NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #8

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and is expected to continue for 2 weeks. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton started giving evidence on Thursday 6 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse

Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2

Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3

Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4

Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5

Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6

Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7

Speaking so quickly!

Trying to imply that being a woman is itself a social construction....and that he can be one too.

The “I’m a lady” voice has gone again and has developed a hard edge

NC - if space doesnt provide for cubicles, given your feelings about changing in front of men, don't you agree that separate spaces for men and women should be provided?
DU - That would depend what this looked like. Probably best to split men and women. Better than nothing

NC: Given constraints of resources, good thing that itn'snot just communcal facilites for everyone to get changed toggether?

BU: Depends. If you had individual cubicles, that would be better. If the hostpital has one big room, only space possible, a wall down middle to split men and women probably bettter than one big room with everybody getting naked in it. Better, not best. Better than nothing.

Apologies

But not you eh

NC: You aware right to privacy is enshrined in law? Heard or H&S workplace regs?

BU: No.

JR: Thats not part of the case

NC the right to privacy is enshrined in law, the Workplace Regulations. Are you aware of that?
No.

I love this -
NC Have you seen the Beyonce advert?
J I know her

Judge: Talking about regulations. Can't hear what he's saying.

Is it a good thing if the KC has to keep jumping in to stop her client answering

NC - Are you aware right to privacy in law 1992?
DU - No
JR - What is this q about?
NC - this is my only Q on this
J - Is knowledge of the law relevant?
[sorry can't hear this bit]

JR trying to claim that DrU couldn't know about the laws around single sex space so it's not his fault guv

His

At least the language isn't compelled

Judge not keen on this line of questioning. Witness is not a lawyer.

Also ask him why he thinks there are such things as single sex facilities.

DU is all in on "I am a woman"

Another interruption...

JR jumps in again.

I see BBC reporter of the blue & pink wrapped scarf Lorna Gordon is observing.

JR'S plan seems to object at every chance

NC: Separate facilities sex separated - schools, unis, sports centres, swim pools, other public places. Do you agree that the reason for those rules and practises, generally speaking, women don't want to undress in front of men (and vice versa)
BU: You could make that generalisaion

JR: How can witness give evidence of how most men or women feel? IN any case, my swimming poool has mixed sex facilites.

Judge- that's the thing about generalisations.

Well he keeps asserting it’s his right as a trans person, to use the female CR, so it would be interesting to know the “rights” he relies on.

Wtf is JR on about?