’t facing a trans invasion currently?

Fair point to say, are we as women now hyper vigilant and more uncompromising regarding female only spaces because of the aggression we are facing regarding opening them to those born biological males?

10-15 years ago I think we would have been compassionate to OP and have been supporting her to seek a better solution.

But instead she is facing wrath which feels misdirected. I.E. a disabled child and their mother are facing extreme and disproportionate ridicule on account of aggressive adult male actions in the wider debate.

Mind you 10-15 yrs ago disabled rights and accessibility was piss poor, so at least OP stands a chance of having her DS’s needs met.

Swings and roundabouts.

My feelings are purely based on a male being in a female only space he shouldn't be in, and that more proper accessible spaces should be provided/not abused by others.

aibupregnancy · 20/11/2023 23:25

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caringcarer · 20/11/2023 23:23

CormorantStrikesBack · 20/11/2023 23:17

Would you go into school and help your 9yo get changed for PE?

A 9 year old is not a small child.

sollenwir · 20/11/2023 23:23

TomeTome · 20/11/2023 23:21

Your problem should not be made to be other people’s problem. you really don’t understand or practice inclusion do you?

Well inclusion isn't forcing males into female spaces.......

Robinni · 20/11/2023 23:23

I’m wondering would we all be discussing this with the same strength of feeling if we weren’t facing a trans invasion currently?

Fair point to say, are we as women now hyper vigilant and more uncompromising regarding female only spaces because of the aggression we are facing regarding opening them to those born biological males?

10-15 years ago I think we would have been compassionate to OP and have been supporting her to seek a better solution.

But instead she is facing wrath which feels misdirected. I.E. a disabled child and their mother are facing extreme and disproportionate ridicule on account of aggressive adult male actions in the wider debate.

Mind you 10-15 yrs ago disabled rights and accessibility was piss poor, so at least OP stands a chance of having her DS’s needs met.

Swings and roundabouts.

TomeTome · 20/11/2023 23:23

sollenwir · 20/11/2023 23:18

I think some parents might, given the chance, that doesn't make it right though.

Many parents do go in to help on PE day and some children have TAs and some wear their PE clothes all day as a reasonable adjustment. Most of us would much prefer our children could manage without that help.

aibupregnancy · 20/11/2023 23:22

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sollenwir · 20/11/2023 23:22

TomeTome · 20/11/2023 23:18

No it’s not ableist to say that but it is ableist to totally ignore the plight of disabled boys and young men and their female carers. OP knows it wasn’t a good solution. Huffing and puffing about her poor choices isn’t helping it’s just ignoring the challenge she faced.

I haven't once dismissed or ignored the plight, because it's a really important issue!
All Ihave said is that taking males above 7/8 into female spaces is never the answer.
Also, I'm not sure OP does know it wasn't a good solution, because she's only really tried to justify it and not taken on board how it's really not a good idea (so far at least).

caringcarer · 20/11/2023 23:21

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No, the female should use the female space. Let the male use a toilet.

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