Posting upton’s old photos and name on twitter

[Biggadyboom]

Look I’ve been in these discussions since before this forum existed. You don’t need to break it down for me. I peaked in 2018.

But the endless sharing of upton’s name accompanied by photos and horrible comments about him and his wife is not nice. It is totally is transphobia. It’s horrible.

I could kind of understand the point of it, if it was just the name being shared.

But equally the court has ruled that Upton has a right to privacy. I thought it was all about respecting court’s rulings?

but the sharing of private photos (presumably grabbed from social media) and especially their wedding photo with insults to both of them and speculation about their marriage is awful and will not help their be a resolution to this debate. It polarises it even more and is transphobia.

fair enough, don’t let Upton change the rules of the country and workplace based on personal beliefs . But that doesn’t involve posting personal information and photos , insults and horrible speculation.

or are we just going low now?

Surely, it is in the public and common interests of women as a sex class to know the names of males who are happy to enter places where their presence, and undressing could amount to flashing and voyeurism against women. We know that ignoring the actions of men who do that can potentially lead to even more serious consequences for women.

Also, it is most certainly in the public and common interests of women to know which male medics will continue to impose themselves on women who have specifically stated they only wish to have female only care. A man who will impose himself when he knows there is no consent, and not because there is an emergency. A man who for his own revenge, may then be able to get the woman described as hateful, and maybe lead to her not being treated.

So, I think it could be argued that the rights of women (majority of the population) to know about such men, and indeed ones who have such power in transgressing the rights of women, trumps his right to hide his behaviour from the very sex he is encroaching upon.

No i didn’t know that. Thanks for pointing that out

@Biggadyboom

Can we use "abuser" rather than "pervert"? I think you choose your words very carefully. "Pervert" is highly subjective. "Abuser," which is what he is, much more objective and clear. He has abused women by turning them into an object for his voyeurism (I am absolutely discounting your claim that he was in a female space "because he thought he was a woman". Had this been the case he would have taken no interest in what the other users of the space were doing), abused trust, abused the legal framework. One who abuses is an abuser. Their motivation for doing so is irrelevant. Surely you must know that? You can't truly believe that defining an abuser's motive in any way ameliorates the impact on their victims? Because if you do believe that, if you support that view, that is unforgivable.

And yes i can see how sympathy with Upton has been eroded throughout the trial.

but still think that the pile on helps no one. It damages the GC side and as others have articulated, makes less likely that future court proceeding will be open

You’re claiming of a man has been diagnosed with gender dysphoria he has no understanding that he’s not a woman? Really? And he has no understanding of women being a discreet sex class that he does not belong to? And he has no understanding of the normal morals and values of the society he lives in? And that he has no concept of ‘consent’? Really?

At this point. OP, I don’t believe you’re posting here in good faith.

Also, I forgot about the allegation that he cooked up a scenario where the woman (who stood up for herself against his transgressions) might lose her employment. I don’t know what the ET will rule about exactly, but if true, it will be good to know who is would do this. It would be interesting how his professional body reacts to that, if it does.

I can fully imagine that some people on there have scented blood wrt Upton, and are gunning for them.

You see, I view the situation differently.

I've followed this tribunal through every step. I'm aware of the arguments used in court. And what I saw was an institutionally ideologised NHS and 'Dr' Upton scenting the blood of a female colleague who dared stick her head above the parapet.

Every step of their behaviour along the way has further cemented this impression. Peggie wasn't meant to have fought them. She was working-class. She was the less powerful employee. She shouldn't have been able to afford the civil courts which were her only recourse for justice, but which are cost-prohibitive and generally only available to the very wealthy.

If anyone's scented blood it's Upton, who it appears is very good at adopting a victim status from the stance of a bully. He thought he had her gagged, silenced and stitched up like a kipper.

He was wrong.

I don’t think you’re right here.

what would you call a man who makes complaints about a woman self-excluding from a changing room because she doesn’t want to get undressed in front of him, and insisting that he will stay while she gets undressed. I would say that fairly perverted behaviour.

I'm sure this has been asked previously, probably many times, but why have you come to Mumsnet to complain about this? If you have an issue with people posting on X then you need to address it there. It has nothing to do with people here.

Why do you think I’m not in good faith?

yes i think it’s possible for someone like Upton to believe they are a woman. That’s why we’re all in this mess.

i don’t think they are right that they are a woman, or that society and laws should be changed around their beliefs. But i do think many people absolutely believe it all. That’s why they are fighting so hard.

The justice system isn't SM, and the tribunal is not being conducted by SM. Whatever decision the panel comes to, it will be based on the submissions they've heard in that room, not on the contents of social media.

There is not a GC 'side' in the court. There is the question of whether a woman was or was not fairly treated by her employer in accordance with the Equality Act. That is all.

That’s not what I asked though, whether or not that they ‘belueve’ they are a woman - I asked if gender dysphoria renders a man suddenly unaware of the concepts of consent, and the societal norms we all generally abide by, and women being a discreet sex class.

If he truly believes he’s a woman, where’s the dysphoria part? He surely wouldn’t be feeling dysphoria if he truly believed he’s a woman was a woman?

This is nonsense.

He knew full well whay he was doing and then he went for the throat when a woman wouldn’t wheesht and agree with his fantasy.

Someone also asked why I also had 'come' to MN - I'm not 'coming' here, I spend most of my time here!

For me, I think it's an interesting discussion worth having with the reasoned MN posters about what others are doing - just as when we post about TRAs filling bottles with piss not helping trans people - I'm talking generally, not telling people about their own behaviour.

I have made it clear that for me, I'm not posting to 'blame' MNers for what's on Twitter.

(I don't care about Upton or whether he's offended or whatever - his feelings are irrelevant to me.)

We often talk about 'how things are going' and as someone who's not on Twitter I prefer to discuss it here because you can't really discuss things properly there.

We also often discuss what people are saying on Reddit and no-one complains that the discussion should be taken there instead.

I think because I find sneery and insulting behaviour generally unhelpful and unpleasant I have an instinctual reaction to it, regardless of who's doing it - and it's interesting to see how others think it's fine - but I'm fairly sure that's a personality and preference thing. Like I prefer to deal with things with dry humour but obviously we are all different!

In every group there is a 0.01% of nutters who are intent on causing maximum offence as a pastime.

The size of the group that object to the excesses of gender ideology is large so even 0.01% equates to many nutters

The only way to stop these nutters would be to institute a police state along the lines of North Korea.

From reading comments on other stories on X (I am not on X but nitter works) it seems like X is a nutter-magnet as there is little, if any regulation

Mumsnet is regulated - if you make nutter posts here people will call you out for them and you will censored and then banned.

The nutters that post on X will not post on mumsnet for these reasons

The reason that the OP feels they can post here is because of that strong regulation.

And the content of that post? 'some of you nutters here on Mumsnet are the same nutters that post on X'

Apologies if this has already been covered

Edit for X read X / twitter / etc.

Well, I have to confess that I am now pretty transphobic, which is quite remarkable when you consider that up until around 2017/18 I was really quite supportive of trans people in a 'How awful for anyone to feel that they have been born into the wrong body' sort of way. And then the transactivism really started to mess with womens' lives and I have pivoted the full 360 degrees to be extremely intolerant of anything trans related. In fact, when I see a headline such as 'Time to Transition', which actually refers to editing your Autumn wardrobe, I can feel the tide of red-hot anger starting to surge up my chest!

I think I hit peak transphobia when I heard the term trans lesbian, which I read as being a heterosexual man who wants the extra perving rights that pretending to be any sort of woman would grant him. And whereas I used to think that men who had properly and fully transitioned, perhaps years ago, could perhaps be permitted to use womens' loos, now I can't countenance the thought of any man whatsever in any single sex space. There is nothing about trans that doesn't enrage me, from medicating gender-questioning children, through to single sex spaces and womens' sports. When out and about, I am constantly scanning for men dressed as women, so that I can voice and record my displeasure.

I haven't commented about Upton on X/twitter as I use my account strictly for business-related purposes, but I have no compunction about raging on here or in the comments section of The Times, the one paper that has been consistently good at highlighting trans issues. I feel that as an older woman, no longer dependent on an employer, I have a duty to speak on behalf of all the women who don't feel able to comment because of the constraints of their own circumstances - think of me as an older and much poorer JK Rowling!

I haven't reposted photos of Upton, but quite frankly, I feel he's brought everything he's getting on himself, and the fact that he is married to a woman and is trying to impregnate her, adds yet another layer of creepiness and perversion to the whole thing. Why should he get off scot-free when Sandie Peggie - and many others - have been pilloried and hounded out of their jobs?

I think many of us who were born in the 50s and have fought for womens' rights their whole lives, feel particularly affronted that pervert men have become the most pampered and protected species of all time and have been allowed to ride roughshod over everyone else's rights. I couldn't give a flying fuck if my views upset trans identifying men and their allies and there's nothing that anyone could say or do that would ever shut me up on this issue. I really hope that the Tribunal finds in favour of Sandie Peggie and that Upton's name becomes inextricably entwined with the day that common sense started to return and that he's condemned to appear in the history books forever more!

That might be true for you but it's been mentioned tons of times in the 50,000+ posts solely about the Sandie P tribunal. That's the only way I know it! People have posted screenshots of the GMC registration etc.

Perhaps that's on me for attempting to keep up with all the threads on the tribunal!

"but the sharing of private photos (presumably grabbed from social media)"

I don't use Twitter so I'm not certain what you're referring to, but if the photos were originally posted on social media doesn't that mean he's already made the choice to make them public? Social media photos aren't private by their very nature. People are sharing publicly-shared images and commenting on them. That's the point of social media.

Can I point out that the outrage against me making an assumption of a cross over is doused a little by the many posters defending the posting of the photos and insults?

What about bog standard perverts and enablers? The old fashioned ones, the ones who haven’t declared an inner different gender identity. The men who aren’t trans. Is it ok to call them out still? I say call them out, you say insult.

Or is it just the ‘sacred caste’ you have a problem with that we should ‘rise above and be kind’ about calling a spade a spade?

Oh come on OP, how you can expect anyone to believe you genuinely believe he's a confused, troubled man who genuinely thinks he's a woman? You know he's a malevolent prick who knows full well he's male and that's why he gets such a thrill from stamping on women's rights.

Off to find the Sweep FB page now! 🐾

is it transphobia? how do you define that.

It got out of control because his barrister tried to have his name, which is in the public domain and partly (or entirely) the reason the ET happened, redacted.

Well, that worked well for Streisand and now has worked well for Upton.
They should have let it lie. Upton is now in the FO part of FAFO. My sympathies, which are severely limited, are only with his wife. Who is part of the problem, hence my sympathies being titchy.

No, absolutely not.

Seeing a justification for something is not in any way indicative that you'd do the same thing yourself.

You were totally out of order suggesting that we were in some way responsible for those posts. You can quit your attempts to weasel out of taking responsibility for that.