NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #3

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 January 2025 and is expected to continue for 2 weeks.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse

Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

<Fifer waves back>

I don't think it will harm her claim. It's got nothing to do with whether or not the NHS and BU discriminated against SP. Even if SP's husband is "Islamophobic" or a bit racist, SP is still entitled not to be discriminated against at work.

I expect Russell to pounce on "altercation".

NP she'd bled, walked in and there was a man present and she felt intimidated? And embarrassed

Yay!

NP she wasn't scared

And she's done

Next witness is at a funeral.
Judge will resume tomorrow at 10 with Sheila bell

Back tomorrow at 10am with Mrs Bell (?).

There's a lot of us on here!

Does anyone know who Sheila Bell is?

"You didn't say scared" - again! when she'd said her mum had had to clean up after bleed through her clothes due to her period, found a man in the changing room and was shaking and upset.

"But you didn't say scared"

Well, that didn't go well for JR IMO.

Maya was a star as always.

Huzzah!

Presumably no colleague is going to appear in her defence having seen the lengthy suspension NHS Fife doled out alongside the extensive note taking to record behaviours such as eye contact, language, manner of entering or leaving a room and all the other submissive behaviours required from women colleagues?

Just echoing thanks to @nauticant and everyone for keeping the updates flowing

Why does Upton's upset matter and Sandie's doesn't as it isn't being scared?

I would have bet good money on that outcome!

Day 3 afternoon part 2

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1887159407785521591.html

Please forgive the total derail/lowering of tone, but this reminds me of the Emannuel Petit chant
'He's blond/ He's quick/ His name's a porno flick/ Emannuel, Emannuel'
The people's poetry, eh?😄

If she is indeed goading Maya into objecting, so she can pounce on it being upsetting when you're called the wrong name, Maya not reacting is going to make that tactic backfire.

Constantly calling somebody a derogatory version of their name, over and over, just looks like deliberate bullying.

Exactly.

Mayay staying calm and ignoring it was the right way to go imo

All the skills and years of experience that Maya has, and JR tries to claim that she can't comment on issues because she's got an agriculture degree!

"JR [Helen Joyce] is saying there we must stop ppl transitioning
MF Those are the words she says there and I think she's talking about the harm particularly to young ppl who are autistic or maybe same sex attracted and coming to believe they have been born in wrong body
MF and at the time of statement were being given puberty blockers to stop their puberty which have effect if they go on to cross sex hormones sterilising them before they've been ae to have any adult sexual experience of their own a d which has e since been banned by Gov
JR Your agricultural degree doesn't give u any skill behind any of those statements
MF They're based on Cass Review by Dr Hilary Cass who looked at it over for years
JR You're not a doctor
MF No but I've read the Cass Review

Because just being uncomfortable or upset at a man's presence is not enough, you have to be actively fearing attack or rape.

From TT. This is the bit where I couldn't hear the Judge:

J I'd understood evidence of MF based on fact [can't hear judge. I will get what I can] You would have someone with relevant qualifications. No evidence if any qualification of law JR Yes

J Just flagging up my concerns. Ur entitled to take this as far as u wish but is a concern this may not be any help JR This was supposed to be skilled witness J That's different

JR Yes your right this witness isn't an expert or skilled person in such matters and I find the line both parties have taken is difficult as may look like dressing up facts as skilled

J I don't know what intention is. Asking a question of fact is a matter of skilled evidence JR Just wondering where that leaves us in terms of evidence J I'm not sure as I'm not sure directions of evidence. U can take a break and speak to NC or plough ahead JR Plough ahead

J I'm concerned if we're going to be looking at law in conneticut JR (laughs) Yes. Look at study page 222. Starts 218. This is 2018 study. U aware? MF Yes

JR This study found no differences in comparison to criminal incidents...actually this is masachussets so I think I'll move on (laughs) I'll move on. Actually this is north Caroline so will move on.