Men who affirm TW

[Holdmeclosertinydancer2018]

This is something I've wondered for a while and a post from a woman on FB asking/stating the same thing prompted me to ask everyone's opinions on this.

I have noticed a large proportion of Trans Idealogues on both FB and Reddit go absolutely berserk when someone points out that TW are not, in fact women, but oddly, a large proportion of them are men.

Now I completely understand the women that have bought into this notion as women generally speaking tend to be more empathetic for their fellow human so are more likely to go along with 'be kind'. But what about the swathes of seemingly normal, gender conforming men that support it? I don't know a single man other than one in real life (who's daughter is apparently now a 'she') that support the idea that TW are women. What is their motive for this?

And this is where all the logic crumbles away.

If a male person is 'female' to join a female only group, how do they then have to accept that they are not female enough to access a female changing room, a female rape crisis centre, a female sport or a female prison?

Every single time they are excluded from a female single sex provision, they really are being told that they are not female at all and that everyone is just acting as if they support them for 'some' instances to keep them happy. How does this supposedly improve someone's mental health if they say that the only way they can live happily is if they are accepted as being a 'woman'?

Giving with one hand and then taking away with another is completely undermining that person's belief. Unless that person is fully aware that they are not a 'woman' and therefore why are they then claiming to be a woman?

This only for 'some' instances really does completely highlight the falsity of that person's identity claims. The activists are correct on that. That if a group of people use pronouns and language because they feel it is 'kind' even if they don't believe it, allow a male person to join a female group etc, it is cruel to exclude them from anything else that is female only. Male people with transgender identities have been telling us this for a decade, yet some people are not listening.

It seems that some people feel that they can pick and choose what male people should and shouldn't have access to based on what they, personally, feel is appropriate. And it seems those people feel that is them being kind and reasonable.

Yet, that cherry picking of when is appropriate to support an identity based on subjective reality and philosophical belief and when it is not appropriate is the opposite of kind and reasonable. As trans people themselves have been saying for a very long time now.

I'm sure, but they don't represent mainstream opinion.

Some of the big battles have already been won, and the public is no longer quite so naive or blindly trusting.

The basic battles ( around public consciousness etc) have already been won, now we just have to insist that the law is applied as it should be. There will always be some who cling on to trans ideology - we're never going to change their persepctive.

Then they should be treated exactly as what they are, men in dresses. No access or acceptance of womanhood or to spaces that are for women only. Things would be much easier for everyone if this were the case.

It is my opinion that many of theses men have, in their minds, failed at masculinity and therefore being a man. They appear to be mostly non competitive in nature (which would be a struggle for them within a Capitalist society) and envy the way women are treated so begin idolising femininity and womanhood to the point they want to become 'women'..

I think there is a cohort that this is definitely true for. They don't necessarily despise women but they really don't see us.

"They don't necessarily despise women but they really don't see us."

They don't 'see' us at all. Yet they fully believe that their description of female people is 'us' and that they fit that description. The dissonance is like a huge bell tolling away.

That is why we end up with posters declaring that they are not 'male' because they have never penetrated anyone and nor do they want to. If that is not a fucking huge misogynistic red flag, then I don't know what is.

If there were studies that showed imposing an evening curfew on men stopped all instances of attacks on women on the streets at night, would you support it? Because most people would point out a whole lot of human rights issues and practical matters and collateral damage that meant, while it would undoubtedly achieve a legitimate aim, its not a proportionate means of doing so. Allowing some men to be treated as though they are women is the same. Though with few less likelihood it would actually achieve the aim you intend.

He sounds absolutely horrible. An utter selfish wanker and a complete idiot too. I guess he must have SOME good points but I wouldn't be able to stay with such a man.

Who cares? You know that's not it. Being ND doesn't give him a right to bully you.

All true, and I totally agree; but I disagree about the average woman in the street. I have generally found that even those with no personal experience, if you explain it to them once, they get it and agree - not all of course but most. And, most encouraging of all, YOUNGER woman are starting to get it now. Perhaps, in their cases because they HAVE faced it, at school or university.

I think it’s a bit much to imply that people who are gender critical don’t care about preserving life. Most people regardless of what their views are would hate the idea of anyone committing suicide . I certainly would and I do think trans people need mental health support. However access to women’s spaces at the expense of women’s safety and mental health is not the answer

Knowing that people can't change sex and advocating for women's rights is not an ideology.

GC feminists are not "ideologically captured"
It's quite telling that you think so actually.

I don't know, to me the argument you have made here is a stupid person's argument.

For one thing almost everyone cares about preserving life, those on the left who think otherwise tend to be very sheltered.
Then why would you "side" with anything a group claimed or wanted just because of a high suicide rate? You could be concerned about that, but the logic there is not evident.

Personally I think seeing everything through the lens of oppression hierarchies is also not a particularly intelligent approach.

Rules and laws work best if people follow them. They are not that effective if the majority of the public is pro-trans and believes TWAW so acts/votes that way. Winning over public opinion is crucial.

I'm quite shocked by that statement.

The majority of rapes are not prosecuted. A great many men, and even a fair few women, believe some rapes (such as martial rapes, drunken date rapes, prostitute rapes) should not even be illegal.

Should we get rid of the laws against rape?

PD is in Australia & I don't think is posting in good faith. They ignore the fact that in the UK (& I suspect even in Australia) the majority of the public does not believe TWAW.

The majority of people do not support male people being in female single sex provisions.

There is a difference between people who say they are generally supportive of trans people and this then changes if specific questions are asked.

I wouldn’t trust any person who claims that the UK is the majority ‘pro trans’.

I would also not trust them if they said Australia was the majority ‘pro trans’ too. I would need to see the data collection questions and the breakdown of the data first.

I think it’s for the very simple reason that they see women as sort of defective men.

So males who aren’t quite up to the standard of being men — or who reject their male role because they aren’t strong enough to handle it, or who are too sex-obsessed to function normally — must obviously be women.

I agree that we need to reinforce the fact that women have inalienable rights in our civic society.

However, I also think that we need to get our wider society to understand that they have fallen for the public relations messaging of a sexual fetish disguising itself as a human rights category.

These men are performing their fetish in public and that is unacceptable. I will die on the hill of fighting to demonstrate the degradation of women that our society is allowing to happen in plain view.

Pornography (and the resulting effect on male sexuality) is responsible for the breaking of a lot of boundaries in our society in recent decades and we need to reinstate those boundaries in order to ensure the safety and well-being of our fellow citizens both male and female.

Never underestimate the number of men who are turned on by cross-dressing or shemales.

I thought this would be of interest on this thread:

https://x.com/Jonnywsbell/status/2030798915423887413?s=20
"1973: Transsexuals smugly declare: "we chose to be women, transsexualism is the tip of the iceberg, sex is fluid, and birth certs must change"..
2026: They played the long game and won, biology is erased, dissent is crushed and women's rights are gutted...mission accomplished..."

Link for those not on TwiX:
https://nitter.net/Jonnywsbell/status/2030798915423887413#m

It is interesting to see them. In a way you can see how at that time they were probably effeminate gay men who were jeered at and told they were ‘sissies’ looked ‘just like a girl’ etc and in a way it might have been easier just to become somewhat disguised. This group seem almost Margaret Thatcher like, and as though they aspired to be ladies who go to the hairdresser every week and carry a handbag.

These are the men we are told were accepted into or used the women toilets unnoticed.

Its like a monty python sketch.

I no longer believe that these men were bullied for being effeminate and therefore retreated into being a women. If that were true, we'd have far fewer men pretending to be women now, not more.

They are just wearing the fashions of the time, it doesnt mean they werent sexual motivated and just wanted to act like ladies who lunch. They are no different to any of the men now.

Exactly this. The stance that a male can be treated as a woman for some purposes and excluded for others is both illogical and cruel.

I think the 'compromise' of female enough in some setting, but not in others has come from TW themselves.

In part, to get a foot in the door - grab wins when they can get them and work on others later. And partly as individuals to appear reasonable. Usually giving up spaces they would never use - like sport or opportunities they are personally not interest in.

I think the SC ruling shook them because they realised the decision was taken out of their control.

Unless that person is fully aware that they are not a 'woman' and therefore why are they then claiming to be a woman?

I think most of them are fully aware they aren't women because they think they are better than women. They are using women as props.