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Original poster

School refusing to provide translator

765 replies

CapturedLeprechaun · 27/09/2023 22:19

I'm on the Governing body for a school with a really high proportion of kids with English as a second language. It's over 80% of their pupils. Many of the parents speak little or no English at all. There are some families who have been here 5+ years where one or both parents speak no English at all still, and even a "your child has no PE kit, they need to wear their PE kit on Mondays and Wednesdays" wouldn't be understood.

The school always use translators for meetings with parents - either a staff member who speaks that language who is available, or else they have a telephone translator service that they pay for, so the phone is on loudspeaker and a translator translates the conversation.

This is done for all parents evenings/ attendance meetings/ SENCO meetings etc for parents who don't speak or understand English.

Important letters like school trips/consent forms are provided translated in the three most common languages spoken.

The school offers English classes to parents, one held in the school one morning a week in the hall, one held in the evening each week.

School has now said translators will only be provided to parents whose children have been at the school for less than a year. If your child has been at the school for more than a year and you are unable to understand English, no translator will be provided, due to staff shortages and costs, and you have to bring a friend/family member who can translate. Letters will only be provided in English, and parents can use the translate feature on google if they need to.

On the face of this, does this seem a reasonable decision? The head has announced this and I don't know why it doesn't sit right with me, and I can't really articulate why. It has a lot of support from the English speaking parents, but it feels... divisive, I guess? And most likely children who will suffer. Currently trying to weigh up whether this is something I should raise, or accept this is a reasonable step for the school to take.

OP posts:
spanishviola · 27/09/2023 23:33

Mehmeh22 · 27/09/2023 22:50

Wow the ignorance on this tired is palpable.

There are many many reasons why people can't learn a different language. Maybe they never went to school, and cannot read and write in their own language or maybe their family were murdered or hometown bombed and they have ptsd. Maybe they don't want to be here? This would just push them further away and make them less likely to engage.

I've seen the fallout of a teenage kids translating for their parents. It gets messy.

Have you ever thought that these people would love to be able to communicate to others? It's exceptionally isolating not being able to speak the native language.

You are right to feel this doesn't sit right OP. It doesn't.

I agree with this 100%

Theunamedcat · 27/09/2023 23:33

Insommmmnia · 27/09/2023 23:26

I'm thinking of all the English people who move to Wales, some of whom refuse to learn Welsh, respond to job adverts with abuse when it asks for applicants to be able to speak Welsh, complain about local meetings like parish councils being conducted in Welsh and insist on it being done in English and who would throw an absolutely hissy fit if school letters were only sent in Welsh and I wonder where all these MNs are who would absolutely learn the language of the country they are in if they lived there.

I wonder whether they would have the same response if schools in Wales started refusing to send out bilingual letters because it's faster and therefore cheaper to just send them in welsh.

Many Welsh people don't speak Welsh every meeting I've ever been to has been Welsh first then English yes it takes longer but the point is its inclusive to Welsh people who don't speak the language Wales is not a good example here

SirenSays · 27/09/2023 23:33

This makes me uneasy. The desired effect would be that these parents learn English and the school saves money. But I went to a school that had a lot of refugee children. Growing up with them and seeing their lives and struggles, I'm not sure how realistic that is.

PineappleActivate · 27/09/2023 23:31

The need for a translator in a hospital to the need for a translator in a hospital isn't comparable. Eg One might be for giving consent to a medical procedure.
In many other countries however, hospital staff aren't required to speak English.

Same with many schools. Our dcs are already having a difficult time with funding being cut. Why should it be used for this service when the parents should be adapting to the country they call home? They need to put in the hours esp if English speaking lessons are being offered for free ffs which is alsonat the tax payers expense.

MyGooseisTotallyLoose · 27/09/2023 23:31

Are they refusing to allow a translator to attend or saying they can't pay for it anymore if the family wants one?

MoonShinesBright · 27/09/2023 23:30

This reply has been deleted

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goldfinchfan · 27/09/2023 23:29

This is evidence of a lack of integration. Becoming a resident really should include an expectation of learning English.
I have known a number of cases where the manwon't allow his wife to learn English as he wants to remain in control. This is not good for hi swife.
I think there are more benefits from stopping spending money on translaters which is taking money and funds away from English speakers.

AnySoln · 27/09/2023 23:29

Dd school has polish/french/spanish/italian etc parents. It would be too expensive. And all of these mums at least speak english.
I learnt spanish to gcse in 1 year of evening clases and alevel in 2 yrs of 3hr per week.

By y2 most kids would be able to translate for parents letters at least.
The important bit of reports is the meeting or not.
I could probably understand enough of a parents evening i several different languages.

Vinrouge4 · 27/09/2023 23:28

Insommmmnia · 27/09/2023 23:26

I'm thinking of all the English people who move to Wales, some of whom refuse to learn Welsh, respond to job adverts with abuse when it asks for applicants to be able to speak Welsh, complain about local meetings like parish councils being conducted in Welsh and insist on it being done in English and who would throw an absolutely hissy fit if school letters were only sent in Welsh and I wonder where all these MNs are who would absolutely learn the language of the country they are in if they lived there.

I wonder whether they would have the same response if schools in Wales started refusing to send out bilingual letters because it's faster and therefore cheaper to just send them in welsh.

Eh?

Insommmmnia · 27/09/2023 23:26

I'm thinking of all the English people who move to Wales, some of whom refuse to learn Welsh, respond to job adverts with abuse when it asks for applicants to be able to speak Welsh, complain about local meetings like parish councils being conducted in Welsh and insist on it being done in English and who would throw an absolutely hissy fit if school letters were only sent in Welsh and I wonder where all these MNs are who would absolutely learn the language of the country they are in if they lived there.

I wonder whether they would have the same response if schools in Wales started refusing to send out bilingual letters because it's faster and therefore cheaper to just send them in welsh.

caringcarer · 27/09/2023 23:25

SirSamVimesCityWatch · 27/09/2023 22:27

Exactly this. Schools have no spare money.

I don't think it's a hugely unreasonable decision. It's a compromise - we'll provide a translator for the first year, but after that you should be ok to get by on your own with the help of the child (who will presumably have picked up a fair bit of English by then). There's no reason why the parent can't Google translate letters from school.

If I found myself in another country with my kids in their school system, I would be trying to learn the language pronto, so as to help my kids.

Show quote history

This.

Yellowflower47 · 27/09/2023 23:24

The school are doing the right thing if the budget doesn’t stretch to cover this very generous service. I don’t understand however, why the school has such a dire attendance record? I don’t understand the correlation between a parent/family that don’t speak English, very well or at all, and attendance? Why are these children not attending school? Regardless of whether correspondence is in their first language, it doesn’t seem as though these parents understand or value the education system they’ve opted to enrol their children into.

Haffdonga · 27/09/2023 23:24

I've been a teacher in a school where many parents didn't speak English and we had nowhere near this amount of interpreting support. Your school/ parents sound very lucky.
Surely though, any limit on use of interpreters should not be based on time in the UK but on subject matter discussed.
It's fine to use Gogle translate for 'Dont forget your PE kit on Mondays' or 'your child is doing well at maths'. Not so fine for 'we're worried that your child has xyz issues. Is there anything going on at home?'

SD1978 · 27/09/2023 23:23

There has to be money found somewhere, and the cost of continued translators must be huge. Whilst I think it should be two years, personally- yes. I agree with this. In the same way I would anyone moving to another country should be given support to learn the language, and when they don't, then that's a personal choice. The school provides opportunities to learn English, the translate ability of technology now is amazing, and the money should be spent benefiting all the children

Startyabastard · 27/09/2023 23:21

Elvis1956 · 27/09/2023 22:27

Because if you live in the UK surely you must speak English. How much of the schools budget is being spent on kids who have been in the UK for a while but who's parents have made no effort to learn English and don't speak English at home to their children.
Why should my child's education be impacted by someone who has moved to the UK for(mostly) economic reasons but had made no effort to integrate themselves or their children...it just feeds into the narrative that they are here for benefits not to work, because without English how can they get a job?

I feel the same way. As someone else said in another post says, I would not go to another country and expect them to speak my language, I personally would learn the local way of speaking.

LocalHobo · 27/09/2023 23:20

It is in everyone’s interests for parents to be engaged and know the language. Hence the school classes.
Don't understand how anyone could disagree with this statement.
In the Scandinavian country I'm from, a translator would not be provided for parents events.

ichundich · 27/09/2023 23:19

As an immigrant myself I agree that anyone who's chosen to live here should learn English. However, the children who will be affected by this change have got already a disadvantage; they will just fall behind further, miss more school days, etc.

NowWhattt · 27/09/2023 23:18

ASCCM · 27/09/2023 22:25

At the risk of getting piled on. I think I agree this is the right move.

resources are stretched and tbh I’d never ever dream of moving to a country and sending my kids to school without learning the language myself. It sounds like the school have provided lots of supports to parents to learn English so if they haven’t taken this up and think it’s ok to not understand the language of the country in which they have chosen to live then why should money for the kids be used for translators instead?

Yep. This ☝️

jenpil · 27/09/2023 23:17

DuplicateUserName · 27/09/2023 23:13

The OP states that some families have been here 5+ years.

And it's worth remembering too, that many people from poor countries haven't even learned to read and write in their own language.

But that is not our problem.....

The onus is on THEM.

They are in an English speaking country now. They have to try. Not just for their children's schooling, but for day to day living, surely?!
It's essential to learn and they can't possibly integrate without doing so.

I'm sorry that sounds harsh, but it's true.

TheLightProgramme · 27/09/2023 23:17

Generally, yes. My hesitation would be one school I worked in, child's father would not allow the mother to go to language classes, and any attempt at her learning online would have been stamped on. Just worth being aware of situations like this.

And providing translators can facilitate that. When the father has no choice but to attend themselves it can push them to allowing their wife to learn.

Vinrouge4 · 27/09/2023 23:15

I lived in France when my kids were at school. I never used a translator. I took the time and effort to learn the language. If people want to live in another county then that’s what they need to do.

MerryMarigold · 27/09/2023 23:14

I think the school has done more than any I know. Google translate is brilliant and I'm sure they all have a smart phone. If not, I'm sure the teacher or senco or Head does. It'll be a lot cheaper to think about other ways of making it work rather than assuming a translator so be made available.

Gothambutnotahamster · 27/09/2023 23:13

ASCCM · 27/09/2023 22:25

At the risk of getting piled on. I think I agree this is the right move.

resources are stretched and tbh I’d never ever dream of moving to a country and sending my kids to school without learning the language myself. It sounds like the school have provided lots of supports to parents to learn English so if they haven’t taken this up and think it’s ok to not understand the language of the country in which they have chosen to live then why should money for the kids be used for translators instead?

I completely agree with this!

DuplicateUserName · 27/09/2023 23:13

The OP states that some families have been here 5+ years.

And it's worth remembering too, that many people from poor countries haven't even learned to read and write in their own language.

jenpil · 27/09/2023 23:13

Not going to learn it overnight?! They've had 5 years or more according to the OP!

Surely within a few months they should be able to speak basic English phrases, especially living here! No excuses!

And what foreign country doesn't teach basic English at schools? These people should know some!