NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #12

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to continue for 2 weeks although at the start of the second week getting everything done in this time period was looking less certain. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton started giving evidence on Thursday 6 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10
Thread 11: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272046-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-11

I don't know but less than a total of 40 in the video conference itself.

How ridiculous is his statement here! He was asked to disclose his emails with the BMA.

I'm a doctor, it's quite an unusual event to be asking for advice for the BMA (for most people!!) I'd certainly know what emails I'd sent and what replies I'd got - I wouldn't have forgotten because I'd not checked a particular account.

Could he be being less than truthful about this?

Did the dog maybe eat his homework?

She's probably had a 20 min 'exchange' with DU on interpretation of the request & how he perceived that request etc. If I were here I'd probably 'fess up too, just to avoid having to try and explain DU's understanding of what was asked for.

Always starts Thin Lizzy 'Waiting for an Alibi' playing in my head:

It's not that he don't tell the truth
Or even that he misspent his youth
It's just that he holds the proof
But you know something's wrong

Waiting for an alibi

Go Sandie and team, we’re all with you.

It may just be to take some of the flak away from DrU who otherwise will be seen as the one hiding evidence.

The respondent doesn't have a case, they're answering one. They cannot be thrown out. They could possibly be held in contempt.

I am now getting an invalid pin message to after watching all week. Was working before lunch. Just emailed them for a new pin. Don't hold out much hope. Relying on anyone who's logged in.

Wonder why she was chosen, given no real track record.

There's 230 currently in the lobby

Thanks Pithy. I'm going to look into this, I need to know more about it for reasons not to do with this case.

Agree. Huge number of meta comments about accessing video, my interest is only in what's happening in the room.

I've just been kicked out of the lobby, and then told my PIN's invalid when I try to get in again!

Oh my goodness, I feel blessed. I suspect it was the contemporaneous notes that did it...

Maybe she's working on 'no win, no fee' 😂

I was being slightly tongue in cheek, but in any event, that sounds entirely unequivocal. And something he will absolutely know about.

I hadn't thought of it from that point of view, only in terms of information that BU was deliberately withholding. The BMA, of course, has been notoriously captured, as evidenced by its original response to the Cass Review. Perhaps some activists within the BMA would have been particularly excited at the prospect of making an example of a nurse who was not playing the affirmation and validation game. Some of the content in the withheld emails could be professionally embarrassing for the BMA.

Kicked out again, now saying invalid pin

I'm wondering whether she's secretly a closet TERF, and is actually delighted with how it's going.

Yep. Invalid PIN here as well. What a clusterfuck.

Quite! It is the solicitors' job to ensure disclosure is handled properly. They have a duty to explain to the client what disclosure means, which documents have to be disclosed and, crucially, that unless privilege bites, all relevant documents must be disclosed even if they are unfavourable to the client. They then need to check that disclosure has been carried out in accordance with the rules.

I suspect Counsel was guarding her relationship with those instructing her when she said that it was the fault of the lawyers, and thereby including herself in the default.

Not only that, but it appears from comments NC has made early in that Cs side has persistently complained disclosure is incomplete and been fobbed off.

Good idea.

So the same person who kept notes on their phone for every perceived slight, did not think to disclose the emails he sent to BMA??

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

Also getting invalid PIN message, have emailed to request a new PIN