Alcohol question

A normal relationship with alcohol and a healthy relationship with alcohol are two different things unfortunately. Consistently driving over the weekly recommended limit is extremely common, although many people might have a drink most evenings, or two or three but only at weekends - which could put them over the 14 unit recommendation very easily, without the amount creeping up and without taking risks like drink driving or having their day-to-day functioning impaired. They will be increasing their risks of alcohol related illnesses though.
I like to think I have a pretty healthy relationship with alcohol. I don’t have a drink every day. I do have a drink or two on social occasions and sometimes at home in the evenings. I might drink something 3 days out of 7, having either one or two drinks. So I probably drink 6-10 units most weeks. Probably be better if I cut it down to just the social occasions and had one drink then switched to non alcoholic ones 🤷‍♀️. Someone teetotal might look at me and say ´oh she drinks quite a lot/quite often’. A lot of people who like a drink might say that I hardly drink at all because I don’t binge drink and I have lots of alcohol free days.

Drink driving is the absolute red line for me. There's no going back from that, and if he tries to excuse it or minimise, or make out you're overreacting, that would be the end of the relationship, no question at all. Nothing short of admitting that he has a huge problem and accepting that it's time to do everything he can to tackle it (which would look like AA attendance or something similar) would salvage the relationship after that. There is no doubt at all that his drinking is problematic, and needs to be addressed, no matter whether he sees it that way or not. It's a problem for society.

My dd passed her driving test last month, and the thought of her being out on the road with selfish, arrogant arses like that makes my blood run cold. I don't give a toss whether it interferes with his working or not. It's not okay.

A couple sharing a bottle of wine a night and maybe a full bottle at the weekend is fine. If they can afford to and its not impacting anybody else. And I'm assuming half a bottle of wine isn't getting anybody drunk.
I don't really drink anymore as I can't handle the headache the next day. And when you've got kids, you kind of need to be 'ready to roll' in an emergency and be able to wake up fresh the next day. So I'm probably the most unhealthy of drinkers, as I'll have the odd night out and drink too much.
I do think having to drink everyday, is unhealthy. But then I also think anybody over 25, regularly drinking with the intention of getting drunk has a problem.

Its just they make me feel like im making something out of nothing. I feel like im going mad. I feel like im the problem. They say they dont have a problem/not an alcoholic and others drink as much. Thats why im trying to find out whats normal

Do not get caught up in a discussion about how much alcohol makes someone an alcoholic. It's not how much someone drinks that makes somone an alcoholic. The inability to stop drinking or control how much they drink once they start is much more indicative. Some alcoholics are binge drinkers and don't drink everyday to start with but often the binges get longer and the breaks between get shorter.

He is drink driving, hiding alcohol and gaslighting you. All of these things suggest he has a problem with alcohol.

BUT

The real issue here is that the amount of alcohol consumed and the behaviour around it it unacceptable to you. You do not need to establish that the person you are writing about is an alcoholic to justify ending a relationship. They do not think they have a problem which means nothing will change and they will continue to lie to you.

You have to decide if you are willing to put up with that. I wouldn't, he makes you feel like you are going mad and you are here trying to determine what normal drinking is to find out if perhaps he's right. Do you really want to be with someone like that?

If he does 'give up' you'll have to be on the lookout for secret drinking. Even though my mum hasn't drunk in over a year I still have a little search round when I visit in case (I stay with my young children and we won't stay in her house if she has access to alcohol). The back of cupboard, behind things, boot of car, the garage etc

Your husband will feel that his drinking is normal because his behaviour is normal for his family, but that doesn't mean it's right.
You have to look forward to when your children are adults. Do you want them to grow up to be heavy drinkers?

My mum is an alcoholic and her intake crept up. She was 'functioning' for many years but that functionality was reducing all the time. She doesn't drink now but only because she's got Korsakoffs. I remember for years being able to tell straight away if she'd started drinking for the day and it has ruined so many occasions for me.

If this is something you haven't discussed before I'd give them one chance and if they don't stop then put your children first. Living with an alcoholic is awful.

Have you thought about going to Al-anon OP? It's for families of those with an alcohol problem.

You mention kids. Kids who live with an alcoholic are much more likely to grow up to become alcoholics themselves.

That's a problem. My dad is an alcoholic. He drinks about 5 beers a day.

He’s probably over the alcohol limit in the mornings still when he’s driving.
Your liver can process one unit of alcohol in around an hour, 1,5 hours to be safe (the exact rate depends on things like body size and sex and so varies between individuals). If he’s drinking 19units between say, 6pm and midnight, he’s still got 6units or so in his system at 7am the next morning.

STBXH is/was similar. Minimum 2 pints a night, usually more, weekends it would be pints and cans etc. probably easily hitting around 50units per week. He never saw a problem, kept telling me I was making a big deal over nothing. It's ok and normal to be having 2 pints a night, I should be grateful he's drinking at home as he could be in the pub every evening instead. And yes he would drink drive too (adamant that 1 and half pints would make him under the limit, and would frequently drink more if I wasn't around). It was gradually getting worse and his personality changed, and was becoming increasingly paranoid too.

Leaving is the best thing I did. I'm so a peace now. You can't help someone who doesn't see a problem with their behaviour. Look after yourself first

19.6 units the night before an early morning drive to work is way too much. If he's having this amount regularly then, yes, I would think it's an issue.

I hardly drink alcohol at all now due to a heart condition and, with hindsight, I probably did drink too much previously. I agree with challenging him to do an alcohol free month, even a week, if he can't manage that then there's definitely a dependancy.

I would like to end our relationship but he keeps saying that i need to give him the chance to change things, whilst sitting drinking a beer 😒

He has no intention of changing. That's very clear from what you said upthread about him denying he's got a problem and saying you're only making a fuss about it because you don't drink. He's just hoping that if he says 'Give me a chance to change things' you'll shut up about it and let him get on with his drinking in peace. I'm sure you're not naïve enough to fall for that line.

He's definitely has alcohol issues OP.

Only a matter of time before he crashes and kills innocent people.

Of course he's always going to deny it though.

I don't live in the uk. It's usual here to drink every day. Not a lot but at least a glass of wine

Many drink much more and seem perfectly OK. If it's affecting work, relationships, etc then it's a problem

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/alcohol-misuse/

NHS recommends no more than 14 units a week, spread over at least 3 days, with multiple alcohol free days per week.
The person you describe is likely drinking 6-15 units on weeknights and more at weekends. (Units estimated from the NHS link here https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/alcohol-advice/calculating-alcohol-units/)
I’d call it a serious alcohol problem.

Definitely a problem

@PumkinPetra unfortunately making excuses and denial are very typical behaviours of someone who has problems with alcohol (the first of the 12 steps of recovery is accepting you have a problem)
Making an effort to conceal the fact they’ve been drinking by hiding bottles and cans is also a bad sign
If someone can’t or won’t even give up alcohol for a month then I would say yes they have a problem, whether it’s affecting other parts of their life (e.g. work) or not.

They confessed the other day to having drove home down the motorway from the pub (works drinks) after 4 pints.

Deal breaker right there. Yes, drinking that much every day means they have a problem. The fact that other people also drink that much just means they have a problem as well. The fact that it's common doesn't make it less if a problem. And driving after 4 pints is unforgivable. If you think they are doing that again, call the police. How would you feel if they crashed and killed someone?

I've always thought that drinking is an issue if it affects your relationships, your health or your job. Some people drink wine or beer every day without issue, for some it causes problems.

You need to sit with your spouse and have a chat on how it is affecting your relationship and with the children.

I often asked my exH to stop drinking for a few weeks and see how he felt. It never happened, there was always an excuse. Over time the drinking just got more and more until eventually I couldn't stand it any more.
We had similar issues to what you describe with him taking a chance and drink driving and also with him not being able to give the kids lifts in the evening.
I 100% agree that if you're thinking it's a problem, then it is a problem.