Trans sibling in law

[Primrose86]

DH's sibling has just come out as a man. She is 26 and autistic, lives at home with mum, spends life on the Internet, got kicked out of school at 16 etc etc She has plans to go overseas and transition in germany where apparently you can get surgeries on the public health system while living with her grandpa. Her mum is fully supportive of this.

How should I react to all this. Should I start referring to him as my brother in law? What usually happens after people come out. I assume they progress to hormones and surgery but honestly based on what I read, Germany is quite resistant to health tourists who never paid in even if they are citizens. Are people really happy identifying as another gender when they wouldn't look like the other gender?

You can actually be supportive of how someone identifies, and still believe that it's impossible to change biological sex.

If my BIL turned around and asked me to call him a her, said he was no longer John but Joanne, fine, I can accept that. She is Joanne.

If he turned around and told me he'd changed his biological sex, and was now a woman a d would be joining me in the changing rooms at the local gym, I'd ask him to explain to me how he'd managed to achieve something no scientist ever has been able to.

They are completely different things, and a person can both support a trans person AND believe that biologically they cannot change sex.

You may wish to educate yourself on UK law, given the Supreme Court has been very clear on this.

Genuinely, how do you think this is helpful?

She isn’t a man - she has XX chromosomes, presumably ovaries (or at least a place where they should be), periods, a vagina, can give birth etc Every cell of her body, whether she likes it or not, is female.

She is a very troubled woman with autism who needs help.

There is growing evidence that it is almost entirely ND young women who believe themselves to be trans. Presumably because they assume that will fix all their problems.

But of course it won’t. Because even if her nearest and dearest decide the best thing they can do for her is play along. I won’t. And there are millions of people like me. And we have children. And we’re telling them sexist immutable too.

this social contagion is reaching its end.

misgendering (if you were to call her him) is a false kindness, a lie disguised as a virtue, and the absolute crux of the problem.

But I am not here to educate transphobia central, just offering help to OP who seems to genuinely want to help and learn. So... Bye, keep arguing against DSM, Human Rights, UK law and everything else.

So, you are really really really supportive of transpeople but not supportive enough to stick around and construct a cohesive argument. You'd just quite enjoyed the opportunity to scold people. Lame.

Honestly. Every day on this “feminism” board there’s a rage about this. A trans woman is not a cross dressing man. So utterly ignorant.

Yes OP you must actually believe.

Taking part in the 2 Minute Hate isn’t nearly enough- O’Brien here will see your sin before you do yourself.

Other than she is obviously a young woman for whom you wish the best, my response to the ‘threat’ of being excluded from her life would be “Do you promise?”.

OP, your primary focus should be your DH, (sorry trans person, it is not all about you). You can be supportive of her, but primarily be supportive of him. Give him the space to know that all of his feelings are OK.

Indeed.

I'd like to know why @ThejoyofNC post was deleted. It is right to say that a lot of Autistic people are caught up in this and it is actually very worrying.

so what are they then?

I think in this situation I would try hard to remain outwardly as neutral as possible. I hold sex realist beliefs but I wouldn’t want to get in to an altercation with family members over it.

I would just use a name instead of pro nouns and try and avoid all discussions on the subject. Neither confirm nor deny would be my strategy, hopefully that way both people’s beliefs can be respected.

Her arguments were the most cohesive I’ve seen here. She doesn’t need to “stick around” to continue wasting even more of her time. I don’t think she enjoyed the opportunity to “scold” people, I think she was just making a few valid points. You, however. What’s your point here? Just weighing in to scold her back?

A trans woman. Come on, let’s derail the whole thing yet again. Bite bite.

It doesn’t matter what their reason is for presenting as female, biological men are men. Transwomen are men. Cross-dressing men are men. The Supreme Court was very clear on this.

As for your accusations of transphobia, feel free to report that if you see it and the mods will remove it. But reality isn’t transphobic, it just IS, whether you like it or not.

Oh goodness was that why? I guess my post is about to be deleted too then. There was a newspaper article recently. I’ll find the link.

Show me the valid points.

Só a man then as being a man is the only prerequisite of being a trans woman

thanks for confirming

Tbf they’re right. Not all transwomen are males wearing women’s clothes saying they feel like they’re women.

Plenty people call themselves transwomen while retaining their masculine appearance too.

I just happen to catergorise all males as …men so it makes no difference to me how they dress or refer to themselves. Still men.

Ignore the vast majority of comments on here. All you can do is be respectful and kind to your now bil. You might make the odd mistake but most reasonable people will understand, if you at least try to be a nice sil

I think how you react depends on what you believe, and how strongly.

So if you believe she is now a man, then he is now your brother-in-law. It might take some getting used to ur new name and pronouns, hopefully accidentally slipping up will be forgiven

If you believe she is still a woman, can't be a man etc etc then you have to decide if that belief matters more to you than your relationship with the wider family.

Personally, I would use the pronouns they want and refer to them as a transman.

I have a friend who is a TW. I use 'her' TW name (I don't know what the original name was) and she/her pronouns. I also believe 'she' is biologically a man. But then again, so does she. We were joking this week about the male pattern baldness being a pay off for the lovely long thin legs that men often have. She wants my hair, I want her legs.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/health/children-gender-clinics-tested-autism-b1224628.html

This. It's not love or support to agree that a vulnerable autistic young adult should remove healthy body parts which won't actually help their mental health, and will destroy her physical health and make her unable to have children.

@Primrose86 are you at all close to her, could you chat to her, ask her why she thinks she's a man, what it is that makes her different to other young women?
Ten to a penny it's largely based on either stereotypes or on feeling she doesn't fit in.

I just returned to the thread and I'm genuinely shocked. I can't really double down because I suppose it'll just be deleted but there are plenty of studies and statistics to back up what I said.

Honestly. Every day on this “feminism” board there’s a rage about this. A trans woman is not a cross dressing man. So utterly ignorant

where is the rage?

Please please could you articulate how pretending she is a man is kind? And. If you think my question is goady, PLEASE, explain why because it really doesn’t make any sense to me.

Do not engage on this. Call the person by the name they choose (good manners) and use the pronoun “you” if addressing them. Do not comment on appearance. Do not comment on the plan. It is unlikely to come to fruition.

Is the individual a German citizen? Do they already have a German passport? If not it will be a long process to get a visa/residence permit. Even if they are a German national they will then have to pay in to the state health insurance scheme. Are they prepared to do this?

I know that everyone on Mumsnet thinks the German health care system is fantastic and that specialist treatment is available on demand. The reality is different with many specialists refusing to accept Krankenkasse (NHS type) referrals or offering appointments months down the line.

Not sure about trans medicine. There may be some zealots happy to lop off a few healthy body parts to gain experience but my guess is that they are likely to be few and far between. Most health care professionals would be wary of malpractice suits and this kind of surgery on a new immigrant would leave them open to those.

How does one tell the difference?