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AIBU?

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Original poster

Nephews Behaviour?

119 replies

Bubblegirly · 12/08/2023 19:41

It was my DC 5th birthday today. Nephew is also nearly 5. His behaviour has always been really awful (biting, hitting, throwing, smashing things etc). He was very put out that it’s DC birthday and we have a separate family party over last few years as both my DC don’t want him with their friends due to his unpredictable behaviour.

Today he started snatching DC presents and throwing them once unwrapped and then he ripped up two of his cards. I shouted to stop and that it wasn’t nice behaviour. My sister then took him aside and explained his emotions were justified as he was feeling jealous about it not being his birthday and that’s ok but he must not ruin his cousins birthday. I thought she handled it well until she then said “so when everyone has gone you can order a toy on Amazon in my phone to make you feel better”

He then started shouting “no now” and she said no later and he kept arguing so she put him on time out then brought him back and sat there ordering a toy with him. She also asked him to help sellotape the cards back together and he just swipped them away but still got a reward.

my 5yo asked me why he got a new toy for behaving badly and I just said I don’t know??

Sister also then proceeded to light a mini cake after DC has his cake and happy birthday. She then sang happy birthday to nephew and let him blow out a candle! No one else joined in. I’m feeling really peed off about the whole thing. My oldest is 6 and he didn’t get any special treatment or the other cousins. I’m just so fed up with this behaviour and my children questioning it now. AIBU to not do these family parties anymore or to talk to sister. I have spoken before about it but she just doesn’t care

OP posts:
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Jc2001 · 04/04/2024 19:09

My sister then took him aside and explained his emotions were justified as he was feeling jealous about it not being his birthday and that’s ok

No wonder he behaves the way he does. Parents really needs to stop validating this sort of behaviour as if it's not their fault.

NoThanksymm · 04/04/2024 17:05

Ok phew! It’s your sister!

Yeah. It’s totally unacceptable. Talk to sister.

or just stop inviting that kid/family.

It’s it just your family there or hubbys too? Just your family then fine, you can all judge sister together.

But that kid is gonna be a monster if your sister doesn’t get him under control soon!

SeulementUneFois · 14/08/2023 10:55

@SavBlancTonight
I understand what you're saying...
However, maybe do it anyway? (contact the school safeguarding team, that is).

Even if there's nothing they can practically do, if they even make a phonecall to the parents it may have some impact....
I don't know, anything at all - sorry I've no better solutions:(

SavBlancTonight · 14/08/2023 10:32

SeulementUneFois · 13/08/2023 22:30

@SavBlancTonight
That sounds actually abusive towards the sibling.
I'm serious. I know this sounds very pearl clutching, but you should try to find out the school the sibling goes to and report it anonymously to their safeguarding team.
I know it's "only" psychologically abusive, but it is.

Show quote history

I agree that it's potentially abusive. DH and I had discussed what, if anything, we should do a few months ago but it does seem to be slowly getting better. I think it's also all very well saying this is abuse, but the problem is that when it's subtle like this, it's very difficult for outside agencies to step in. They can barely cope with the genuinely hard core, visible, undeniable abuse cases they have to manage.

Instead, we're trying to be supportive and offer alternatives etc.

AlmostTotallyFake · 14/08/2023 07:21

Bubblegirly · 13/08/2023 22:03

But he doesn’t have additional needs. I have a child who is autistic. I know the struggles and wouldn’t judge anyone but that is not the case here. I was asking if IABU to not do these parties any more as this behaviour is effecting my children and thier happiness

Show quote history

This is mn OP, according to most posters 99% of the population has SEN, ADHD etc.
Its almost as if ineffectual parents don't exist....

Moccasin · 13/08/2023 22:44

And this is how we are raising a generation of future entitled brats. Can’t fucking wait 🙄

SeulementUneFois · 13/08/2023 22:30

SavBlancTonight · 13/08/2023 09:25

I am seeing this sort of thing from a number of parents currently. In one case, the child is confirmed with ASD and ADHD and in the other there is no diagnosis or even an attempt to get one but the rest of us suspect some ND.

I am starting to believe that what happens is that parenting styles and approaches are fixed when the child is very young, and genuinely can't cope/understand. But then as the child gets older, the parent is still acting as if their struggles haven't evolved - ie still present but different.

We have a situation with a 10 year old now who is becoming more and more spoiled and out of control in every way - her behaviour and her eating are uncontrollable while increasingly she is allowed to decide on what behaviour her parents and siblings are "allowed". Her sibling has not been allowed a playdate without her for a year now as every time it is suggested she talks about how unhappy she is because he has friends. This would be more understandable if she had no friends, but she does and has playdates with them.

@SavBlancTonight
That sounds actually abusive towards the sibling.
I'm serious. I know this sounds very pearl clutching, but you should try to find out the school the sibling goes to and report it anonymously to their safeguarding team.
I know it's "only" psychologically abusive, but it is.

MisschiefMaker · 13/08/2023 22:20

What would happen if you stopped inviting DSis and DN to your parties? Would they notice and would it cause a huge falling out? I can totally see why you don't want him there but I wonder if there's a better way of approaching this, especially as you presumably have another year before this is an issue? Or is he likely to act out at your next child's party too?

I have a different view to the other posters. I think, if you can, you should try to be your sisters ally and gently talk to her about parenting. I know it's hard to do this sensitively without alienating her. Can you ask her how the parenting classes are going? From how she handled the party it sounds like she's doing the gentle parenting thing but has missed the part about following through with consequences. Where is DN's dad in this? Maybe he needs a firmer parent and the dad needs to step up.

My mothers made some questionable parenting decisions and nobody pulled her up on it because we had no family around (single parent immigrant). I do think it's really only family that can have those hard conversations and who care enough for the children involved to step in. If you can do it in a constructive way that isn't just insults, you should say something. For the boy's sake too.

SeulementUneFois · 13/08/2023 22:19

Coffeaddict · 12/08/2023 19:52

I would stop the family parties and distance yourself from the child. Meet up with your sister ( if you still want to) without the kids.

This OP.

Hibiscrubbed · 13/08/2023 22:17

Your sister is making herself a very uncomfortable bed to lie in. Her problem.

I’d be avoiding them for any such occasions again though.

amusedbush · 13/08/2023 22:13

ItsNotRocketSalad · 13/08/2023 14:42

It's not "my oldest is autistic" though, it's "my oldest is autism spectrum disorder" which makes no sense.

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I'm pedantic to the point of being annoying but I can't get worked up about that.

I see no malice intended and I'm sure everyone knew what OP meant.

manilowmagic · 13/08/2023 22:09

But he doesn’t have additional needs. I have a child who is autistic. I know the struggles and wouldn’t judge anyone but that is not the case here. I was asking if IABU to not do these parties any more as this behaviour is effecting my children and thier happiness

I think it is his mother's behaviour that is the problem here. And unless SHE changes her behaviour/reactions/parenting then I would definitely not do these parties. My son with ADHD was also capable of bad behaviour that had nothing to do with his condition and had to be disciplined accordingly. And sorry there is no excuse in the world for nephew's birthday cake incident!!!!

Original poster
Bubblegirly · 13/08/2023 22:03

waterrat · 13/08/2023 21:57

My autistic child struggles at parties. You say he is usually violent etc your relative may be dealing with special needs in the way she can. Try not to judge.

But he doesn’t have additional needs. I have a child who is autistic. I know the struggles and wouldn’t judge anyone but that is not the case here. I was asking if IABU to not do these parties any more as this behaviour is effecting my children and thier happiness

OP posts:
Original poster
Bubblegirly · 13/08/2023 22:02

But he doesn’t have additional needs. I have a child who is autistic. I know the struggles and wouldn’t judge anyone but that is not the case here. I was asking if IABU to not do these parties any more as this behaviour is effecting my children and thier happiness

OP posts:
manilowmagic · 13/08/2023 21:59

To my knowledge psychiatrists don’t diagnose autism because it isn’t medical in their sense of medical. They diagnose adhd because they can prescribe medication for that! At least that is the case in my area/ community of parents of ND children.

Yes, I totally agree. I have found when children who take medication for adhd reach 18, they are transferred to a psychiatrist because the medication cannot be prescribed by a GP. But as you say autism isn't "their kind of medical".

waterrat · 13/08/2023 21:57

My autistic child struggles at parties. You say he is usually violent etc your relative may be dealing with special needs in the way she can. Try not to judge.

Giantpig · 13/08/2023 21:35

manilowmagic · 13/08/2023 21:14

Only a psychiatrist can give a diagnosis. Sorry. You really don’t know what you’re talking about.

I am really astounded that you are so certain of this. As I said in an earlier post I have three sons that were diagnosed, and maybe 9 or 10 foster children who were diagnosed while in our care. And not only has a psychiatrist never diagnosed any of them, but none of them have ever even seen one or it ever have been suggested they see one. A firm diagnosis has always been given by other health or educational professionals (educational psychologists, paediatricians, neurologists, speech and language therapists and so on). And that diagnosis has always been accepted by every other professional, despite the lack of any psychiatric involvement. This has really surprised me.

To my knowledge psychiatrists don’t diagnose autism because it isn’t medical in their sense of medical. They diagnose adhd because they can prescribe medication for that! At least that is the case in my area/ community of parents of ND children.

manilowmagic · 13/08/2023 21:14

Only a psychiatrist can give a diagnosis. Sorry. You really don’t know what you’re talking about.

I am really astounded that you are so certain of this. As I said in an earlier post I have three sons that were diagnosed, and maybe 9 or 10 foster children who were diagnosed while in our care. And not only has a psychiatrist never diagnosed any of them, but none of them have ever even seen one or it ever have been suggested they see one. A firm diagnosis has always been given by other health or educational professionals (educational psychologists, paediatricians, neurologists, speech and language therapists and so on). And that diagnosis has always been accepted by every other professional, despite the lack of any psychiatric involvement. This has really surprised me.

manilowmagic · 13/08/2023 21:04

Only a qualified psychiatrist can tell you if you have autism or not

That isn't my experience. I have sons with autism and also now foster children who have been diagnosed, both as children and in later teenage/early adult life. And in none of these has their diagnosis ever come from a qualified psychiatrist, nor has it ever been suggested that anyone should even see one, in fact none of them ever have. The diagnosis has come from a variety of medical and school services but never a psychiatrist. That is my experience anyway.

Giantpig · 13/08/2023 15:28

surreygirl1987 · 13/08/2023 14:39

Yes but not to do with any additional needs

No, but you are raising concerns about his behaviour and acknowledging that it is atypical. This is not the expected behaviour of a child his age, by your own admittance. Thus, concerns have been raised about him - by you. It MIGHT simply be a result of poor parenting, or it MIGHT be a SEN on top of poor parenting. At this point you absolutely do not know. Either way, you can stop the invitations - that's up to you.

If this behaviour has been consistently reinforced (as it was in this situation) for the last 4 years then I think this is exactly the behaviour you would expect from a child that age.

The child could be ND but the evidence in the OP is a child behaving in the way his parents have taught and encouraged- he is acting entirely appropriately for his environment.

momonpurpose · 13/08/2023 15:24

Giantpig · 13/08/2023 10:08

Yes obviously. But it gets extremely frustrating when time a child exhibiting unpleasant or inappropriate behaviour is discussed people turn up to say ‘they probably have asd and pda’ as if all negative traits are intrinsically linked to those conditions. They aren’t. Many of them are linked to parenting style.

Im sick of having people hear my sons diagnosis and presuming that means he will be unmanageable and horrible to other children because all bad behaviour is linked to ND (especially pda and adhd- if I leave that part of the diagnosis out he gets a much more sympathetic reception).

Any child who has been taught that having negative feelings (jealousy/sadness/disappointment etc) = screaming and hitting and destroying things= parents make it better by given them the thing they are jealous of/giving them a treat to make up for it etc will behave like that. Of course they would, they have been conditioned to!

The difference is that children who are ND may well behave like that DESPITE the fact their parents are doing everything they can to teach them other ways to manage their behaviour or bending over backwards to avoid it happening in the first place.

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I am so glad you wrote this. Yes some children some adults some of everyone has special needs. But sometimes a brat is just a brat by poor parenting. I may flamed for this and thats just fine but some not all people would rather just say pda instead of activity parenting. You sound like a great mom best to you and your son.

Cherrysoup · 13/08/2023 15:13

Don’t think I’d allow him back for any kind of celebration. Your sister is not teaching him basic manners, is she?

Belladonna56 · 13/08/2023 14:47

surreygirl1987 · 13/08/2023 00:03

Surely this is a combination of neurodiversity and poor parenting?

No, it's a combination of terrible parenting and really awful parenting.

ItsNotRocketSalad · 13/08/2023 14:42

amusedbush · 12/08/2023 22:51

I’m autistic and absolutely prefer that language over ‘has autism’. Autism is the way I’m hardwired, it’s literally what causes my brain’s physical structure and it informs how I perceive/interact with the world. If you removed it, I’d be a totally different person.

I have hayfever… but I AM autistic.

Many people in the ND community have the same language preference so it’s not a blanket rule.

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It's not "my oldest is autistic" though, it's "my oldest is autism spectrum disorder" which makes no sense.

surreygirl1987 · 13/08/2023 14:39

Yes but not to do with any additional needs

No, but you are raising concerns about his behaviour and acknowledging that it is atypical. This is not the expected behaviour of a child his age, by your own admittance. Thus, concerns have been raised about him - by you. It MIGHT simply be a result of poor parenting, or it MIGHT be a SEN on top of poor parenting. At this point you absolutely do not know. Either way, you can stop the invitations - that's up to you.