Children's intelligence level

People skills and social skills get you further in life than purely academic.

More often, incredibly intelligent people lack common sense or ability to socialise with people of differing backgrounds. If someone can navigate social interactions with people from different walks of life, a chameleon I suppose, they’ll get further. Respecting people, being kind to people, are all very good traits.

Grades do not equate to financial success. People who think they are superior because they got good grades often lack the social element I mention before as social awareness is lacking.

I am relatively intelligent. However I’m not naturally book smart. I was always quite lazy at school and coasted. My sibling is incredibly incredibly smart and intelligent, far more so than me. Reads a book once and retains it. I had to work at it.

I now earn around £150k per year. I only got 1A and mostly B/C at GCSE. My emotional intelligence is high. I can read people well and adapt to most situations very well. I am incredibly resilient to change. I’m determined so when life throws me lemons, I stand up and figure out a solution. None of this is learnt from books.

If they have other traits beyond being able to sit an exam, encourage that. It sounds like they are gifted in many other ways.

With respect, I would also reflect internally at yourself and why you feel the way you do. Do you feel you look down on others you deem to be of lower IQ and judge them for it, so worry your kids will suffer that same fate? That’s on you, not them. You need to consider changing your own behaviours and feelings, not feeling disappointed in them. Kids will carry that with them. You may not feel you’re making it obvious and known to them, but you likely will be without realising it.

The world would be a boring place if we were all the same. We should celebrate differences and not consider those less than us because they aren’t the same as us. Everyone has something to offer, it’s whether people recognise that or support them in delivering it.

aaah this story makes me happy.

My dad got expelled from school. he has a PhD as an educational psychologist and was a head teacher. What's hilarious is that he did not actually know he had been expelled. His parents told him that they were moving him to somewhere more suitable and it only came out he was actually expelled when I was in my teens. He was completely floored!

@nobodysdaughternow your post is sad so I wanted to acknowledge it - it’s clear that significant additional needs is very different to merely just not being that academic. Wishing you and your family well.

That's really interesting. Eating in front of the TV (or using screens) must be much more common now than in the pre-digital era - certainly it rarely happened in my childhood - I wonder when the research was from?

This is not accurate at all for current generations. I struggled through high school, barely got my GCSEs to an acceptable level and never done uni.
Now I am leading a department (at 32) and earning about £90k net.
I am successful, gritty and a respected professional

By the way, success isn’t just measured by the £££ amount and life is more than just work. Not to mention being a decent human…

My sister and I were I high achievers in school and told we had high IQs. She and her husband make over €100k. Constantly getting promotions and recognition. They are the most miserable people I know and by extension, their lovely lovely children also have a miserable life.

I chose a sporty/physical job,make good money but not nearly as much as they do obviously, my partner has a trade and makes good money, we are miles happier and it shows.

That's not to say there are not plenty of intelligent, high earning, happy people out there! It just means that IQ and income have fuck all to do with it.

I think you are over thinking that their abilities now is how they will be for the rest of life but this is simply not true. With love, self determination, support and guidance they can be a high earner or be successful in what road they go down.

For example I have had a very privileged up bringing, privately educated from 4-18, very good GCSE, Alevels ect…. Wanted to be a pathologist but I didn’t get into the medical course and university I wanted so I didn’t go, I went to be a professional dancer and travelled and competed internationally sponsored by bank of mum and dad and now I’m a SAHM. DH brought up in poverty, expelled from 2 primary schools, hated high school, left at 15 but came back to try get a few GCSE’s which he never actually knows if he passed as he never went to pick them up! Mean while his little sister was on drink and drugs at 13/14, Somehow they both changed by the time they were 21 and now my DH at 40yrs old is a director of an international stockbrokers earning £175k + £90k bonus + car + private health. When I met him 11 years ago he was on £34k so big difference!
His sister is now high up in a well know bank.

So don’t judge or worry what they are now on what they will and can be! Xx

Anyway it’s not all about IQ!

Get a fucking grip

I wonder how they ended up with an average IQ.

Oh OP I know exactly how you feel! I am academically bright and sailed through school and exams etc. Didn't go to uni through choice but took graduate level professional qualification through my employer, back in the days when you could still work your way up. (I also left home and bought a house at 21, on a fairly basic salary - it was doable then).

DH is not academic. He didn't like school, but back then you could still make a good living through hard work. He stayed at home and saved up until we met and married in our 30s, so financially we are very comfortable. He also bought a house but rented it out. I doubt anyone could do the same these days.

Our DC take after him. I struggled when they were young as they weren't interested in reading, whereas I always loved books. They also have no innate curiosity, and weren't interested when I tried to show them interesting (to me) things in the world. They are now teenagers and still fairly middling academically. One has ASD and ADHD and although he tries hard, he just doesn't get stuff. The other probably has ADHD as well, and is dyslexic, but also has little attention to detail and rushes stuff.

Like yours - both my DC are amazing and have so many wonderful skills, I'm so proud of them and wouldn't (ideally) change a thing. But I do worry about their futures.

They are never going to go to uni, and won't get highly paid jobs that way. I do feel sad for missed opportunities, but it is what it is. My biggest concern is that you need a huge salary to get on the housing market these days! However, you can earn more nowadays as a tradesperson than in many other jobs. So maybe an electrician or plumber etc. Although I'm not suggesting those are in any way 'easy' jobs and still require training and qualifications.

But DD at least would love to leave home and do what was possible in the past - live in a city and have fun and rent a place, probably shared, and experience life! I've had to explain that's unlikely to be an option these days - I gather you can't even find a rental let alone afford it. It's so restrictive nowadays.....

(I'm thinking she could maybe do a ski season or tourist guide thing - she's very personable. It's not as though she'd be losing the chance to get on the housing ladder here, and she could have fun while developing all sorts of skills.....)

It's a hard time to be a parent, whatever your children's abilities are. It was just easy back in the day to say 'work hard and you'll be fine'. I assume in 50 years time things will have balanced out - but at the moment, I can't see a good future for many of our kids. Even the bright ones with degrees can't all get decent jobs with a decent salary - it's so depressing.

Sorry - that's all a bit of a moan without being supportive in any way - but I understand where you're coming from...... Let's hope things work out well for our wonderful DC, through some miracle!

Being personally happy also matters - your life is for you to enjoy as well as serve - and that is usually enhanced by having a decent income. The OP is just asking for thoughts on helping her kids navigate life.

THERE are

I think it’s completely normal for academically inclined parents to be both startled and worried when their kids (particularly when it’s both/all their kids) don’t turn out the same way. It’s true that academic ability is one route to success and it may not be open to them as it was for you.

However, their are plenty of other routes, especially for children as you describe yours (middling able, emotionally intelligent, funny). Focus on helping them work to their strengths, and let your expectations go.

@StepAwayFromGoogling I really need to track down that paper, but from what I remember they emphasised "eating dinner not in front of the telly" although more modern research might talk about "eating dinner without looking at phones". They were certainly strongly implying that it was about regular conversations developing communication and thereby (going down a bit of a Vygotskian path) critical thinking.

There are almost certainly lots of factors at play, and the direction of causality is not obvious. I think for many children the unit of currency which matters most to them is their parents time, so investing lots of that at a young age will also build up emotional security which leads to lots of related positives.

Being lucky enough to be in a family where "family time" is important and there being enough time and money to enable such a routine is likely to correlate with lots of other factors which contribute to a child's "success" however we choose to measure it.

OP I would try not to worry. Decades in the workplace (professional services, well paid industry) has proven to me that the most successful people - in terms of both finances and also happiness - are rarely the most intelligent. EQ and people skills are more important. Sometimes high IQ gets in the way and is more likely to lead to anxiety and stress.
I was great at school, academic, bright. I haven't been all that successful in a work sense. Ex did poorly at school - but earns well over £200K.

Agree with PP that confidence and attention is the most important factor in child success (this is what expensive and academic schools offer that gives kids a helping hand up, as much as academic elements of paid education)

@mathdoc - really interesting. I can see why reading at bedtime would be a differentiator but why eating as a family? Is it because families talk at dinner and that encourages communication and critical thinking (dependent on subject matter!)?

YABU, because you really can’t know how it’ll go. They could’ve been really bright, but bone idle, so then it wouldn’t have mattered anyway.

Most people are middle of the road academically - they’re not all on the breadline!

My DSis had mild learning difficulties, undiagnosed dyslexia and dyspraxia at school. She was always bottom set, barely got any GCSEs. My DPs despaired. Long story short she did an access course, got to university, trained to be a nurse and outearns me. I’m in a good, professional mid management job in financial services with a degree from a Red Brick.

In the modern economy there are so many great jobs that didn’t exist when we were at school - change manager, digital ad agency exec, software developer - lots of people doing these jobs, earning pots of money by getting promoted two or three times up the ladder, and nobody cares if you went to a former poly with DCB at A Level.

Please don’t let your disappointment show to your DC.

Your job is not to make sure your kids are “successful”, whatever that is, it’s to make sure they are ready to make a positive contribution. It’s not about what they can achieve for themselves it’s about what they can offer to others.

You need to adjust your mindset and I mean that kindly.
I’m in my late thirties. I did well at GCSE, abysmally at A level, and dropped out of university. Discovery of boys and alcohol was not helpful!
I found my feet when I started full time work aged 20. I got myself an entry level job at a bank and found that “learning on the job” so to speak actually suited me far better than traditional “academic” learning. I’ve learned a lot from more experienced colleagues and 17 years later I’ve worked up to a pretty senior position, earn a good salary and have a decent pension pot.
More so than my more academic sibling who has a masters degree. Your kids are young, don’t write them off yet. They’ll find their calling. Academia ain’t everything.

Most people are average by definition and do perfectly well.

I know multiple Oxbridge graduates who have never had particularly high flying jobs and then became SAHMs.

I know non academic people who found their passion and are extremely successful in their career.

Success doesn't only come in one form.

I agree. I’m a teacher. If you go on the national literacy foundation page you’ll see lots of stats about what successful, happy people have in common. One of the biggest things is enjoying reading (any type of reading). Qualifications are nothing more than a ticket to the next stage. No one cares if you got ten grade 9s at GCSE in the long run. I interview the high flyers but often (not always) they don’t have the personality and resilience needed for teaching. And now there are so many amazing apprenticeships that honestly, unless my children want a life of academia, I’ll be far more happy if they do an apprenticeship over uni because they won’t come out of it with a lifetime of debt. If they want to go into a trade I’d be happy too. Good tradespeople earn far more than me! The things I care about are that they’re happy, healthy, open minded and kind. If your kids are those things then they’re already making the world a better place 😊And if that doesn’t convince you, I’m one of three (all degree educated) and I have many cousins but three I’m very close to. None of the three I’m close to have degrees, one runs her own business (she has no GCSEs but she’s an awesome self starter with more energy than the Duracell bunny), one’s a very successful professional dancer and one runs his own building company. They’re all financially solvent and very happy, as I and my siblings are. Education isn’t what’s made us happy and successful - having supportive, happy parents (who read to us!!) is what has. Your kids have you - a parent who cares - and loads of strengths - all kids have strengths. Teach them to lean into them.

You have asked for perspective, so here it is:

I have 3 dc. DH and I are both fairly high IQ, both have had well paid careers.

Eldest dc is super smart but has ASD and two very significant life long health conditions. He will need lots of help in life to achieve his potential and manage his health conditions which will ultimately damage his health and most likely shorten his life.

Middle dc has ASD and mental impairment. Will never live independently and requires almost ft care which means I can't work.

Youngest dc has ASD and ADHD - getting him into school every day takes everything I have. He is always on the go and very emotional.

We lost our home because I couldn't work. DH had a breakdown and took a pay it of 80K to work a physical job.

We are poor and live mainly on benefits.

My parents were obsessed with IQ, academic attainment and future earnings. They worried because I am dyslexic. In reality, being dyslexic was nothing. It didn't means anything. Having dc with serious disabilities however, has nearly broken me.

Being homeless and no not ever worrying about money

i disagree. It takes away a worry. But for me I’d be happy without it because I’ve been at the worst or can be and I survived.

I take it you mean successful by monetary gains?

I mean don’t you JUST want them to be happy?

that’s all I want for my kids. I don’t care if they have amazing careers. I don’t care how much they earn. I know it’s cliche but I only want them to laugh and to love