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Original poster

Creating boundaries with pupil

171 replies

Soggywetleaves · 23/10/2023 09:53

I do private tutoring and one of my pupils is a 12 year old girl, she’s lovely but very anxious about her homework and getting everything right. I go to her home twice per week at set times to help with her homework.
She’s quite disorganised and often loses text books and doesn’t know when her homework needs to be in by.
A couple of times she has Whatsapped me in a panic, often late at night, because she has realised she has homework to be in the next day. I’ve helped her by going through the work etc, but I’ve said she needs to send me the homework on the day she gets it so that we can go through it during the lessons.
Yesterday afternoon she messaged me in a panic again, with four pages of maths homework, I said to her I was away for the weekend and would be happy to go through it with her tomorrow during our lesson (I wasn’t away, but was having a lazy afternoon doing Halloween crafts & baking with my 5 year old, plus making a roast etc)
She melt whatsapping me saying she’d really appreciate any help at all etc. I felt bad so gave it a couple of hours then started writing out all the explanations for the sums and examples etc. It took me a couple of hours, in between cooking and so on. I sent it all, told her I was doing my Dds bath and bedtime and said we’d go through it further at her lesson tomorrow. I sorted Dd and got into bed later-9 ish and she texted me her answers for me to look at, she did well but some corrections which I had to correct and text back and explain to her etc. This went on for a couple of hours, then she had finished, she was very grateful and thanked me. I’m happy to help her, but not great with boundaries and can find it hard to say no to things.
Dh says I must draw a line on this or if I’m happy to do it, to at least say I want to be paid for it?
Would you expect to be paid for this, would you say no to this?
They pay very well for lessons, I enjoy the job and helping her so don’t want to lose the work, but I’ve never had this situation before
What would you do?

OP posts:
AGAbaker · 23/10/2023 11:06

I'd speak to her parents. It's up to them to organise her or not, as they see fit.

LakeTiticaca · 23/10/2023 11:04

DH is correct. You need to step back and put some firm boundaries is place.
Tell them you will mute WhatsApp at certain times and won't respond to messages

ElTingo · 23/10/2023 11:03

Agree with pp this is bonkers.

I likely have undiagnosed adhd and this is how I operated in my school years- last minute panicking/ disorganised. I didn't have any help but had to be accountable for my actions towards gcse/ a levels/ uni. My 8yo daughter is showing very similar traits. This girls sounds similar.

You have to put in the boundaries for both of you- for your own safety if nothing else. I'd explain the difficulties to her parents and say the organisation needs to be in place before the tutoring will work. If you are happy to have some study skills as part of the tutoring - fine but make it official and charge for it - e.g. you have a prep session the day she gets the homework - she then does it and you do another session after she's completed it checking the answers and correcting any wrong answers.

I feel sorry for the girl and she needs help not you enabling the chaos. I say that as someone who is no stranger to chaos!

This is a parenting matter to me, but the parents make lack the skills themselves to organise/ scaffold her.

ittakes2 · 23/10/2023 11:02

I think you need to raise with her parents that she needs to be assessed for inattentive adhd - very common in girls and goes missed but mostly shows up at the start of high school when they need their exec functions

Seaweed42 · 23/10/2023 11:01

Are you planning to keep helping her for her remaining years at school?

It sounds like you are doing the homework for her.
She should be attempting her homework on her own first.

Her results are going to give a false impression of what's really going on.
In the long run it won't help her.

If she's 12 and losing books and cannot manage the work in school, AND doesn't know when it's due then she needs an assessment for ADHD or something.

Has she not got a Homework Journal where she write in when the work is due?

This method is only feeding into her anxiety to get everything right.

Original poster
Soggywetleaves · 23/10/2023 10:59

@blahblahblurgh I think without me there to guide at all, she’ll become completely lost, I’m not sure mum will step up to help, she’s hiring me for this reason, to take care of it all. As I say, I do need the work, they do pay well, so as bonkers as the situation is, I’m willing to accept some situations out of the norm, but I want to be paid accordingly in that case.

OP posts:
Original poster
Soggywetleaves · 23/10/2023 10:57

I’ve never had this situation before with tutoring and never contacted with work outside hours etc.
I don’t want to go into too many details here, but it’s a different situation, her parents are wealthy and often not present and other issues. Parents are separated and father much more organised and reasonable, he also pays me, so would be the one to approach.

OP posts:
blahblahblurgh · 23/10/2023 10:56

Soggywetleaves · 23/10/2023 10:19

@eish Its via the mum first of all…her phone and WhatsApp messages, I send the work to her with explanations and presumably the mum passes it to her for her to send me her work etc.
I’ve said to the parents that she needs to find/re order these texts books and organise her homework so she knows when it has to be in by and so I can prepare it to do in the lessons.

If her mum sees you as the solution to her daughter being so disorganised, instead of getting her daughter to do it properly, there is literally no point. I think you need to cut the cord on this and find someone who pays you for the work you do and doesn't ruin your evening with your kid

blahblahblurgh · 23/10/2023 10:54

Soggywetleaves · 23/10/2023 10:16

She also texted one day during the day with a list of things she needed to study for a Science test. I spent a few hours at home going through it and preparing work for her to revise and sent it via her parents. Would you charge for this also or count that as part of lesson planning? I feel the lines are getting blurred here, Dh and my DDad (formally a lecturer) say I should charge

I can see why they hire you 🙄🙄🙄 work out what your actual hourly rate is and see if you're happy with it

blahblahblurgh · 23/10/2023 10:52

You absolutely have to stop this. It's bad for you and it's bad for her too. She doesn't have to learn good time management and work habits because you keep saving her. For a start, she is actually supposed to be doing this work by herself- how are her teachers supposed to know she can't do it? They are just seeing the fact you know how to do it. Her parents also are getting mislead as to how well she is doing and how capable she is. On top of that- this is crazy to work this much for free. Write out a message you can send her each time like "I'd love to help but I can't right now. Have a go and try your best. We can look over it again in our next lesson" and just repeatedly send her that every time she asks.

EatYourVegetables · 23/10/2023 10:52

You are neither helping her learn maths, nor helping her learn to plan and be responsible. The kindest thing to do is to learn to say no.

“Sorry, I am not able to help now. I will be happy to go over it on Wednesday.”

To both her and her parents.

waterrat · 23/10/2023 10:52

And pls ignore posters who say you cant invoice as it wasnt discussed first ! That is just nonsense. They use your time as a professional the onus is on them to have checked your rate first.

waterrat · 23/10/2023 10:51

You are being seriously taken advantage of op

But why do you even respond at 10pm?

You are acting like this girls parent for no reason at all. Puttting aside the money you need to just state clearly you dont want to be contacted outside working hours and wonr be available unless booked in advance

eish · 23/10/2023 10:51

The poster above who suggested putting in organisation strategies above is right.

if she doesn’t send you her homework in day it is set you can’t help her. Ask her parents to support her on this, the poor girl sounds like her parents have just washed their hands of her but they can at least do this one thing.

LIZS · 23/10/2023 10:50

You need to block her and insist all communication is via parents at appropriate times. Are you charging extra, that might focus their attention. Also perhaps your sessions need to include time management for the week ahead and study skills to avoid last minute crises.

savethebling · 23/10/2023 10:50

waterrat · 23/10/2023 10:48

Hi Op im self employed and this is bonkers

First step. Send a polite email to the parents being clear and honest. Include an invoice for the work you have done outside set hours

State clearly you are not available to help outside the tutor hours going forward. If you want to offer flexibility say you may be available but will need to agree in advance and it will be billed at an hourly rate

This is actually one of the most bonkers things ive read on here and that is sayinf something

You are doing this child no favourite by skivvying for her and you are working woth no boundaries at all.

This exactly.

TheLongGloriesOfTheWinterMoon · 23/10/2023 10:49

Unfortunately, that's often what tutees and their families expect from you. And the student having your contact details has exacerbated the situation. (happens to me too)

Not sure that you'll have a contract saying that you'll have the right to bill for any communication you've willingly entered into above and beyond the contracted lesson hours.

What you need to do is speak to the parents, and establish some rules moving forward. That you'll be prepared to do extra tutoring (in presence, online, or even via WA) but they need to book it in advance, and they will be billed for it.

Tutoring/safeguarding is very different to "normal" teacher/student safeguarding and what you're describing isn't and wouldn't be, a safeguarding issue. (I'm DSL at school)

Good luck!

Original poster
Soggywetleaves · 23/10/2023 10:49

I definitely have an issue with saying no, I’m aware I need to work on this. Although it’s not an ideal situation, given the right pay, I’m willing to do it.
I need to work out charges for working outside of set hours and last minute and present it to them.

OP posts:
savethebling · 23/10/2023 10:49

You need to put clear boundaries in place. Don't reply at weekends or evenings and have a chat with her parents explaining when your working hours are and how/when you'll respond to these requests. If you start replying outside of normal hours it's a slippery slope and doesn't demonstrate good boundaries to her.

Hankunamatata · 23/10/2023 10:49

Send the parent a message saying any help outside of tutor sessions via online will be billed by x amount per 10mins and invoice will be given at the end of the week

waterrat · 23/10/2023 10:48

Hi Op im self employed and this is bonkers

First step. Send a polite email to the parents being clear and honest. Include an invoice for the work you have done outside set hours

State clearly you are not available to help outside the tutor hours going forward. If you want to offer flexibility say you may be available but will need to agree in advance and it will be billed at an hourly rate

This is actually one of the most bonkers things ive read on here and that is sayinf something

You are doing this child no favourite by skivvying for her and you are working woth no boundaries at all.

Cosyblankets · 23/10/2023 10:46

Soggywetleaves · 23/10/2023 10:37

@Whitepeacelily I wasn’t consulted either though…one night it was 10 pm, I was relaxing watching Netflix after a long day with my Dd and was expected to send work/help on fractions 😩

Just don't reply

ManateeFair · 23/10/2023 10:45

Soggywetleaves · 23/10/2023 10:37

@Whitepeacelily I wasn’t consulted either though…one night it was 10 pm, I was relaxing watching Netflix after a long day with my Dd and was expected to send work/help on fractions 😩

You are only being 'expected' to this because you keep agreeing to it, FFS!!

Stop being so bloody wet about this. Tutoring is your business, ffs, these people aren't your friends. You don't have to do anything you're not being paid for. You need to have clear terms set out with the parents that explains what they get for the money they pay you and what they don't, and how much extra they need to pay if they want ad-hoc services from you.

For all this kid's parents know, you could have been at the cinema or asleep or driving or something at 10pm at night, with your phone muted. They are letting their daughter message you on the off-chance that you're available.. You do not have to BE available.

Original poster
Soggywetleaves · 23/10/2023 10:44

I asked her to send me the homework she receives ahead of time so that I can prepare the lessons with extra examples to go through etc.
She really struggles with maths and has tests coming up soon and has asked for support with revising etc

How much extra per hour would you put if it’s last minute/weekend/outside normal working hours?

I do need the money so I’m ok to do it occasionally, but obviously only paid! I don’t want to rock the boat and risk losing the work to someone who perhaps would be more than willing it do it, given the current financial climate.

OP posts:
eish · 23/10/2023 10:42

You shouldn’t be preparing king documents of examples. If you do agree with advice support then have an online session and tell her how to solve the problems. No prep required and she does the main work, not you. Charge more for ad hoc sessions and state never after 8pm and not Sundays (as an example).

I also don’t know why you helped her when you told her you were away. If you say you are not available you are not available.