DS keeps being moved at school

It's a kind of cognitive bias I think. Partly confirmation bias - you notice things that confirm your initial impression about a child, you fail to notice things that disagree. Partly interpretation - a child is assumed to be asking questions because they weren't listening not because they didn't understand, they're assumed to be asking for the loo because they didn't go at break and not because they have an upset stomach, if they're smiling when you turn around it is assumed they were the instigator of the disruption, not being amused along with everyone else by someone else clowning. And partly in a busy classroom filling in the gaps in what you actually saw with what you were expecting to see.

I've seen this with one of DD's teachers. Fortunately DD wasn't her target - indeed when DD was upset about the shouting she even said to her "but I'd never raise my voice at /you/ DD".

In support of teachers disliking certain kids. I was a good pupil, polite, keen and well behaved. Between the ages of 11 and 14 I was hated by a teacher. It was worse in my second year at senior school...He was head of year. I could do nothing right. He even accused me of punching someone when I clearly was no where near. Thankfully he did not teach me directly. But my school report from teachers he had influence over were poor, to the extent that my tutor took me to one side and asked what was going on as it didn't seem possible that I could behave and perform that badly.
Thankfully my parents, whilst wanting me to do well, really didn't care about formal education. Despite being English neither really went to school in the 1940s...in fact dad only went for 3 days and was illiterate. He was sick as a child and not expected to love live long so his mum thought it would be a waste of time to send him
I later found out that my dad's younger brother who did go to school regularly, was such a shit in senior school (the same one I went to 20 years later) that he caused that teacher so much grief that he left the profession for a couple of years...unfortunately he came back to the same school and wouldn't believe I wasn't the same as my uncle. Thankfully I am very thick skinned and it didn't affect me....in fact I found it hilarious when uncle told me about it!

In my experience working in numerous schools that has never been the case. Each school I have worked in has had a very detailed behaviour policy which is followed for the vast majority of children, regardless of how supportive or unsupportive their parents are. Those who a general behaviour policy does not work for will have an individual behaviour plan that is bespoke to their needs and that is followed.

Schools also have strict recording systems for behaviour incidents that is usually triggered after a certain level - eg 2 warnings or moved within the classroom would not need to be logged as it is a behaviour management strategy, whereas a child continuing negative behaviours to the point of being asked to leave the classroom would be considered a consequence and therefore logged/parents informed.

I suggest you read what I’m saying.

Kids of parents who are supportive are more likely to be blamed for things than those of difficult parents. I have experienced this.

I am struggling what is hard to understand about that.

It really doesn’t help anyone with discipline at all.

You disagree with what? Parents not ever accepting that their kids might be at fault makes it impossible for schools to enforce discipline, what is it you disagree with about that?

Parents like this this one will think it's their child that has that teacher from the 5% you mention, as that is more palatable than looking critically at their own childs behaviour. It's a shame because it makes schools pretty impotent in dealing with behaviour and that's to the detriment of every other child and their learning. Edited

As a parent I disagree.

Schools shy away from disciplining the kids of parents who think they do no wrong. Instead they blame the kid whose parent will be supportive. It makes their lives easier.

DD2 was once told when complaining the child of a nightmare parent had scratched her (and there were marks) that she must have done it to herself. Dd1 had also witnessed it 🤷🏻‍♀️. A lot of school staff are scared of these parents and other families and children suffer.

My DD (8 at the time) was 100% targeted by a teacher so to say it's patently ridiculous to think it happens is, well, patently ridiculous. I still have no idea why my DD was targeted. She was a model student, one of the top students academically and very much a people pleaser back then. But she was belittled constantly. We ended up moving her and the teacher in question was "asked to leave" a year later. I don't know why but I can only assume she'd chosen another child to pick in when we left

So this was recently, in the UK? She screamed in the face of a parent for 5 mins while a bunch of parents watched through the window? What did you and the other parents do? And how did you find out she didn't like pupils different hair colours?

*Mswest · Today 07:42

A teacher screamed in your face for 5 minutes? While a crowd of parents watched from the window? And was treating your child badly because of the colour of their hair? Is this a serious post?*

This was the first interaction I had with her. At this point I didn’t know about her hating ds. I knew she had a reputation of flying off the handle. I wasn’t the only parent she had screamed at

Absolutely deadly serious post

Interesting that as a teacher you can’t accept that there are people in your profession who aren’t nice people

Just because you haven’t witnessed anything (although I don’t see how you could unless you teach alongside them in the same room everyday) doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen

A teacher screamed in your face for 5 minutes? While a crowd of parents watched from the window? And was treating your child badly because of the colour of their hair? Is this a serious post?

*Mswest · Yesterday 06:37

I've taught for 14 years and I've seen no evidence of that. To think teachers go into work everyday and single out a random 5 year old to be mean to just seems patently ridiculous tbh. it might have happened in the past but it just wouldn't fly now at all. However this way of thinking from parents is why it's becoming increasingly difficult to deal with actual bullies alongside any other poor behaviour. Parents like this this one will think it's their child that has that teacher from the 5% you mention, as that is more palatable than looking critically at their own childs behaviour. It's a shame because it makes schools pretty impotent in dealing with behaviour and that's to the detriment of every other child and their learning. Edited*

How would you know if any of your colleagues are singling out one child and making their life hell. I presume you are in a different classroom to your colleagues

The teacher who was sending ds out of the classroom each day spent at least 5 solid minutes at one point screaming at me after I returned to the classroom because ds had brought out spellings to learn that were for the top set of pupils (Geography, Dictionary Encyclopaedia etc) and ds who struggled with reading and writing got three and four letter words to learn

I was going to say that there had been a mistake and ds had picked up the wrong spellings but didn’t get beyond the word mistake before she flew at me.
She screamed shouted and spit at me not pausing for breath for a good 5 minutes
I tuned her out and stood there inspecting her teeth and watching the spit spring out of her mouth and watching the crowd form out side the classroom window
When she finally ran out of steam/ finished her diatribe the upshot was that ds had to learn those spellings as she hadn’t made a mistake

The children who this teacher singled out hated a certain hair colour.
Friends dd who was one of her victims with the sane hair colour as ds was YB is teachers victim the previous year
Friends dd was the bright sensible girl im the class
This girl ended up being upset every single day and went from loving school to hating it

I’m glad you have spoken to the teacher OP but I agree you need to engage with her more and try to find out what is going on and establish a line of communication.
No-one actually knows what is going on here, whether your son is struggling with normal discipline or whether the teacher is singling him out above others.
You are your child’s only advocate though and if he has gone from bright and happy to not wanting to attend school this needs your help to resolve. Some posters are labelling a young child as a rude boy instead of suggesting helping him recognise his non response to the teacher is a rude action and one he does need to change.
I hope you resolve this quickly as it can be incredibly hard to go into work if you feel your boss dislikes you never mind as a small child!
I’ve had amazing and inspiring teachers but I’ve also had one teacher who took against me and made me feel sick with fear and helplessness.

I would assume that in the few cases where teachers bully particular students, they're not chosen at random, or even consciously chosen at all. There's just something about the victim that bothers them, whether body type, personality type, race, sexual orientation, etc. At least, that's how most bullies I've seen operate. I've also seen situations where multiple siblings go through a school one after the other, and one disruptive sibling ruins it for the others.

I would agree with you it probably happens much less than in the past. Even when I was in school (mid 2000s), there was a lot more teaching through fear, yelling, naming and shaming students, etc. than would be acceptable now. Of course, some of those teachers had been there long enough that they had, decades before, inflicted corporal punishment on students. It was always funny seeing the parents who had also attended the school acting nervous around Mr. Stevens, the assistant principal. Back in the 1970s he had been the gym teacher; the sad business of thrashing students had fallen to him.

OP I’d give DS a chance to settle in; it’s early in the term plus it’s a big jump from 1-2 and a new teacher is a big change after having the same one for 2 years. He is going to naturally focus on the teacher as the cause of his upset but there could be more factors at play.

My personal opinion is that you are also overreacting slightly. I do think some kids are wrapped up in cotton wool and parents place unrealistic expectations upon teachers to never do anything to upset their precious little ones. Life is often unfair and kids need to learn this: your son getting the blame for a misbehaving incident in which he was involved but was not the ringleader is a very minor thing and needs to be shrugged off rather than held up as abject unfairness.

But they start nursery they same time as ours

My DH boss was German and his DS was 2 weeks younger than DD. He didnt start infant school until my DD was year 2 , so same age as the OP's son.
He had a lot of problems settling in because he went from playing all day in nursery, to a far more formal setting than DD's year 2.
He was expected to mature over night , where as DD's experience of school was a very much gentler approach , with a gradual expectation of maturity.

This.

Am wondering if the OP will change their name or whether in 7 or 8 years we will start seeing messages from them wondering why their teenager is a nightmare and no good with authority

I've taught for 14 years and I've seen no evidence of that. To think teachers go into work everyday and single out a random 5 year old to be mean to just seems patently ridiculous tbh. it might have happened in the past but it just wouldn't fly now at all. However this way of thinking from parents is why it's becoming increasingly difficult to deal with actual bullies alongside any other poor behaviour. Parents like this this one will think it's their child that has that teacher from the 5% you mention, as that is more palatable than looking critically at their own childs behaviour. It's a shame because it makes schools pretty impotent in dealing with behaviour and that's to the detriment of every other child and their learning.

I'm sure it "generally" doesn't happen in the sense that 95 percent of teachers have no desire to single out particular students. But it also means that in the context of an entire country, it's going to occur often enough that students are likely to encounter at least one such teacher in the course of a school career.

Bullies are unfortunately to be found in all sectors of society, and I see no reason schoolteachers would be an exception to that. In fact, I would expect any latent bullying tendencies a person had to be more visible in a situation where an adult is powered to act "in loco parentis" over a child, since bullies thrive on power imbalances.

I'm a secondary teacher (and parent), wait to hear from the school before coming to any conclusions, because often parents get told a very different version of events from their little cherubs and this is normal. What you do know so far is that he's been rude to the teacher in front of you at least once, was misbehaving in the bus Q, and has been moved seats several times. This tbh sounds very much like your son is not behaving well, and obviously there might be reasons for this. But please don't be one of those parents that bizarrely assume teachers choose a child randomly to pick on -this generally doesn't happen. I find parents are increasingly willing to accept anything other than their child being at fault and seem to have an automatic suspicion / hostility towards schools.

If your child behaves rudely to a teacher in front of you, I wonder how he behaves when you're not around.
Especially as he grows older.
Discipline begins at home.
Might be low level now but if he knows you don't call him up on being rude, you'll have some interesting teenage years to deal with.

Some teachers think that by giving the naughty or disruptive children constant rewards, such as star of the week helps with their behaviour.
Unfortunately, it rarely does, and just upsets the kids that are good.

And why didn't you tell him that he was rude when ignoring his teacher? If he's not learning how to be polite from you, then why not?

Presumably most of these people send their kids to rough schools.

Star of the week at my children’s school is just that. Obviously everyone gets it at some point, but it is most usually given to the very bright and very well behaved children or children who have made a real effort with their work.

Don’t let these people make you question your child’s achievements.

Also, in regards to it being petty to discipline a child over kicking a paper towel, teachers have to have higher expectations than parents.

if you’ve ever found it completely draining/exhausting to discipline your 2 or 3 children at home, can you imagine how difficult it is to keep 29 (in my case) of them in line, AND try to teach them things at the same time!!

I’m a yr 2 teacher this year and I’ve been a Primary School teacher for 15 years. It is possible that she doesn’t like him and is showing it in her behaviour but Id have to say it’s much much more likely that he’s being a pest. Nursery and yr 1 tend to be largely play based. Yr 2 tends to be when “real work” starts. More writing. Higher expectations.

I try not to judge parents from these little snapshots but when you said you let your child ignore the teacher when she spoke to him it kind of says it all for me. I’m a pretty forgiving teacher, i don’t shout, I don’t think im regarded as strict but if a child ignored me in the playground at 9am, I’d bring it up once we were in the classroom and use it as a teaching point about manners (obviously different for non neurotypical children)
The behaviour iN schools has declined pretty rapidly and a huge part of it is because parents will not let their children be sad, will not accept that their children misbehave when they’re not there and will not support schools in discipline.

My advice would be to go and have a chat with the teacher but be prepared to hear things you might not like.

It’s always tough to balance listening to your child against not indulging them - sounds like you are doing a good job and handled the meeting with the teacher well . Wishing you and your family the best these situations are stressful.