Did this really happen?! Why didn't I react?

OP I hope you are OK today. It's totally natural to freeze; I've done it myself on all but one occasion. Sometimes due to embarrassment, sometimes fear, sometimes disbelief.

I am beyond furious at the shit women have dealt out to them by men.

The time I most regret not reacting was at a friend's 30th birthday meal. This guy (one of her other friend's husbands) knelt down beside our table, supposedly to chat, and during the conversation his hand was creeping further and further up my legs under my dress. I'm sure, thinking about it, the fact that my husband was also at the table was an extra turn-on for him.

I just froze and did nothing. I think my feeling was how embarrassing it would be to call him out in front of everyone else in the restaurant; also my husband (not a violent man in any way) would have instantly had him by the throat.

I so wish I'd stood up, said "What the fuck do you think you're doing?" and let whatever was going to happen, happen. Because he deserved to be shamed and I did nothing wrong.

I'm still furious 30 years later.

I had this happen in a fully lacked tube train and when I finally managed to move away my friend told me afterwards that he then did it to her. Scum who depend on yoj being too shocked to act.
I also had this happen on a packed tube and although I didn't have the courage then to speak up, (I was 19) I did grab the offending hand and pinched as hard as I could. He silently stopped.

Just to say, as they were an elderly couple, that the man may have the onset of dementia. In which case reporting what happened may also help him and his wife, if the store/police are able to help track them. They may need support.

I’m sorry this happened to you.

"This comment is to the person who suggested that in the 1990s we just accepted this behaviour or even enjoyed it."

Women did not "just accept it" in the 90s
But they were subject to a far louder message that anything which happened to them must in some way be their own fault.
I don't think that has entirely gone away but at least people speak up about stuff now.

This comment is to the person who suggested that in the 1990s we just accepted this behaviour or even enjoyed it.

Yes, we were more idiotic in the 1990s.

(I don’t believe that of course. I would report this today and I would have reported it in the 1990s)

Please report it to the store. It may have happened before and will probably happen again.

These fuckers disempower us when they do this crap. You find yourself asking yourself if it really happened, did you do something to make it happen etc. it is shocking.

Reporting it will make you feel better and give you back control.

@EnjoythemoneyJane I’m so sorry this happened and no one stood up for you. I can’t imagine witnessing a young woman saying something like this and not stepping in, even if it was just get her away from the abuser. We need to stand up to this sort of thing and believe woman. You deserved so much more.

Mistake or not I’m sorry but this would also have been highly inappropriate.

I’m very thankful that you were u affected by being felt up by a pervert in front of your dc. That doesn’t make it any more acceptable and the time period is irrelevant.

Op if you feel up to it please report him, there will likely be cctv to support your account. You did nothing wrong. You’re froze and I suspect that your instincts kicked in so that your dc and his lovely wife weren’t affected by his appalling actions. It’s a very different ball game when your dc are around. I hope you’re ok.

@EnjoythemoneyJane That's horrific, so sorry that happened to you. Bet he did it to loads of women.

"Yes we did care. It’s sexual assault. When it happened to me in the 90’s I did care a lot. I was getting off a train and as we shuffled down the aisle a creep grabbed my arse. I grabbed his hand and held it in the air and shouted ‘has anyone lost this, I just found it stuck to my arse!’ Hope it put him off doing it again!"

@BashfulClam I think I love you.

It’s the cognitive dissonance of the situation, OP. A sweet old couple, the presence of your baby and his own fucking wife. It’s not as obvious or brazen an assault as a young bloke on the street when you’re with your mates.

One of the worst I experienced was on a London tube train - it was a crush and he was a professional man older than my dad, wearing an expensive suit and carrying a briefcase. He put his whole hand up my skirt and his fingers inside me. It happened in a fraction of a second, and when I called out in shock and actually said something to him, he literally acted like I didn’t exist. Stared over my head, looked at his watch and got off at the next stop. Not a single person did or said anything - in fact I remember the woman squeezed in next to me actually gave me a filthy look; it was clear that nobody believed a word I said because it just didn’t compute that a man like that would do a thing like that - and if he did, how could nobody have seen? I was 17. Still makes me almost cry thinking about it. Just glad the cunt’s probably dead now.

This used to happen to me on the tube a lot, back in the 90s. I haven't had it happen to me for years, the last time was in a crowded event in Portugal about 5 years ago. I have always reacted but I'm not the type to draw attention to myself or speak up. I've responded by kicking or stepping on their feet, sometimes thumping them right in the crotch. It has always stopped the behaviour and nobody else has ever noticed what happened, or they didn't mention if if they did. I think a lot of my personality traits are in opposition to social conditioning, I've made life decisions which don't really fit into social norms, so a lot of my behaviours aren't what you might expect from a nice young woman.

It’s how predators are able to do this in plain sight - they know that shock and social conditioning will allow them to get away with it almost all of the time, and on the odd occasion they get called out they can fall back on plausible deniability. Plus it happens in seconds, no time at all to really process what’s happening.

You didn’t react because as women we are caught between our natural instincts - the constant vigilance we develop even as young girls to keep ourselves safe - and the societal pressure to ‘be nice’ that’s drilled into us from childhood. Be quiet, smile, don’t make a fuss, don’t make other people feel uncomfortable - especially in public. It’s that conditioning that completely overwhelms us in situations like this and causes us to question and suppress our natural reactions. That didn’t really just happen, did it? And in a moment of shock and uncertainty we default to saying nothing.

What he did was a violation of your bodily autonomy. It’s shit and I understand why you’re upset - it’s that horrible feeling of impotent rage that you woulda/shoulda/coulda said or done something at the time and didn’t.

Lost count of the number of times shit like this happened to me in the 80s and 90s and I was too surprised or confused to react (and to the pp who suggested it was no biggie back then, it very much fucking was, thanks - I’m still incandescent about some of the groping and assault I was subjected to, and the entitlement and arrogance of the disgusting pigs who perpetrated it). Sorry I can’t be more constructive, OP, other than to say taking a boxing class or something. Imagining punching him repeatedly in the face might help get it out of your system.

Why would it be your first thought? The odds are very much against it. The vast majority of older men walking around town don't have dementia. The vast majority of sexual assailants don't have dementia either, so its seems a strange leap.
Its also irrelevant to the OP. She is the victim of an assault. Why do we need to jump through hoops to find a way to not only excuse her assailant, but centre him in our empathy as a victim of a health condition?

If inappropriate sexual behaviour towards women is a sign of dementia, the rates amongst men of all ages are alarming. I wonder if the WHO are aware?
The older man is far less likely to be suffering from dementia than not. Let's not jump to pathologise sexual assault. It's a short step from that to 'Don't say anything, poor man can't help it'.

You did nothing because;
a) in the scenario your brain wouldn’t let you believe that actually happened
b) social constraints mean many people will act in a way contrary to their feelings
c) you didn’t want to alarm your child or the lady
d) you weren’t prepared for a confrontation in a confined space
e) you needed time to process what happened and then the moment was gone.

Please report to the store and police, it will make you feel better for having “actioned” something.
I had a man do something similar when I was looking at shoes in a sports venue. I froze, and only reported the next day. The venue gave the cc tv to police who arrested him at his workplace. He had other complaints against him and this was the caught in the act evidence they needed to charge him.

It happened to me on a bus over 20 years ago. I just panicked and got off at the next stop.

I don't blame you at all OP, it is shock.

My guess as to why this man did this is any combination of the following

• he has done it for years and years without ever getting caught/reported. I believe a lot of older men are like this and have got away with casual sexual assault for a very long time without anyone making any kind of fuss
• it was in a lift so he assumed no witnesses
• he was with his wife who was making a fuss of your baby, so he assumed you were vulnerable/not going to make a fuss in front of his wife/whilst your baby was there
• sheer downright entitlement and total lack of respect

.......Congratulations?........

Why would you have glared at him if you didn’t care? Why not stand still and let him have a proper go? Is it because actually you did care after all?