Bizarre incident on train...

Redqueenheart · 2022-10-11T17:34:37+00:00

I had a rather unpleasant experience on my way home today on the London tube and I wonder how other people would have reacted. I was sitting in a tube carriage and looking at images and videos I had taken from an art exhibition I visited earlier. Was really tired and just wanted to mine my own business. A man comes in and seats next to me, fidgeting and getting a bit too close for comfort. I ignore him. He then asks me ''What is that?''. I realise he is now looking at my phone and expects me to tell him what the picture I am looking at is. I snap back ''That is my phone and there is something called privacy''. To my surprise two young women who were sitting on the other said of me get involved and say ''that was rude, he was only asking you a question''. At that point I had enough and said something in the line of ''My pictures are private and none of your business'' and moved to a different seat on the other side of the train. Heard the girls snigger but there was no more interaction after that. I really don't get why on earth the guy thought it was OK to barge into my space and then start staring at my phone and demand my attention and why these two women actually thought it appropriate to defend him... Afterwards I did ask myself if this was an attempt to distract me while one them would try to get something from my bag but even as it stands I was absolutely furious about these people's behaviour. I am quite curious to hear how other people would have reacted.

neilyoungismyhero · 08/06/2023 17:26

I think you sounded pretty rude and snooty to be honest, hence the giggles from the 2 women when you moved. If you didn't want to engage with him perhaps you should have just moved earlier. I get he was irritating but you were rude.

MarieIVanArkleStinks · 21/10/2022 12:11

Ahsoka2001 · 19/10/2022 17:36

Wow...this situation warranted 700 replies AND getting into a paper? Must've been a slow news day for them OP. I can't believe people are still commenting on this tbh

I'd forget this sort of incident 2 days after it happened to me

Show quote history

On the contrary, I think it's a very important discussion. The message can't be dinged into women's ears long enough or loudly enough that they do NOT have to sacrifice their own safety, comfort, or reasonable wish to be left alone to go about their business, to the random male stranger who demands their time and attention as his by right.

I had one do this to me just yesterday. Oddly enough I thought he was making a 'witty' quip to his companion, who was standing behind me in a shop, especially given there was no eye contact whatsoever between us and I was completely absorbed in examining products on the shelves.

The next thing I heard was a whole lot of chuntering about 'not very nice ... blah blah blah ... not pleasant ... gah bleurgh yadder'. It wasn't until this sunk in several minutes later, once I'd selected and purchased the items I wanted, that it occurred to me he was passively addressing not his companion but the only other person on the premises; i.e. me. Made me laugh. Must be frustrating unleashing a whole lot of angst on someone whose attention was so entirely elsewhere they were oblivious to his rant.

But the reaction was telling. Women don't owe these entitled men our time or conversation.

EBearhug · 20/10/2022 01:31

Must've been a slow news day for them

It not like anything is happening in politics or anything...

withaspongeandarustyspanner · 19/10/2022 22:43

Well, you're still reading it and still commenting on it... You've posted at least twice saying pretty much the same thing.

ilovesushi · 19/10/2022 22:22

Shame the Mail didn't focus on the personal safety aspect. Whoever recommended 'The Gift of Fear' book upthread, thank you! Will be ordering and sharing with DD.

Ahsoka2001 · 19/10/2022 17:36

Redqueenheart · 19/10/2022 13:59

I can tell you that I am actually appalled that this has appeared in the Daily Hate as I despise everything that paper stands for.

It actually concerns me that journalists can just lift stories from threads like this.

It will make me think twice about posting anything else on Mumsnet.

That's for sure...

Wow...this situation warranted 700 replies AND getting into a paper? Must've been a slow news day for them OP. I can't believe people are still commenting on this tbh

I'd forget this sort of incident 2 days after it happened to me

withaspongeandarustyspanner · 19/10/2022 17:31

@pinkyredrose I'm not sure they did or that they had enough to go on. Lots of people looking the other way or finding it amusing or whatever.

pinkyredrose · 19/10/2022 15:19

withaspongeandarustyspanner · 19/10/2022 14:44

@pinkyredrose yep reported. Gave statements until 3am at the police compound at the festival.

How horrible for you all 😔 Hope they caught the guy.

withaspongeandarustyspanner · 19/10/2022 14:44

@pinkyredrose yep reported. Gave statements until 3am at the police compound at the festival.

GonnaGetGoingReturns · 19/10/2022 14:10

OP - my car is in for it's MOT so I got the bus to the dentist today. Within a few minutes of waiting at the bus stop, a man was speaking to me, but asking me quite personal questions, did I live in X street, or XX street, as he hadn't seen me before. He was elderly but what in the actual F gives him the right to ask these questions with no other preamble as we certainly hadn't met before?!

Original poster

Redqueenheart · 19/10/2022 13:59

I can tell you that I am actually appalled that this has appeared in the Daily Hate as I despise everything that paper stands for.

It actually concerns me that journalists can just lift stories from threads like this.

It will make me think twice about posting anything else on Mumsnet.

That's for sure...

OP posts:

AutumnCrow · 19/10/2022 12:05

Liz1tummypain · 19/10/2022 09:56

Wow! Funny that it's made its way onto the Daily Fail. You couldn't make this stuff up. Or maybe you could.

It's not the only story from MN in the Daily Mail today.

And there's a couple of other threads that are Fail plants if you ask me.

pinkyredrose · 19/10/2022 11:59

withaspongeandarustyspanner · 19/10/2022 06:35

This reminds me of an incident that recently happened. We were at a festival in the summer. A nice festival, family friendly - we've been going for years.

My daughters and a friend we're watching one of the main acts on the Friday night. We were in the crowd, but not with them as they are 15 and 17 and we were with my sons and meeting them at a pre-areangwd time.

Inebriated man in his 40s approaches my youngest daughter. He puts his hand on the back of her neck and says 'I know you want it's. My 15 year old freezes. My 17 year old jumps in and yells at him to leave her sister alone and says she's 14 (for dramatic effect). He says, 'I'm 44 - you never know what might happen'. She yells again that her sister is 14. He looks puzzled and says 'Are you calling me a paedo?'. My daughter confirms that, yes, she is. He has been holding on to my other daughter this whole time, she is still frozen. This carries on for a bit before he moves on, but not before grabbing the breast of their friend. My youngest bursts into tears.

This happens in front of many other families and adults. What did they do? Absolutely fucking nothing.

I don't care if my daughters are considered rude, if they challenge someone, or if they move seats. If they feel uncomfortable, they have been taught to do it. Because, and I see evidence of it in this thread, no one will help them or keep them safe, so they have to do it for themselves.

That's grim as hell! Did you call the police/security or take the guys photo? He should have been arrested.

Liz1tummypain · 19/10/2022 09:56

Wow! Funny that it's made its way onto the Daily Fail. You couldn't make this stuff up. Or maybe you could.

MyrtlethePurpleTurtle · 19/10/2022 08:52

Looks like opinion on this thread is as divided on tbe Daily Mail as here - curious, as normally tbe green arrowed readers’ comments express a uniform view

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-11311235/Woman-called-rude-Mumsnet-telling-man-tube-stop-looking-phone.html

Tillsforthrills · 19/10/2022 06:52

withaspongeandarustyspanner · 19/10/2022 06:35

This reminds me of an incident that recently happened. We were at a festival in the summer. A nice festival, family friendly - we've been going for years.

My daughters and a friend we're watching one of the main acts on the Friday night. We were in the crowd, but not with them as they are 15 and 17 and we were with my sons and meeting them at a pre-areangwd time.

Inebriated man in his 40s approaches my youngest daughter. He puts his hand on the back of her neck and says 'I know you want it's. My 15 year old freezes. My 17 year old jumps in and yells at him to leave her sister alone and says she's 14 (for dramatic effect). He says, 'I'm 44 - you never know what might happen'. She yells again that her sister is 14. He looks puzzled and says 'Are you calling me a paedo?'. My daughter confirms that, yes, she is. He has been holding on to my other daughter this whole time, she is still frozen. This carries on for a bit before he moves on, but not before grabbing the breast of their friend. My youngest bursts into tears.

This happens in front of many other families and adults. What did they do? Absolutely fucking nothing.

I don't care if my daughters are considered rude, if they challenge someone, or if they move seats. If they feel uncomfortable, they have been taught to do it. Because, and I see evidence of it in this thread, no one will help them or keep them safe, so they have to do it for themselves.

That’s shocking but not surprising, thank god your older daughter was there.

Though I’m sure you’ll get some on here saying he may be neurodiverse, just being friendly, just being boisterous due to the alcohol and relaxed surrounding.,..

Tillsforthrills · 19/10/2022 06:50

Can’t believe people are defending the man. He needs to learn that is very unwanted behaviour.

Rosehugger · 19/10/2022 06:45

I agree with you, @withaspongeandarustyspanner but particularly at a festival , even more than in other situations, other people are drunk and relaxed and not on high alert for that kind of thing. Plus they may not see it clearly, wonder what on earth it is they just saw etc. And even if they did may not want to get involved due to fear of - all sorts of things really. But it only goes to reinforce your point that we do have to stick up for ourselves.

withaspongeandarustyspanner · 19/10/2022 06:35

This reminds me of an incident that recently happened. We were at a festival in the summer. A nice festival, family friendly - we've been going for years.

My daughters and a friend we're watching one of the main acts on the Friday night. We were in the crowd, but not with them as they are 15 and 17 and we were with my sons and meeting them at a pre-areangwd time.

Inebriated man in his 40s approaches my youngest daughter. He puts his hand on the back of her neck and says 'I know you want it's. My 15 year old freezes. My 17 year old jumps in and yells at him to leave her sister alone and says she's 14 (for dramatic effect). He says, 'I'm 44 - you never know what might happen'. She yells again that her sister is 14. He looks puzzled and says 'Are you calling me a paedo?'. My daughter confirms that, yes, she is. He has been holding on to my other daughter this whole time, she is still frozen. This carries on for a bit before he moves on, but not before grabbing the breast of their friend. My youngest bursts into tears.

This happens in front of many other families and adults. What did they do? Absolutely fucking nothing.

I don't care if my daughters are considered rude, if they challenge someone, or if they move seats. If they feel uncomfortable, they have been taught to do it. Because, and I see evidence of it in this thread, no one will help them or keep them safe, so they have to do it for themselves.

billy1966 · 18/10/2022 17:44

MarieIVanArkleStinks · 17/10/2022 14:58

Oh, kinell. The blokes have landed.

Because who else would actively encourage women to ignore their innate danger signals and urge them instead to 'just be nice?' What possible motive would anyone have for appearing in droves to tell women off for daring to step outside their box? Who, specifically, stands to benefit from keeping the status quo precisely as it is?

Is it women? Is it fuck.

Well said.

I lost count of the number of times when someone would sit next to me in a half empty train, just for me to immediately get up and move, when I was young.

Thanks to books like "the Gift of fear", I have always listened carefully to my gut.

OP, as a result of this thread I have had the conversation again reminding my daughters to NOT ever feel obligated to be polite to anyone invading their space, to get up and move to another space if they feel even the slightest inkling of their space being invaded, to scream loudly to draw attention to any inappropriate behaviour, and finally to never hesitate to tell any man to fxxk off if he is even slightly inappropriate.

My girls are very nicely brought up young women, it's my job to make sure it doesn't get in the way of them making their safety a priority at all times.

Goosygandy · 18/10/2022 16:40

Redqueenheart · 17/10/2022 15:21

@MarieIVanArkleStinks
''Oh, kinell. The blokes have landed.

Because who else would actively encourage women to ignore their innate danger signals and urge them instead to 'just be nice?' What possible motive would anyone have for appearing in droves to tell women off for daring to step outside their box? Who, specifically, stands to benefit from keeping the status quo precisely as it is?

Is it women? Is it fuck.''

This. Absolutely this.

I completely respect people who said they would have fobbed this man off in a different manner or said something different. Everyone deals differently with situations that made them uncomfortable.

But the ones that are literally attacking me because they think I should always be ''nice'' to men even if they make me feel uncomfortable and who are trying to re-write the story ...I also question their motives.

This thread has so many posts that I could not reply to everyone, but I really appreciate genuine people taking the time to give their feedback.

I think you're right OP.

Who would really feel that invested that they criticise you or other posters in multiple posts insinuating that we're rude, paranoid, unfriendly etc than blokes or handmaidens?

All these friendly northerners that keep popping up after 29 pages to tell us how they'd love to chat to the creepy guy who's invading their space and commenting on their phone. Of course they would. 🙄.

Madamum18 · 18/10/2022 14:04

ToooMuchToDo · 17/10/2022 15:15

Bizarre incident?

Yes, it is bizarre in this day and age that a stranger should dare to strike up conversation with someone and make polite small talk, rather than stare blankly at their screen. Even more bizarre that a man in this day and age should dare to, heaven forbid, speak to a woman.

Bizarre, but sad it is seen as such :(

What!!!!! Manspreading, leaning over, invading space, ....is that now "polite conversation"? Give me strength!!

Shodan · 18/10/2022 09:56

Just a timely reminder to remember to smile on your commute today, ladies,

Actually, give a wild-eyed maniacal grin and start to talking at anyone who ventures remotely near. You'll probably be left alone then...

MarieIVanArkleStinks · 18/10/2022 08:19

GCAcademic · 18/10/2022 08:02

Just a timely reminder to remember to smile on your commute today, ladies, especially to any man sidling up to you. It makes you so much prettier and more polite!

'It might never happen!'

(I'll get me coat ...)

GCAcademic · 18/10/2022 08:02

Just a timely reminder to remember to smile on your commute today, ladies, especially to any man sidling up to you. It makes you so much prettier and more polite!