NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #12

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to continue for 2 weeks although at the start of the second week getting everything done in this time period was looking less certain. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton started giving evidence on Thursday 6 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10
Thread 11: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272046-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-11

I was, sorry. I'm just disappointed at not being able to watch this. It's so important for so many women - and NHS patients.

Yes!

NC saying finish DU evidence and then two more witnesses but that most of rest of hearing ought be adjourned to another date with both R1 and R2’to comply with full IT searches as previously proposed by NC

But most people not au fait with this lunacy won't have even heard of TT but may regularly listen to / read / watch the BBC. The average person totally unaware this is going on won't read TT, they will read the BBC.

TT have nothing like the reach of the BBC.

www.advance-he.ac.uk/person/vic-valentine#:~:text=Vic%20Valentine%20is%20the%20Policy,the%20gender%20based%20violence%20sector.

Why not just cap the number rather than keep everyone out.

Yes, that’s true

Tribunal Tweets

@tribunaltweets
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2m

NC: We need to collate new docs, revisit chronology and structuring of DU questioning. So we shall be asking shortly for adjourn for the rest of the day.

Tribunal Tweets

@tribunaltweets
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1m

NC: Will also be impact on C's evidence previously given. And, I must note that the compliance with Judge T's order has been at best incompetent and incoherent. So I fear that if we continue there will be further stop-start intervals as we have to request future docs omitted.

JR- I think we are losing sight of the case and I will ask judge tinion to specify just relevant documents

It might be my audio but JR's voice is starting to sound breathy. It's catching!

NC: I must note that the compliance with Judge T's order has been at best incompetent and incoherent. So I fear that if we continue there will be further stop-start intervals as we have to request future docs omitted

It's weird that this now coincides with all the new shenanigans with observers leaving their cameras and mics on, this morning.

I think the Judge is just sick of it, and I can understand why.
It would help if Scott (Moriarty) remained in the room to deal with any nonsense straight away.
It's not ideal, but what can we do?

Also TT sometimes miss important info.

JR threatens to apply for a variation of previous judges order

The judge did say that they are working behind the scenes to make access possible for everyone.

JR: wholly disproportionate to adjourn a two week tribunal. If NC is looking for a smoking gun, it's not there

Completely with you there. Finally we get sunlight and the Judge just denies us at the drop of the hat. There are tech wizards on FWR who I have no doubt could go in and set up a system to cope with hundreds viewing in a few days. It's pathetic and unfair and - dare i say it - discriminatory not to take this obvious step. They manage it in other countries.

' incompetent and incoherent.' - t-shirt? hmmmm maybe not this time!

There are limited grounds for disclosure allowed under the GRA.

I think it is irrelevant because you are lawfully allowed to exclude males even with a GRC if it is proportionate for a legitimate aim. No male should be in a female changing room.

JR saying no smoking gun found, thinks adjournment unnecessary

Sounds like NC is suggesting it's needs to be completely knocked on the head for now and adjourned to a later date due to the level of stuff that hasn't been disclosed.

JR arguing that it's only day 7 of a 2 week hearing and there is no smoking gun for NC to find however much more time she has.

Roving public enquiry DRINK

JR arguing that no smoking gun found as isn’t there and wants to carry on with today and saying it cannot take NC more than 20 mins to read 30 pga disclosed and need to focus and get on

NC now saying they will need more time because Upton has withheld documents.

JR arguing that they don't need more time b/c there's nothing in the documents that Upton failed to hand over when he was told to so they're irrelevant and anyone you can read and assess 30 pages of unseen emails in 20 mins.

NC: If we do adjourn now, and I think we need to for fairness to claimant, then I would ask that the kinds of detailed full searches I requested yesterday take place