Aliens???

There is a theory that the people doing the covering up are scared that with all the advances in modern technology on sensors etc that sooner or later something will be recorded that is impossible for them to deny.

If that is really the case they would be far better off revealing "the truth" now and explaining why they did it, rather than waiting for a potentially angry public to make sure they are all held accountable when "the truth" really does surface.

I think if for example an astronomy program detected alien life, the public in general would become a lot more accepting of the idea that we might have already made alien contact and a lot more aggressive in trying to find out what the government knows and holding the government or other "cover up" organisations to account.

And that process might not end well for the people involved in covering up. It would probably have quite a serious impact on the publics trust in government as well.

At least if they come clean now they get to have more control over the narrative rather than let events overtake them.

But they don’t want to be honest about it . This isn’t the gov trying to bring it to the open. It’s retired and ex mil, ex employees and now Congress are willing to hear it , then it can be demanded to know the truth of the files if congress request after hearing evidence.

But those that have wanted it secret still do. Best if we don’t know I think. I don’t believe they’re a threat or we’d already know. Perhaps with their tech they made life here possible and want to help us stop destroying it. Who knows!
But you can see why those in the know would rather have it kept secret - maybe they want the tech for themselves, maybe they don’t want mass panic. But now we have a culture of not keeping quiet anymore so those that no longer are contracted to keep quiet can speak out so they are and for the first time Congress are willing to listen.

Maybe they’ve been seeing since the beginning and this is where religion started from, ancestors calling them Gods - all fascinating but my inner being says we won’t be told anything of substance anytime soon if ever. Those that are trying hard now to won’t get far with it.

According to the best experimental data we have, we only actually know what 5% of the universe actually is made of !

95% is dark matter and dark energy. Although there are plenty of theories, no-one actually knows what that is !

It's probably the second biggest question in modern physics.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planck_(spacecraft)

According to the team, the Universe is 13.798±0.037 billion-years-old, and contains 4.82%±0.05% ordinary matter, 25.8%±0.4% dark matter and 69%±1%dark energy.[28][29][30] The Hubble constant was also measured to be 67.80±0.77 (km/s)/Mpc.

Yes, this, but much better explained!

Morning…..

Am so glad this is still going - every post is really interesting.

I’ve just read the Spectator article and think it’s pretty spot on.

With regard to psychosis, and possible “contagion” amongst TPTB involved in this in the US, well, I guess anything is possible.

And one of the things that gives me chills is the possibility that not only can our perception “fail” organically but enough manipulation and coercion from outside sources can achieve the same result.

The article writer mentioned de-stabilisation as a theoretical goal of disseminating the information being pushed out at present.

Thinking about the last three years, economic instability has become the norm, the job markets are de-stabilising because of the speed of technological advancement, we have a constant low level threat of nuclear war because Ukraine……not to mention the ever increasing divisions in society, and of course climate change.

Historically individual states in this sort of situation have gratefully accepted any change of regime that offers a bit of peace and security, at least for a time…. some regimes come with strings attached not obvious until the contract has been sealed.

Now that the entire world is feeling the pinch, how would the offer of a solution or - ahem - new world order be presented? Would it be united politicians and corporate entities offering protection and mediation in the face of our alien overlords? While I think the majority of people nowadays would in general not trust our shambolic leaders, it might be a case of better the devil you know….

I mean, it’s been done to death in fiction and films, and truth is often stranger than fiction.

Maybe they’re all just jerking our collective chains of course. Testing to see where we’re at psychologically on the “batshit bingo card” and what further tweaking can be done to keep us in line and productive, do we need an adjustment in the bread and circus department perhaps?

Or maybe it’s aliens?

At this point, I’m adopting a position of amused detachment and observation…. what a time to be alive……

But they are still human with the limits of human intelligence. Think how far intelligence/sentience has evolved since the beginning of life.

It would be like comparing humans to ants.

Aliens are alien and have alien motivations. I can think of a few.

Maybe because they like going to places and its trivial in terms of effort for them to do so. After all, humans like doing the same. We much prefer to tour a place rather than than seeing it on TV or via photos. back in the 1800s no tourists went to Australia because it was too hard. But once the tech became possible lots of people want to go there. My guess is if we invented the teleport even more would go.

Maybe the UAP we see are robotic spacecraft/probes via remote control and actually have no aliens in them. Some parts of the conspiracy to cover up may be false for example the existence of alien technology UAPs may be true, but the retrieval of alien bodies within them may be false.

Maybe it does indeed take a long time to get here, and they do that via being capable of being extremely long lived and suspended animation. In that case they would have to be here in person to process information in real time.

Maybe they feel there is a huge psychological gain to be had over us by being here in person and negotiating face to face. After all, coming face to face with an alien would be a lot more scary than negotiating over a tv screen.

Certainly, if I was designing a survelliance program for an alien planet, it wouldn't involve me zipping around in space ships on that planet if I had high technology. I would probably do it via remote control probes, and have a local base out of reach where I would control operations. All the zipping around prodding the natives would probably be inefficient and quite dangerous.

Er, didn’t we used to call that “god”…humans have always had the need to believe in something bigger than themselves.
would be interesting to know if all the folks invested in alien encounters on earth carry the vesicular monoamine transporter 2 (VMAT2) gene 🤷🏼‍♀️

Yep, get all this. But still doesn’t answer question of why they’d bother rock up in person? See my later post.

1 last point

as previous poster has already stated, the chances of sentient life forms developing on a plant is around 1 million to 1 planets (Go back for math and this has been determined by astrologists specialising in looking for life forms)

the chances of people having , even temporary, psychotic episodes is 100 to 1 people

which is the stronger probability?

psychosis , if you’ve ever had unfortunate experience to know someone whose had an episode or experienced it yourself, is not someone being completely and obviously insane. Delusions , hearing voices, visual hallucinations are all very real, and the brain perceives it in same way as it does external sensory stimulation. Often delusions are based on some sort of real experience or issue - just like when we dream our dreams are influenced by our days encounters and experiences . Clearly something would have triggered pschosis (stress, sleep deprivation , infections are all common causes) and then something they experience can trigger a delusion. That person doesn’t believe that thing happened. The saw that thing, they heard that thing, they KNOW it to have happened. Our brain has processed the information in the same way.

I think re science there are a lot of unknowns still. Although general relativity and quantum mechanics have been remarkably successful in describing many of the things we see, we still don't have an idea of how gravity works at a microscopic scale (theory of quantum gravity).

As regards describing how the universe works at a macro scale, there are still some large unknowns there. For example we know extra mass is needed to explain the macroscopic behaviour of galaxies, but for whatever reason we cannot detect this mass. We've invented terms like dark energy and dark matter but we still do not know what they actually are - these are some of the most important outstanding questions in modern physics.

I think the second point I would make is aliens are alien ! They don't necessarily have the same life span as us, or may have genetically engineering themselves with advanced technology to have much longer lifespans. They may also have suspended animation technology, so a 50 year trip for an alien that can live for 5,000 years and spend most of those 50 years asleep would not be so implausible.

I think the point about watching the sky is an interesting one. There are a lot of science experiments around these days that are making increasingly sensitive observations of the universe, not only in micro terms (like for example JWST) but macro terms (for example Kepler, TESS and soon PLATO). We also have a lot of longer wavelength observatories (millimeter arrary and square kilometer array) coming on line. We've seen some interesting stuff so far that we have thought might have been aliens (for example KIC 8462852) but nothing definitive. With instruments like JWST we do have the ability to study exoplanet atmospheres, but the signals from the sorts of planets that we think might have life are quite low and difficult to resolve, and wouldn't prove, more like strongly hint, that there could be alien life present on a planet. I think that we are increasingly our ability to study the sky both at specific points and statistically at a huge rate, so if there is something out there, the probability we will find it is increasing rapidly.

Something that links into the sky watching is the development of earth bound sensor technology. Over the past 20 years or so there has been a massive increase in both the number and the technology of sensors. Both for military and civilian use. Now a significant fraction of the population carry high resolution cameras at all times (even though it is often difficult to take good pictures under challenging conditions). Military sensors observe at multiple wavelengths simultaneously and have the ability to track targets and record data. CCTV and infra red detection cameras are everywhere. What is the consequence of this ? Well I believe that one of the main consequences in terms of UAP is that if there is something out there, the probability that sooner or later someone is going to get really good pictures of it is increasing rapidly. It's no longer really possible for the military to blame a sighting on a weather balloon, or too many beers the night before like they did back in the 1990s, because the evidence is all there on six different sensors and all digitally recorded.

I think IF (and I have no idea whether there is a cover up or not) there is a military body out there censoring data or trying to cover up the existence of aliens the existence of this ever increasing sensor technology (either military, civilian or from the astronomy community) poses some real issues and potentially serious consequences for them if this technology offers up something that they cannot plausibly deny, and may provide a motivation for why they might want the whole "alien question" to become a lot more mainstream.

Another question to all those thinking aliens are rocking up here

why? Just observing because interested ? Why would you invest so much of your own planets resources and sentient life forms in a few day outs to the earth zoo . You’d first be using all this amazing technology you have to identify that this small planet, in small solar system has sentiment life forms from the comfort of our own planets armchair, (even we can detect that and are searching actively for the tell tale traces of sentiment life) . you’d then, after years of research perhaps risk sending an unarmed craft to explore just in case said planet had sentiment life forms that were a tadge aggressive and blow your craft up at huge loss of resources . You’d certainly not , even at speed of light, be sending aging aliens on a journey to be potentially annihilated, when unmanned equipment or astrological observation can provide same information

or is it because they’re invading ? Because they are colonists or after resources? So, our planet is already in an aging solar system . The sun is about half way through its life cycle before it first turns to giant and annihilates all plants, before imploding into a dwarf and probably a black hole. This planet is currently inhabited by sentiment beings, and even without visiting in person they’ll be pretty easily able to tell we’ve used up most of our planets natural resources and have done a pretty good job on setting it on a pathway to uninhabitable.
but out there in the universe, there are potentially billions of other exoplanets in the “ sweet spot” to support life. Planets orbiting younger suns, planets with a barely evolved life forms in form of single cell organisms or bacteria, still millions of years away from evolving into sentiment beings.
so, here’s aliens decisions: do we invade this aging and somewhat battered and resource depleted planet who have potential to put up a good fight that will make invasion a tadge messy. Or shall we just pop over to that other younger world, no war needed, pristine and resources unblemished, and just deal with a few scary bacteria and single cell organisms

oh, decisions , descions 🤔….

There have been claims of UFO sightings for a long, long time. What there haven't been is public congressional hearings discussing sightings and government cover-ups. That's weird.

This Spectator article discussing the phenomena of elected US govt officials openly discussing this is interesting https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/ufos-or-not-something-is-up/

Grusch, the guy who is reporting the crashed craft, the recovered bodies is only reporting second hand info. But for his position he would come across as a bog standard conspiracy theorist. He seems genuine. Is he being duped, and if so, for what purpose?

@Dotjones

Great post! I agree with you. The length of time that humans have been capable of recognising alien contact is a blink of the eye (or not even) in the existence of the universe.

Look how people reacted to Covid....

Of course people reacting like that to Covid! That was the message & logically that should have been the message. How else do you "control" millions of people?!

Really interesting thread, made for excellent reading when I woke up in the middle of the night.

So, you want to debate how Steven Hawkins, Schrödinger, Einstein, Bohr, newton, Hubble, Ptolemy, Arno Penzias, Robert Wilson ( physics not embryos), Huygens, Messier, Annie cannon, Shapley, frank Drake, and all this worlds theoretical physicists and astrophysicists lacked the ability to contemplate or imagine our universe in all its possibilities to build are accumulated knowledge of universal laws of physics and chemistry?
rock on.

I think personally there’s a lot of merit in the post you’re replying to there. Sure, we have had some great minds give their thoughts on this subject, but it may be that we are simply far less intelligent and developed as a species to even start to understand what’s going on, kind of like trying to explain the nuances of Shakespeare to a hamster- it’s just not equipped to even recognise the difference between the letter A and B let alone how even words are formed, and there still an awful long way to go after that.

So we may have a very long way to go. Think of our understanding of nuclear physics just a few hundred years ago (blink of an eye in cosmic terms) and it was effectively zero.

Given the distances involved I think any alien life would have to be so far beyond our current intelligence that’s it’s not really possible for us to get anywhere near the true answers on this.

Many people will not contemplate existence of aliens. We’ve been conditioned to ridicule the very idea. Confirmation that they exist would be huge, and would be shocking to a great many people.

I disagree, I think a lot people don't believe in the green man abducting you to shove something up you a hole but many accept other life could be out there.

Nonsense.
If aliens (of a supervising/human type) exist why is it any different than yesterday? Or the last few thousand years? If they've always existed what's the issue? What's the panic?
Clearly there is no threat so I'd carry on assuming that..

So, you want to debate how Steven Hawkins, Schrödinger, Einstein, Bohr, newton, Hubble, Ptolemy, Arno Penzias, Robert Wilson ( physics not embryos), Huygens, Messier, Annie cannon, Shapley, frank Drake, and all this worlds theoretical physicists and astrophysicists lacked the ability to contemplate or imagine our universe in all its possibilities to build are accumulated knowledge of universal laws of physics and chemistry?
rock on.
or are you a noble prize winning theoretical physicist , quantum physicist or astrophysicist so are speaking about your own inability to imagine and contemplate ? In which case please elaborate and educate us.
yep, there are infinite things we don’t know - but that is a big jump to stating “ “because we simply can’t ( imagine or contemplate )”
🤦‍♀️

I have to admit I had a chuckle at the comment on page one that "there's trillions of other planets out there." Yes it's technically correct but underestimating it significantly. It's the same as saying there are "dozens of other planets" - there are but it grossly understates the number. Quadrillions, quintillions, sextillions, septillions - none of them come close to reflecting the real number.

I think it's almost certain their is other life in the universe. 99.9% (recurring) sure. There's always an element of doubt because until we have proof we have to allow for the very slim possibility there isn't.

People make many mistakes in falsely equating our current lack of proof as meaning we are alone. One, the distances are huge. Two, life is likely to exist in many places, so there is no specific reason for an alien species to happen to visit us.

Three, think about how old this planet is. Humans have only existed for a tiny proportion of our planet's existence. For most of our history we wouldn't have recorded alien visits anyway. Further, it's only in the last century or so that we've been sending and receiving radio messages. Any messages targeted at us would have gone unanswered. Messages we've sent will take millenia to reach other civilizations and their responses will take millenia to come back. Assuming we can understand each other and the other civilization is at a point where they can and want to reply. Large areas of our planet are still empty and aliens could visit undetected. Yes we have radar and so on, but think about missing flight MH370 - we couldn't even track a plane reliably when it veered off course. A plane we knew existed and one which complied fully with our knowledge of physics.

It's remarkably unlikely that an alien race would decide to visit this planet in this solar system in this galaxy in this part of the universe at this point in time.

Let's make some sweeping and inaccurate assumptions. Suppose 1 in 10 planets are capable of supporting life. Of those 1 in 10 will actually develop life. Of those 1 in 10 will develop intelligent life. Of those 1 in 10 will exist for a few hundred thousand years without being wiped out by disease or asteroid impact or natural disaster. Of those 1 in 10 will have a civilization that evolves to the point of taking its first steps in space travel. Of those 1 in 10 will develop the capability to travel vast distances in space. We've already whittled 1 in 10 down to 1 in a million, and the real numbers would be much less than 1 in 10.

Life almost certainly exists out there but intelligent life which has the capability and interest in contacting us is likely to be extremely rare. We've never travelled beyond the moon. Next up is Mars. It will be a very long time before we would be capable of visiting another solar system, let alone cast the net much wider.

Many people will not contemplate existence of aliens. We’ve been conditioned to ridicule the very idea. Confirmation that they exist would be huge, and would be shocking to a great many people.

Add into that possible other factors, some believe that aliens had a hand in developing Homo sapiens, some believe there has been alien interaction with governments - a fairly well known story is that aliens gave humans the option of providing information about free energy, therefore protecting the planet and allowing humans to have much easier lives, but that this was turned down because governments and elites make too much money from energy consumption. All very conspiracy theory and easily dismissed as bonkers, but who knows? What if this were true? Can you imagine the resulting fallout?

Well of course the public will panic. If the mainstream public believe the government's will protect them and we are 'safe'.It would lead to mass destabilisation.
Look how people reacted to Covid....

I personally think we are being prepared for the big reveal. Governments cannot hide this anymore. So something big is going to happen shortly. They know thar the mass general public will go into full scale panic mode. Can you imagine the hysteria on here!

What would be the big reveal? that aliens do exist? Will that really can mass panic?

I highly recommend the book Above top secret by Timothy Good. This contains factual statements from military personnel going back to the 1950s.

I personally think we are being prepared for the big reveal. Governments cannot hide this anymore. So something big is going to happen shortly.
They know thar the mass general public will go into full scale panic mode.
Can you imagine the hysteria on here!

UFOs may be not be extra terrestrial, they may be here anyway but in another dimension or operating at a frequency that means they are mostly undetected.

Reports of the speeds and manoeuvrability of crafts spotted means that, if they do exist, they are using technology that we do not have, so space travel may not need the massive amounts of energy that we would need with our current technology.

Theories suggest anti gravity technology, some suggest there being deliberate alignment and manipulation of frequencies (which is interesting considering quantum physics discoveries).