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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Is this neglect?

263 replies

Thanksforreading · 29/09/2023 18:19

So DD has been attending this nursery for well over a year and we have never had a problem till last night. She is 2 years old.

I picked her up from nursery as usual (Thursday 5.45pm), and run her bath, take off her clothes and get her to sit on her potty. Before she sits on her potty she touches her thigh and says “ouchie” and “help me” so I have a look and I notice a red mark on her inner thigh! (Photo one) I was a bit shocked, but told her it was okay, and decided not to give her a bath but just a quick shower down instead. She then tells me “itchy” she’s got very limited words, so when she tells me itchy I was a bit confused as well, still not too sure what to make of it but I dress her and email nursery about my concerns. (6.30pm)
Husband gets back, and he looks, sends over a very strong email to nursery. By 7.30pm her mark is looking 100% like a burn mark from friction and it’s weeping hard, we just clean it a bit and pop aloe Vera on it, DD is super upset with lots tears and telling us “pain”
We have woken up to (photo 2) this morning to darken area of the weeping area. Nursery has replied this morning with an email saying they will investigate and give them day to get back to us.
No courtesy call nothing not even an apology or sorry to hear that this has happened, just they will investigate. Nursery closes at 6 pm.
I’ve managed to book our DD in with the doctors and they have confirmed with a written document, confirming it is a friction burn. I’ve given them till 530Pm and have tried calling them three times and no one has picked up and the voice message box is also full. I feel like my daughter has been at the hands of neglect now, and it is now a Friday evening, so this will be left till Monday morning at least. Am I being unreasonable or am I just asking for too much? This is a private nursery and we pay £94 a day for childcare.

OP posts:
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HobbiddoH · 03/10/2023 20:36

glad your DD is feeling better

OliveWah · 03/10/2023 19:36

That's a decent response from the nursery. In your shoes, I would feel like they've really listened to your concerns and are taking steps to find out how it happened, and to ensure it doesn't recur. I'd be happy for DD to return to nursery too, following this email, and I'm glad to hear she's feeling so much better!

PinkMoscatoLover · 03/10/2023 10:25

Their response is very thorough! I’d certainly be satisfied with that as they seem to be handling it properly. I’m happy to hear that DD’s leg has healed and she’s feeling better. Let’s hope this doesn’t happen again🤞

saffy2 · 03/10/2023 08:49

Just as an early morning years view, my complaints policy is that upon receiving a complaint I do as the nursery have done by notifying relevant parties and then investigate myself and will respond within 28 days. (Thats how ofsted tell providers to respond to complaints) so while parents may feel the nursery haven’t behaved appropriately they are probably responding as per their complaints policy, AND responding without all the correct information is not a good thing to do. What they’ve done is to keep you informed as to their procedure and doing things the way it should be done by the book. I too would be happy with their response here.

Thanksforreading · 03/10/2023 08:25

Morning everyone,

The nursery has emailed us at 10.40am yesterday, I’ve just copied and paste what they came back to us with-

(We have taken your concern very seriously and are currently carrying out an internal investigation. We have also raised your concern with LADO who is the Local Authority Desginated Officer with the information you have provided. We have also let OFSTED know about the situation. We are awaiting LADO’s response on the situation as they normally advise us what further steps to carry out. In the mean time, we have started interviewing the staff members and have this morning gained all the witness statements as one of the staff members were on annual leave on Friday.

As soon as have more information, we will let you know and we will update you accordingly.

Thank you)

We are happy they finally responded and have speculated on what we think has happened(from the many many replies here), DH wants to not interfere with there investigations and will let nursery take the lead. DD has not been in nursery last two days and will go in tomorrow morning. Her inner thigh has nearly completely healed up. Please for those that are going to say we should take her out, we actually have not spoken much about long term future for DD just yet, but like I have said we are happy with how nursery is dealing with the incident/accident.

DD inner thigh has been healing well, I know it no longer hurts as during nappy changes she tell me “ouch” but sometimes points to the wrong thigh now! So I’m very very happy it no longer hurts her, and nightmares and tears stopped from Sunday night now and she’s sleeping all the way through again the last couple of nights.

OP posts:
PinkMoscatoLover · 02/10/2023 22:25

Did the nursery end up getting in touch with you OP?

salsmum · 01/10/2023 04:39

Ouch poor baby that does look sore! Is it possible for you to check her spare nappies in her bag to gage how often she was changed or do they keep nappies at nursery to change? Do they have a rope swing at nursery or a dressing up corner where another child may have put anything around her leg and pulled it away quick? I hope you find out soon and she heals quickly. Flowers

Redicleous · 30/09/2023 16:56

That’s a chemical burn.
My daughter had one on her face from infant olbas oil.
We watched it progress from a small blemish to your 2nd photo in 3 days.
All healed now and no scars thankfully.

Im with those suggesting cleaning fluid/bleach burn from any potty or toddler toilet seat, because of the area it’s in.

I think we kept it smothered in Vaseline to help it heal?

Bertiesmum3 · 30/09/2023 16:25

If she’s rubbed it whilst playing on a ride on toy or something similar then I’m sure the staff wouldn’t have noticed, they can’t see what is going on under the clothes

Canisaysomething · 30/09/2023 12:42

I haven’t insinuated abuse at all. I have said this needs a discussion with the manager asap in order to get to the bottom of it. What is the point of wondering what all the possible reasons are, just raise it with the nursery. Maybe they know, maybe they don’t know. Maybe they’ve had previous issues raised by other parents, maybe they haven’t.

The OP isn’t going to get to the bottom of it by posting photos on an online forum with a load of people making random suggestions of what it looks like.

Inner thigh injuries are not a standard injury location for a toddler. Any decent nursery staff or manager will know this.

AmyandPhilipfan · 30/09/2023 10:20

I presume by social care they mean social services, which of course exists all over the UK.

If the nursery is anything like the one I used to work in, if her nap ended at 2 she probably had a nappy change then. And if she then had a big wee but they went out for a walk this could have caused the issue but they have several toddlers to look after and can't be changing nappies constantly. I expect they have set times when they do it, plus if a child poos. Personally, if that was the issue I would accept it was just one of those things and just ask them to double check she wasn't really wet before going out in future.

With regard to key workers changing, that decision will come from the nursery manager in consultation with the staff. The manager will take the staff's preferences into account over the parents'.

looking4pup · 30/09/2023 09:31

Could it have happened between you collecting her and running the shower?

SoShallINever · 30/09/2023 09:22

I'm very surprised her GP hasn't referred to social services. All injuries to children should be investigated. It's not right that this can happen in a nursery and go unrecorded. I hope your DD recovers quickly.

Thanksforreading · 30/09/2023 09:17

SmileyClare · 30/09/2023 08:44

Obviously you want assurances that her nappy is being changed regularly enough so the wet material edge isn’t rubbing her leg,
but an extra measure is to apply a good barrier cream to the areas prone to chafing particularly if the new toddler room she has been moved to regularly take them out for a long walk.

They don’t normally go for long walks tbh, we are literally based in Tower Hill next to Tower bridge. (It’s normally more the park or the playground) Also we only allowed nursery to start taking her out in April this year because it was winter before and the thought of nursery taking out a bunch of kids gave me a panic attack until we established trust with her nursery. She’s not in FT nursery as I only work part time, and before anyone else judges (not you Clare you have been very nice) my DD does swimming, music class, did sing and sign, we go out to parks, zoo, farms, soft play, o2 jump so we are a full timetable hence feeling like she didn’t have to go out out for nursery. She also didn’t walk properly till 15months.

OP posts:
PinkMoscatoLover · 30/09/2023 09:15

Thanksforreading · 30/09/2023 08:24

@SmileyClare just wanted to say a big, thank you for all your comments. Her inner thigh is completely scabbed over, looks like DD will be better in no time. She has not been upset with her morning nappy change looking at the area today. I think that I can rule out infectious diseases now. I will wait until after lunch on Monday before I call Nursery if they still have not contacted me.

Please do update us on what the nursery say. I think it’s ridiculous that they’ve taken so long to get back to you regardless of what’s happened to DD. I’m guessing her nappy was on for a long while and it possibly started chafing or something

SmileyClare · 30/09/2023 08:44

Obviously you want assurances that her nappy is being changed regularly enough so the wet material edge isn’t rubbing her leg,
but an extra measure is to apply a good barrier cream to the areas prone to chafing particularly if the new toddler room she has been moved to regularly take them out for a long walk.

SmileyClare · 30/09/2023 08:37

Glad your dd is on the mend op!

In light of her having a long walk (does she usually?) her friction burn looks very likely to be caused by the nappy edge or clothing rubbing the skin continuously.

On a long walk, a burn or blister can be caused by material touching the skin quite lightly- it’s the repetition of the skin being continuously rubbed over and over in the same place.

A bit like when you go on a very long walk or run and realise that your usual trainers or clothes have rubbed painfully.
You only notice when you go to get in the bath and think Argh what the hell is that? It doesn’t hurt at the time.

The nursery and her key worker need to be made aware and report back to you with reassurances or evidence of action taken to prevent this happening again.

You panicked - I get that- you’re putting the most precious thing in the world to you in the care of others. It’s essential that you trust them and can communicate concerns/ queries with them.

No wonder they don’t want to talk to you! < Thats a fucking ridiculous comment.

The nursery need a relationship with parents that relies on trust and open communication.

Op can ask questions about her daughter’s care and request she keeps the care worker she started with as a baby.
They can politely explain why that’s not possible of course.

raven0007 · 30/09/2023 08:35

Could it be impetigo?

Iateitallofit · 30/09/2023 08:25

Thanksforreading · 30/09/2023 08:12

@Fallingthroughclouds it’s lovely that you put some much thought into it. Before you start calling people names, you should get to know them. You have seen this tiny thread into my life on my DD, and this is the worst thing that has ever happened to her where it’s causing her trauma. I’ve slept in her room over the last two nights because she’s crying in her sleep with tears, she’s waking up saying “mama” in the middle of the night and she never does that, she’s slept through from ten months. The only time I’ve seen her this upset was when she had covid a year ago with novovirus at hospital, and even then she wasn’t crying in her sleep with random tears. So what you think is entitled is what I think is standard practice and minimum practice for my child.

Poor little love- clearly the whole experience has been traumatic for her. I think it’s a shock the first time they have something that really hurts them, hurts for a while and their mum can’t just make it stop. It’s a moment of realisation for them.
My son knocked a heavy dinner plate onto his foot when he was two- it landed on the rim directly on his big toe nail. It hurt and went black and fell off over the course of a week- he would randomly remember for a few weeks afterwards and suddenly cry saying poor toe poor toe.

Thanksforreading · 30/09/2023 08:24

@SmileyClare just wanted to say a big, thank you for all your comments. Her inner thigh is completely scabbed over, looks like DD will be better in no time. She has not been upset with her morning nappy change looking at the area today. I think that I can rule out infectious diseases now. I will wait until after lunch on Monday before I call Nursery if they still have not contacted me.

OP posts:
Fallingthroughclouds · 30/09/2023 08:24

But you said you'd already asked the keyworker to move rooms! All we can see is this thread and the issues you have raised, so this is what we comment on. It's how mumsnet works. I haven't commented or made any assumptions on the rest of your life, why would I, similiarly its highly unlikely that I'm going to get to know you, again how online forums work. I stand by the fact that I find the room change request ridiculous for all the reasons I have aforementioned, bit of course its awful that your daughter is so upset.

And I didn't call you a name. I said batshit which is what I think your request is.

Thanksforreading · 30/09/2023 08:12

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@Fallingthroughclouds it’s lovely that you put some much thought into it. Before you start calling people names, you should get to know them. You have seen this tiny thread into my life on my DD, and this is the worst thing that has ever happened to her where it’s causing her trauma. I’ve slept in her room over the last two nights because she’s crying in her sleep with tears, she’s waking up saying “mama” in the middle of the night and she never does that, she’s slept through from ten months. The only time I’ve seen her this upset was when she had covid a year ago with novovirus at hospital, and even then she wasn’t crying in her sleep with random tears. So what you think is entitled is what I think is standard practice and minimum practice for my child.

OP posts:
Iateitallofit · 30/09/2023 08:10

Lorelaigilmore88 · 29/09/2023 18:37

Kids do have accidents but the second pic looks awful and more severe that the usual bumps and bruises.
I think you are right to pursue them for a proper explaination and not let them fob you off.
If you aren't happy with how they handle this can you switch nurseries? I'd be looking at seriously they take this, that would reflect how good they are to me....

How would she get a friction burn that badly in an accident though? I’ve seen friction burns on hands/faces/knees and elbows from falling over on a rough carpet- but not that bad and not in skin covered by clothing.

My son is autistic and sensory seeking and suddenly started rubbing his wrist continuously on the carpet until people intervened… and he would go back to doing it on the same spot again and again- even that didn’t produce a burn like that.

Thanksforreading · 30/09/2023 08:03

SquirrelFeeder · 30/09/2023 01:36

I can assure you there very much IS social care in London!

@SquirrelFeeder thats nice to know, sorry I’ve never heard or come across social care or know anyone that has in London, and I was born and raised here.

OP posts:
Fallingthroughclouds · 30/09/2023 08:01

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