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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
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16
Datun · 16/04/2026 07:19

TempestTost · 15/04/2026 23:51

I think some build up a fantasy around the surgery, and are probably rather disappointed in the actual results.

i'm sure this is true.

I read an account from a man describing the practically coma inducing orgasms he was having, which was clearly something he'd read. Another said something similar happened to him within hours of surgery, apparently.

Plus the men whose 'gynaecologist' can't even tell they're male?

Little wonder expectations are unrealistically high.

DeanElderberry · 16/04/2026 09:16

JennyShaw · 15/04/2026 12:16

Kristi Noem doesn't just want to 'preserve biological women's spaces'. If you don't accept that trans people are who they say they are then the only alternative is that they are mentally ill or perverts.

Lots of people on Mumsnet would agree with that, but I'm guessing that they're not going to believe that homosexuals are mentally ill or perverts. That's what people used to say about them, that's what the traditional view is, and that's what people like Kristi Noem believes.

Do you think that Kristi Noem would accept someone like Kathleen Stock wearing men's clothes, having short hair and no makeup? She wouldn't accept it any more than she would accept men wearing women's clothing, no matter how much Kathleen Stock might insist there's nothing sexual about it or that she's not trying to be like a man.

Do you think that Kristi Noem would accept Kathleen Stock's marriage to another woman? She is against gay marriage. She isn't going to believe that Stock's lesbianism isn't a paraphilia.

Do you think that Kristi Noem would reject the couple of dozen women I meet at craft group every week, mostly over 60, all with short hair, no makeup, flat shoes, trousers, a variety of tops, some of them off the men's rails (that constant play-off between pockets (positive) and too-long sleeves (negative). Many of them grandmothers.

Does Noem really live in a world where that isn't standard older woman clothes and presentation? Partly because that was standard young woman clothes and presentation 40 to 50 years ago. Not remotely 'dressing like a man'.

JellySaurus · 16/04/2026 09:42

TempestTost · 15/04/2026 23:57

There are really people with abusive mothers.

Two I know had or have daughters that had a trans identification, pretty clearly related to the abuse imo.

One was not directly abusive but draggged the kids around from one abusive man to another, before finally taking them to live with one of them in a two room shack with no indoor plumbing. The other was a narcissist in a codependent violent marriage who told the kids she wished she had aborted them and consistently sabotaged their efforts to do things like get an education or leave home.

I don't think it's crazy to think men might also have effects from an abusive mother.

But not abusive fathers? Boys never adopt a trans identity to escape their father’s toxic masculinity because they’re not aggressive enough for him?

I do not reject that transgenderism - fetishistic or otherwise - can result from the trauma of parental abuse.

DramaAndBullshit · 16/04/2026 11:00

Taztoy · 15/04/2026 14:59

I 100%. Believe that trans people are who they say they are.

the clue is in the trans.

So do I, as you say the clue is in the ‘trans’. So, a trans woman is actually a man, and a trans man is actually a woman.

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 12:38

TinselAngel · 15/04/2026 22:33

Transphobe.

If you think that, that’s fine. That your opinion and you’re entitled to it.

I really don’t care what you think.

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 12:40

JellySaurus · 15/04/2026 22:20

All of them? Are you implying that trans-identifying people are all one amorphous group, all with the same wish and the same motivation? Again, a very naive thing to believe.

Trans-identifying people certainly want something, but what they want varies enormously. Some are afraid, traumatised or confused and are trying to figure out what will make them feel safe and happy. Some want to make society relate to them differently because they believe that this will make them happier, some want to make their bodies look different for the same reason. Some are struggling to come to terms with their sexuality, and need to ‘be’ the opposite sex in order to accept that they are attracted to the same sex. Some are looking for sexual thrills, whether via the way they want to look or to think about themselves, or by the way they can force others to interact with them. Some are outright liars who are trying to get away with criminal behaviour or to serve their sentence in a cushy prison.

I don’t care what their motivation is. It’s irrelevant to me, and I’ll never know if what they’re saying is their driver for it, is the truth. Therefore, I don’t care. It’s irrelevant to me.

murasaki · 16/04/2026 12:43

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 12:38

If you think that, that’s fine. That your opinion and you’re entitled to it.

I really don’t care what you think.

I'm pretty sure she was joking.

As in that's what a lot if trans people would say, they believe you can change sex and to say otherwise is transphobic.

Given it's @TinselAngel , I'm pretty damn sure I'm right.

murasaki · 16/04/2026 12:43

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 12:38

If you think that, that’s fine. That your opinion and you’re entitled to it.

I really don’t care what you think.

I'm pretty sure she was joking.

As in that's what a lot if trans people would say, they believe you can change sex and to say otherwise is transphobic.

Given it's @TinselAngel , I'm pretty damn sure I'm right.

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 12:44

murasaki · 16/04/2026 12:43

I'm pretty sure she was joking.

As in that's what a lot if trans people would say, they believe you can change sex and to say otherwise is transphobic.

Given it's @TinselAngel , I'm pretty damn sure I'm right.

Oh right. As I’ve said before, im autistic so I often don’t get sarcasm or that type of joke.

TinselAngel · 16/04/2026 12:45

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 12:38

If you think that, that’s fine. That your opinion and you’re entitled to it.

I really don’t care what you think.

It’s what the people you are describing would think.

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 12:52

TinselAngel · 16/04/2026 12:45

It’s what the people you are describing would think.

I don’t care - their opinion is irrelevant to me.

GargoylesofBeelzebub · 16/04/2026 15:06

Taztoy · 15/04/2026 14:59

I 100%. Believe that trans people are who they say they are.

the clue is in the trans.

So you believe this middle aged male is actually a 6 year old girl. Right…

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/transgender-father-stefonknee-wolscht-who-left-family-to-be-a-sixyearold-girl-uses-child-s-play-to-escape-adult-life-a6775051.html

murasaki · 16/04/2026 15:09

No, I think she 100% believes they are trans. Not what they are claiming to be, I.e. a man or a woman, but what they actually are, I.e. a man in a transwoman's case. As they are trans and no woman can be a transwoman.

Sorry if I've got that wrong.

Heggettypeg · 16/04/2026 15:21

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 12:44

Oh right. As I’ve said before, im autistic so I often don’t get sarcasm or that type of joke.

Having seen lots of posts by both you and Tinsel I am sure Murasaki is right: Tinsel was just being humorous and actually agrees with you. Tinsel is a woman who has done lots of work supporting women whose husbands transition.

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 15:34

Not at all.

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 15:35

murasaki · 16/04/2026 15:09

No, I think she 100% believes they are trans. Not what they are claiming to be, I.e. a man or a woman, but what they actually are, I.e. a man in a transwoman's case. As they are trans and no woman can be a transwoman.

Sorry if I've got that wrong.

This exactly.

JellySaurus · 16/04/2026 17:06

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 15:35

This exactly.

What does ‘trans’ mean? What does the male prisoner who identifies as trans in order to get a cushier time in a women’s prison have in common with the autistic teenage girl who identifies as trans because she is so uncomfortable with the physical changes of puberty and the sexual attention she’s now getting from men?

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 18:39

JellySaurus · 16/04/2026 17:06

What does ‘trans’ mean? What does the male prisoner who identifies as trans in order to get a cushier time in a women’s prison have in common with the autistic teenage girl who identifies as trans because she is so uncomfortable with the physical changes of puberty and the sexual attention she’s now getting from men?

Trans means they choose to present as the opposite sex. The are not actually that sex and they have no right to access single sex spaces other than those that align with their birth sex.

JellySaurus · 16/04/2026 19:09

So Suzy Izzard is trans, but Eddie Izzard is not? What about Pip Bunce, is he trans on his frock-wearing days, but not on his suit days?

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 19:11

JellySaurus · 16/04/2026 19:09

So Suzy Izzard is trans, but Eddie Izzard is not? What about Pip Bunce, is he trans on his frock-wearing days, but not on his suit days?

Ido not care what they say they are. I believe they are trans, whatever they think that means. I don’t think they should be in any women’s single sex spaces.

if that makes me transphobic I don’t care about that either.

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 19:12

JellySaurus · 16/04/2026 19:09

So Suzy Izzard is trans, but Eddie Izzard is not? What about Pip Bunce, is he trans on his frock-wearing days, but not on his suit days?

Ido not care what they say they are. I believe they are trans, whatever they think that means. I don’t think they should be in any women’s single sex spaces.

if that makes me transphobic I don’t care about that either.

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 19:13

JellySaurus · 16/04/2026 19:09

So Suzy Izzard is trans, but Eddie Izzard is not? What about Pip Bunce, is he trans on his frock-wearing days, but not on his suit days?

Ido not care what they say they are. I believe they are trans, whatever they think that means. I don’t think they should be in any women’s single sex spaces.

if that makes me transphobic I don’t care about that either.

TinselAngel · 16/04/2026 19:40

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 18:39

Trans means they choose to present as the opposite sex. The are not actually that sex and they have no right to access single sex spaces other than those that align with their birth sex.

So drag queens are also trans?

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 19:43

TinselAngel · 16/04/2026 19:40

So drag queens are also trans?

If they want to say they are that’s fine by me. I don’t give a fuck what someone identities as or calls themselves. It doesn’t change reality.

yes dear that’s nice bully for you you think that jolly good. Is my response.

they need to use the services and spaces that align with their birth sex. The rest of it is window dressing and load of who shot John to distract from that.

Taztoy · 16/04/2026 19:46

To be clear. An individual can say they are the man in the moon. I believe that they believe that.

but it doesn’t mean they are, at any time, the man in the moon.

I won’t use compelled pronouns. I’ll use their name, but I won’t use compelled pronouns.

I don’t know why im being so hounded on here for this view. I thought it was pretty GC but it appears not so im stepping back.