Sudden act of aggression

This might sound like I am making excuses - which I am not - but something similar happened with my Dad (although thankfully no violence) he suddenly became really really angry often and couldn’t see why anyone had a problem with it.

To cut a long story short - after forcing him to visit the GP and explaining the sudden change in behaviour, it turned out it was a neurological issue.

Like I said, not making excuses but sudden changes in behaviour can be medical. I would monitor and act accordingly.

Obviously the most important thing is keeping your children (and yourself) safe and I hope you can do that.

Its abuse

Once this line is crossed, it’s easier to cross again, like any domestic violence.
Don’t listen to his point of view, he’ll be creating a narrative to make it easier on himself and perhaps justify his actions.
I was abused by the father, I can still remember the powerless and fear I felt when he took out his aggression on me.
It really is a big deal.

When my son was 14 he was being very annoying to me and his younger sibling, I was shouting at him and he took no notice of me, his dad, who never raised a hand to either of them had just about had enough, he grabbed hold of my son quite abruptly and really lost it (only shouting) with him, my son was so shocked that he wet himself!
I was fuming with my husband and told him that if he ever did anything like that to my son again that would be it.
Forward 26 years, my son is 40 now and his dad always says that this incident was his biggest regret ever, he will never forget it and it still plays on his mind!
I'm just trying to say that even the mildest person has a breaking point but it doesn't mean that his behaviour will be repeated!

Tbh I dont know why in a thread about a young girl we have a poster determined to centre boys....

Thanks for sharing that @Comfortablechairs .

Recent study University College London (2021)
Boys are more likely to be smacked than girls in childhood.

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/ioe/news/2021/jan/smacking-young-children-has-long-lasting-effects

Violence Dictionary Definition:

behaviour involving physical force intended to hurt, damage, or kill someone or something.

He did not intend to hurt his daughter. This is not violence.

I occasionally lost it with my kids when they were small and everyone was tired and it was the end of a long hot day. I'm not proud of myself but I would have been devastated if my then husband decided to divorce me and split a whole family up on the basis of that one time. Talk to your Dh and explain how it's made you feel. Monitor things and if they don't improve then make a decision based on that.

But what was the violence? There have been hundreds of posts and I don't think we know what actually happened.

I don't think there has been any addition to what was put in the first post. If there has and I have missed it, then this post is probably a waste of time. Apologies in advance.

All i think we know is he lost it, grabbed hold of her and pulled her across the room.

Dragging a small child across a room could be horrendously violent or it could be an exaggerated description where a hand is placed on the arm of a misbehaving 10 year old child with the intention of ushering her upstairs. It might appear more violent if the child pulled her arm away, banged her arm in the process and pretended she was far more hurt than she was.

So perhaps ask yourself some questions about the violent incident. Such as: how far did he pull her? How did he grab her - did he place a hand on her arm or did he yank her across the room? What did the OP mean when she said he lost it - was that simply because he grabbed her or was it because he was screaming and threatening? How was the 5p sized bruise actually caused? Did the child react and pull away - which I wouldn't blame her for? Did the child exaggerate her injury - which I would blame her for.

I think if we had seen the incident there would be less disagreement. But I suspect we are all imagining different things and that is colouring our criticism or occasional exoneration of the father.

That's not how I live at all

You have assumed because you don't agree with me saying this is a violent act and the child should be protected that I see danger everywhere, that I need therapy. I am trying hard not to get too involved in a debate about me because this thread is about in innocent child. But please can you just stop with the hyper vigilance etc? I don't agree with violence and I can't work out why you are so keen to suggest I have flaws because of it.

@flagpie hyper-vigilance is not a negative thing, no. I have it myself. It can be very useful but therapy helps to see it for what it is. It can curtail your enjoyment of life if you allow it. You end up seeing danger everywhere and you don't want to leave your home.

As much as I have suffered at the hands of violent men, I can't get behind the 'LTB' as a first reaction by some on here. Only the OP knows if she is being truthful by stating there have been zero red flags before this incident. The sensible answer is to talk and state it must not happen again.

totally over dramatic.

Okay then. In which case I stand corrected apparently modelling domestic abuse to a girl will cause her to become an abuser and will cause a boy to become a victim of abuse despite many studies to the contrary.

Doesnt really change my point though. The poster was asking if physically aggressive behaviour was okay for boys if we had said it was bad for girls. I said it was bad either way.

That was my point and Im bored of the nitpicking now. I get the impression you wont be happy unless I say that girls and women are just as likely to be violent as boys and men. And thats not true. But being agressive to boys and girls is equally bad.

Urgh. A GROWN man - obviously

It's coming across as hatred of men because you don't seem to be capable of judging different situations. A man is involved = violence = LTB. That's too severe. Sounds like hyper-vigilance to me.

You can call it what you like but when a brown man is dragging a child across a room I will absolutely judge that as a situation where the child needs an adult to protect them )which is the advice I gave btw, not LTB. It's not me saying it's violent because a man did it. It would be just as bad if a women had done it. But she didn't. He did. Do I can only attribute this act of violence to that one man. That is me judging the individual situation.

This 'hyper vigilance' you keep throwing at me? It's not the negative you think it is if it means protecting a child for violence. I don't agree I'm being hyper vigilant at all though. Juts sensible.

No-one is defending 'violent' men here. You thinking they are is worrying.

There are many people on this thread defending the action of a violent man.

Here is what I'd do:

• tell him if he displays aggression to the children or you again, he will have to leave.

• it isn't enough to reassure you that 'it won't happen again'. Unless he makes a tangible effort to understand why he lost control, he will have to leave

• your first responsibility is to your kids because they can't protect themselves. Unless he engages in therapy to understanding why he reacted with aggression to regular child behaviour,, it's over

• you also need to know if he is using alcohol or any drugs such as codeine or something stronger. Don't assume you'd notice (speaking from bitter experience)

Your stats about males as victims are wrong. It is much higher than 4%. There are many reports on domestic violence. Domestic violence is not actualy just men as perpetrators and women as victims at all. That is a bandied about thing on social media but not reflected in actual studies.

I was speaking in very very general terms

96% of abusers in domestic abuse situations are men.

Therefore 96% of victims are women.

So statistically if parents are modelling aggressive behaviours as standard to children I am going to be more concerned that the girls will become victims of abusive relationships and the boys will become the perpetrators of them. Because studies and statistics tell me thats more likely.

That doesn't mean I dont care about the 4% of male victims and the 4% of female perpetrators.

But there is a theme as the poster I was replying to brought up that physical chastisment to boys is okay in a way it isnt to girls. But in my mind its just as bad.

You are basing "my views" off one post in reply to one poster and assuming that I don't know real life is more nuanced than that.

And I have never ever said that boys cannot be victims. I have in fact said the opposite of that in the post you were just replying to.

I just disagree with your view that boys / men can't be victims, they can only be abusers-in-training.

Have you talked to him about how your dd is going to listen to you and get to bed when asked? He realised he over reacted but it sounds like this is an ongoing problem, your own dc not doing what they should be doing ?

It's coming across as hatred of men because you don't seem to be capable of judging different situations. A man is involved = violence = LTB. That's too severe. Sounds like hyper-vigilance to me.

No-one is defending 'violent' men here. You thinking they are is worrying.

Because a girl being subjected to violent behaviour by a man may think men being violent is normal

And a boy being subjected to violent behaviour by a man may think that men being violent is normal

Only one of them is going to grow up to be a man though.

Studies have found that women who were abused as children are twice as likely to be domestically abused as adults.

And studies have found that boys that have been abused are more likely to become abusive with their partners in adulthood than those who have not been abused.

Now in both cases it could go a different way. As I said my mum was abusive so I am well aware women can be abusive and I am also aware that men can be victims of domestic abused.

But I was speaking in general terms not specific terms, the the senarios I presented where the more likely ones.

Either way my point is still relevant despite the nitpicking. Modeling physically abusive behaviours to boys and girls can cause problems for them in adult relationships.

There's a thread running about a teenage DS who shoved his mum, she banged into a wall and got a black eye. Plenty of posters saying "but he didn't give her a black eye"

Just for context

He was 100% wrong and it must never happen again.

For DD - there is a time when sbmnack goes in the bin. And that is it. Make a rule, agree a consequence with her and DH. That is all.

But there is to be no more violence