To be average but wanting more

@TedMullins, I won't quote the whole thing again, or this will turn into an epsitolary novel! I don't think we're disagreeing with one another, really yours are good questions, and I think that maybe I come at this stuff from slightly different base level. Home was never a safe or pleasant place to be, growing up, and it was so overcrowded that as the eldest I felt pressure to leave asap to leave more room and attention for the younger ones so it didn't take any particular courage to leave, and I knew that if I came back (from university) it would be very much as a visitor who would be sleeping on the sofa.

There was nowhere to retreat to, so I had to just leap.

Stuff that would be entirely normal to your average middle-class person was pretty alien to me, so that 'life plan' of 'education, job, save for a deposit, meet someone, pool deposits, get on property ladder, have children' was nothing I'd expected from life.

Maybe if your childhood is more secure, and you have parents more at ease with the world, it's actually harder to diverge from the 'life plan' because you have a stronger sense of a shared normality?

I don't think I really have a 'Netflix on the sofa' mode, because I grew up without a TV, and in fact only acquired one as a gift (from a colleague of DH's who couldn't believe we didn't have one) when I was in my early 30s -- it's not a natural mode for me. (And the island didn't have electricity, anyway! ) It's not that I never watch TV, it's just not really a thing for me, and I could go weeks without ever switching it on.

I suppose my life is currently more 'mundane' than it's ever been -- we're committed to staying where we live now (moved countries in 2020) till our 11 year old leaves secondary, I have an academic job and write, and am renovating an old house while living in it and planting a small forest on a bit of wasteland, and volunteering, but this is all new to me, so it feels very novel! I'm also making interesting new friends, enjoying living in a city again, and considering a career change. Maybe I'm living other people's 20s in my 50s?

Anyway, apologies for the thread derail, OP. Good luck with whatever you decide.

But anyway, I wasn't planning to write about

Sure, I don’t disagree with most of what you’re saying. Genuinely kudos to you for making such a different life for yourself than the one your parents expected of you. I’m also not a fan of the prescriptive life path and having to hit “milestones” by certain ages, I think it’s only one of many ways to live life and no more valid than starting an off-grid commune if that’s what you’d prefer.

It’s true many people are held back by fear of doing something out of the ordinary, fear of the unknown, adversity to risk, low self esteem, money etc - some of these are easier to overcome than others but I absolutely agree that people should care less about societal expectations and make choices to live the lives they REALLY want. Where I disagree is that that is an easy choice to make, or that life never feels boring or mundane for even the most adventurous people.

Surely even when you were writing a book or working as a journalist in the Middle East or living on an uninhabited island you had days where you finished work and wanted to chill and put your feet up? I used to be a music journalist and got sent on tour with bands to the likes of Mexico, LA and Eastern Europe, but between trips it was literally just a job like any other (that sounds weird to say but that’s how it felt), I’d write my features then want to chill at the end of the day with my pyjamas in front of Netflix. Yes, of course if that’s ALL you ever do with life it’ll feel very repetitive and boring but I really don’t think it’s out of the ordinary, regardless of the kind of life you live.

I think Lykke is articulating something I felt, maybe it's not something there's a great deal of honesty.

I felt exactly like OP at 29. Bored, restless, unsure what next. I got pregnant. That solved it. 🤣🤣

Now looking back I wish I'd had more imagination. Sure, it solved my purposelessness and existential angst. At the price of 20 years and counting of being weighed down by responsibility.

At the time I had no idea what I was letting myself in for. I wonder if there may have been easier ways to solve that restlessness

Exactly!! Having a kid has sure given me a never ending list of things to do… but glorious a sense of purpose hasn’t come with the package!

I have no life because I have kids 😂

@TedMullins, but I’ve never suggested my experience is everyone’s. I’m simply saying that people, especially those not tied down to place and income by child-rearing, can do these things if they like.

No one is going to give you a permission slip. You don’t have to be some unusual individual — I’m from a deeply ordinary, very poor working-class background, with timid, risk-averse parents who had far more children than they could afford or deal with and who encouraged me to leave school at 15 to be a hairdresser, because they didn’t see the point of finishing secondary and thought university was ‘only for rich people’. The minute I said no and insisted on doing A-level equivalents and took myself off to be an au pair between school and university (I was petrified and 17, had barely left my home city —neither of my parents had ever left our home country) I was stepping off the ‘normal’ life I was socialised to expect as my lot.

I’m aware this is not everyone’s experience, and that by doing the stuff I’ve done, I’m more likely to encounter others who’ve done similar. I’m also aware that some people would regard my choices as lunatic and would have found the instability of things a strain, let alone living somewhere offshore where my only contact with other people was an infrequent supply boat that often couldn’t come in bad weather.

But equally, the very prescriptive ‘life map’ I see on here (getting on property ladder, marriage, children all supposed to happen at quite specific periods), let alone the number of people who seem to come in from work, get into their pyjamas and watch tv (which I’ve only encountered on here) is a choice. And it’s a choice the OP doesn’t need to continue to make, if she doesn’t want to.

Yeah whats wrong with contentment. I have a DC, I don’t find it particularly fulfilling tbh. My fantasy life is OP’s basically. Theres too much pressure to BE something or be doing something.

@TheSaturdayAfternoonnessOfIt and @greenvelvetgloves I agree with your outlooks. I’ve put a lot of effort into building a comfortable life that is satisfying and fulfilling on a small, day to day scale (and it has to be acknowledged that not having children makes this a lot easier). None of what I do is remarkable, and none of it will survive after me. But so what? It makes me happy, and that gives me the resilience and energy to be a nicer person to be around. I can live with not being the one to save them all this time around.

🤣

TRAVEL

You have a very limited world view then, @Lykke1000

This! Love it.

I don't have children and I can honestly say I don't want an extraordinary life full of living in another country, living on a house boat etc. I want to have a lovely settled life with my husband and have interesting friends and do interesting things.

When we realised we wouldn't have children there was a "what now" moment as we had assumed that would be way our lives had structure etc as we got older. But once we got used to the idea we just got back to living our lives and trying to make sure we are comfortable and aim to have a nice retirement.

Yes. I console myself by thinking of how few people who were famous or successful from 100 or more years ago are still widely remembered today. In 100 years' time, most of the people I might envy now for their success will be forgotten.

You must realise though that this isn’t representative of what most people are doing? I say this as a childfree person in London whose friends are majority childfree too in professional careers.

I’ve just come back from working on a Greek island for a few weeks because my work is remote so I can do it anywhere, in February I went husky trekking in the Arctic and in summer I’ll be city hopping round Europe for a month, I also paint murals for public outdoor spaces and I’m writing a book, but day to day, what does my life look like? Work, home, dinner, walk dogs, sleep! In between the activities it feels mundane. Even being a digital nomad, while a hugely privileged thing to do, doesn’t feel like a constant buzz because while you’re sat by the beach in great weather you’re still working!

It’s easy to talk about stuff and make it sound like every second is exciting and creative but that’s not my, or many people’s, experience of reality. I’m sure you’ll find more people who’ve never run a marathon in the desert or lived on an uninhabited island than those who have, though, and I don’t think it’s really fair to call OP dull because she isn’t doing that.

There are no words. WTF

I'm in my 50's now and I do have a dc, born when I was in my 30's. I had established my career by then and while I love her beyond compare she is not the defining factor of my life.

I think it is a massive mistake to allow your worth to be determined by whether, or not, you have children. There are so many people who allow having children to be the dominant focus in their lives and when the children grow up and move out, their marriages are in trouble and they suffer from empty nest syndrome etc

Equally I think it's patronising for people who do have children to say you must volunteer or open orphanages etc in order for your life to be meaningful. As if those two are equal - having your own kids because that's what you chose to do or charity work. If it wasn't so insulting it would be laughable!

To be happy with the life you're living you must find things that motivate you, inspire you, satisfy you and make you feel alive (and let me tell you, kids can ofte be the opposite of that!)

It could be making and maintaining a nice circle of friends, going on holidays, exploring your country, sea swimming, knitting, art, researching your family tree, taking up a language, learning to dance etc etc

And this is AS true for people with kids as it is for those without imo

When I was that age, I'd spent five years in a job that involved me spending six months a year living overseas and six months in London. Then I took a career break, worked as a journalist in the ME for a year while DP worked there, and then lived for eight months on an otherwise uninhabited island as a caretaker, writing a book. Then I worked in the west of Ireland for a few years, got married and had a baby in London and wrote my first novel. I wasn't unusual among the people I knew -- around the same time, one moved to Iceland on an academic exchange for a couple of years with her family, another was doing ultramarathons in the desert and the arctic and started his own company, one adopted a baby from China and moved back to her native NY after 20 years in the UK, one was living a peripatetic life working as a stage manager for a touring opera company, one (who'd had a baby in her teens) started art school when her daughter finished school and kept body and soul together as a backing musician.

Lots of failure, risks, ideas that didn't come off, moves that were a minor disaster, etc etc, and I'm not saying everyone should aspire to this or anything like it -- just saying that life aged 35 doesn't have to be a matter of job, relationship, gym, holidays, unless you want it to.

These were all deeply ordinary people, too, not from privilege or with a lot of money underpinning them.

This is fab. I always wanted to be an astronaut and always regret not doing astronomy or astrophysics as a degree but I've done some courses now that have made me feel the spark again.

I'm not sure I know any truly 'remarkable' people. I'm going to message the whatsapp groups and tell my family and friends to pull their bloody socks up.

You need to find purpose. Money is not a purpose, once your basic needs are met. Find a passion, a project, and map out how to get there. Most people your age will be busy with small kids in the next few years so you will need for think outside the box indeed.

I think others saying most people are unremarkable are right too. They/we are. Super rich/famous/impactful people are not the norm, that’s why they get more attention and publicity and are seen as aspirational. If everyone was on TV/making scientific breakthroughs/writing bestsellers/trekking jungles then all those things wouldn’t seem remarkable at all.

But if you have time and money you can invest both of those things into doing stuff you enjoy. It’s got to be for yourself though, not external validation.

Kid don’t give you purpose they make it so you don’t have time to recognise that you have no other purpose so aren’t sat there unfulfilled 😂

I remember reading that to find your passion you should try and remember what you wanted to be when you were 10 years old. Wanted to be a champion show jumper? Take some riding lessons. Wanted to be a pop singer? Join a choir. That kind of thing.

What's your plan? What do you enjoy? Do that more.

For me & my other half, if we hadn't had kids. We'd travel. Take time off from work as much as possible doing the things we love the most.

I would have a think and get some plans. Work towards whatever that may be.