Carly-May Kavanagh

[NitroNine]

There are rumours circulating on Twitter that Carly-May Kavanagh (the one who screams at babies: Daily Mail) has, despite her “apology” been suspended from the Labour Party. Presumably such a suspension would have an impact on her job as Lloyd Russell-Moyle‘s head of policy?

Apparently if she is suspended it [probably] won’t be made public. Given the reason for her [potential] suspension; if Labour actually do take action, you’d think they’d want to reassure people that they expect their members to uphold certain standards. I mean, “not screaming abuse at infants” is less upholding a standard than it is failing to trip over pebbles of basic decency…

Clearly one cannot put too much weight into Random Person Says Unevidenced Thing. However, it would be a foolish rumour to start without cause, so I thought it was worth starting a thread here to see if there are developments to follow.

Should Kavanagh face consequences for her behaviour it will be a watershed moment: Labour acknowledging women have rights all their own, including the rights to assemble & to speak on issues of concern to them, such as their need for single sex provisions.

I think Sappho is viewing this as a cult, that the adherents are groomed into thinking it's acceptable and are therefore not able to be rational.

I think peacefully protesting for a planet capable of sustaining human life is somewhat different to aggressively campaigning to destroy LGB and women's rights, and child safeguarding.

We're taking female socialisation to the max if we're then expected to feel sorry for all of them.

As trans widows we recognise that our exes have agency. They made choices. So therefore do their allies.

www.theargus.co.uk/news/18406359.brighton-mp-lloyd-russell-moyle-fire-video/

Here's her boss talking about routing out Tory voters in his constituency and that they know where the Tory voters live.

In the video, it is alleged he said his constituency was “not Tory-free enough for my liking”.

“We’ve still got a few more to route out, but because of your fantastic door-knocking, we know where they live,” he said

Remind me - which side is behaving like Fascists?

I am not sure what I want.

Part of me wants anyone who goes around publicly displaying misogyny or homophobia or authoritarian tendencies to lose their job.

Her views do make her look like an incredibly nasty person or an incredibly stupid one, or maybe someone who is a bit nasty and a bit stupid.

Part of me recognizes that it is incredibly difficult to have a cancel culture that doesn't put entirely innocent people at risk, and therefore cancel culture is wrong.

Then part of me looks at Linehan and thinks that cancel culture should be stopped when every single TRA has been through what he has.

I also think we need to replace TRAs with TRAMPs. As in "look at those misogynistic and homophobic Trans Right Activsit Male Prioritisers ove there".

@Signalbox said I’ve often wondered over the years if TRAs genuinely think that women’s rights campaigners are on par with fascists.

I think that the gender identity movement is based on absolutely insane foundations, such as identity is more important that reality, or rather that identity is reality.

If identity is reality, then anyone who says they are a woman is a woman, and anyone who says "I only represent biological women, not trans women" then they are no different from someone saying "I only represent white women, not black women", and I'd be quite happy saying that the person saying that was a fascist (albeit massive racist would be a better term).

I don't think PosieP wants babies screamed at or women assaulted, but she certainly does know that there is a risk of a demand for women's rights leading to both of those things happening, and if it does it helps the cause of women, not the reverse, when misogynists are filmed behaving appallingly.

Bringing up her appearance is wrong, but I can understand why someone who witnessed her behaviour might be minded to use words to hurt her as much as possible in revenge.

She won't have been exposed to the other side's views.

For someone in her position, if that's somehow part of her excuse or justification for her behaviour, frankly she's signing her own P45 to even think of trying to argue that as her reasoning. She's a grown ass woman with significant clout & is showing herself to be an unreliable individual on a number of fronts. She can't be trusted to give a balanced overview in this area of her job given her extreme prejudice towards anyone who doesn't agree with her. And she's willing to lie about circumstances to polish the turd that is extreme transactivism. She posted that women threw the smoke bombs at themselves to 'frame' TRA. She thinks it's 'fucking disgusting' to raise a child to know their own sex. She's not 'unemployable' but she's clearly not suited to such a role with the level of poor judgement & wilful bias to the detriment of the position she holds on full display.

She's advising an MP. That's quite an influential position to hold & like it or not, it does hold significant responsibility. If she wants to scream at babies & peddle lies & misinformation, she can do that & work somewhere else. I'm sure there's plenty who will employ her in Brighton. Because plenty see nothing wrong with what she did.

I saw someone else on twitter downplay the actions of TRA in Brighton, while ripping into women who attended for not 'denouncing' fascists that antifa couldn't pick out of a lineup under a banner that says 'fascists'. The whole collective actions in Brighton were to harass, abuse & intimidate women. Not even the presence of actual fascists distracted the TRA from their aims. CMK was a fully committed participant & showed her true colours willingly & without any ability to see it for what it was. Naked aggression & bullying.

She's the author of her own misfortune & I have zero sympathy for her.

She's advising an MP. That's quite an influential position to hold & like it or not, it does hold significant responsibility.

She's advising an MP who said after he was elected that his constituency was “not Tory-free enough for my liking”.

“We’ve still got a few more to route out, but because of your fantastic door-knocking, we know where they live,” he said"

@Signalbox said I’ve often wondered over the years if TRAs genuinely think that women’s rights campaigners are on par with fascists.

Someone mentioned upthread that she's got a politics degree? If she can't fathom that women standing up for their rights, for same sex attracted people & child safeguarding has fuck all to do with fascism, I have to wonder WTF she's studied to be so incapable of determining what actual fascism is & looks like. For someone working in politics, advising an MP, and supposedly well educated, that's just not a feasible position to hold.

Women aren't labeled 'fascists' because there's some grey area where maybe that's plausible. The smear of 'fascist' is about making women so terrible & toxic, their voices can & will be dismissed by people with influence & power. Tell me the fact Keir Starmer can't bring himself to acknowledge women's voices & concerns has not in some way been influenced by people like CMK who is wholeheartedly holding this position, while working in Parliament on policy.

“We’ve still got a few more to route out, but because of your fantastic door-knocking, we know where they live,” he said"

that’s astonishing

Does Lloyd Russell-Moyle want to force people with different (but completely mainstream) views to him to move out of Brighton?

how the hell is someone with such genuinely fascist tendencies a decent MP?

My God watched that Fox video.

All this, you are filled with hate nonsense. Do they ever give a reason why we would be filled with hate? Why, uniquely in history, is there a ‘hate motivated’ movement led and complied almost entirely by women? Could it be that there are women’s rights concerns and these are the motivation rather than an inexplicable l dislike of this one group, from women who have fought for social justice all their lives?

And the men in black are protecting themselves? Protecting themselves from what? From who, Fox?

oh, and throwing smoke bombs if fine and not an act of aggression or hate at all!

The lies! The self deception!

No respect!

There is no excuse for screaming and shouting at anyone holding a baby, or at a baby, and in almost any other circumstance this would be considered criminal behaviour. This was unjustifiable and anyone who feels sorry for her needs to give their head a wobble.

Iirc, the woman in black (pampess?) started the abuse but was fairly reasonable the Baby Shouter ( pronouns lost/it), then chipped in but escalated it. She even reached out but then thought better, so had some self control. I think it's partly competitive virtue signalling, they both had little smirks, so clearly we're enjoying themselves. I don't know if the pampess has been publicly identified. I've just seen something about a deleted twitter account.

It's performative, after the event they'll all get back on line and share 'war stories' about owning the terfs, desperately trying to be the best ally. No 'genuine' trans person, actually needs to be involved.

Yes. This is the problem. Carly May is just working according to the script, structure and rationale of the party, or at least this faction of the party.

She is symptomatic of a deeper problem; so while what she did was immoral, I think the issue that needs tackled is far bigger than this one person.

If I were part of the Labour party I would be asking for an inquiry into the Brighton Labour Party.

Too many extremists, too much fascist and anti-social behaviour.

I think you forget how absolutely crazy the whole ideology is. If biological reality is not something that merits consideration, and personal belief and sense of identity is 100% reality that deserves complete sympathy and support then someone denying "reality" in order to disadvantage one "woman" compared to another, and if words are literal violence, then they really are doing something akin to leaving some people alone and carting the others off to the gas chambers.

IMHO if you build you belief system off such crazy ground then it is absolutely obvious why you would regard GC people as nazis, and I have a lot of sympathy with treating nazis very badly!

Ultimately every single negative aspect of the whole ideology is 100% justified if you sign up to the absolutely unremitting nonsense that is the foundations of their beliefs.

Fox Fisher is a mess of ideological thinking.

They said: 'I wish we did not have to exist in reaction to transphobia. I wish we could create our own narratives and our own story. I wish that we could organise ourselves to come up with more impactful slogans, messages and rally our allies to celebrate our community while still protesting transphobia. And there are so many reasons we can't do that because we are a wide ranging community and often many of us are just in the process of surviving.'

I mean seriously? Has this person been living under a shell on the beach and missed it all. Need more impactful slogans?

Or is it that "TWAW.", "No debate" etc has now been shown up as being harmful to women and girls. Is it that no one should ever be able to create their 'own narrative' that then can harm others or to have that 'narrative' be forcibly recognised by others who don't believe that 'narrative'.

And that paragraph came AFTER Fisher pointed out that months before Brighton had 20K people marching for Pride. If that is not 'celebrating', then what is? Or is it that they want to live in a world where their life is constantly celebrated because otherwise they feel invalidated?

Then Fisher waves away smoke bombs as being 'theatrical' and 'harmless' while declaring how terrible it is to be misgendered. And reads out tweets - without one being about rape, killing people. And not one expressing violence or condoning it. But these tweets are shown as horrible and abusive.

(Including a nice sleight of hand about 'we are all concerned about women in prison and transwomen need protection too.... without stating that they need protecting separately!)

I think that the video posted up thread should be used exactly for the purposes of how disconnected some people can get when they are only ever existing in safe spaces and they cannot understand the needs of the sex class that they abandoned.

This quote jumps to mind watching that video:
"The surest way to work up a crusade in favor of some good cause is to promise people they will have a chance of maltreating someone. To be able to destroy with good conscience, to be able to behave badly and call your bad behavior 'righteous indignation' — this is the height of psychological luxury, the most delicious of moral treats."

"Am I right in thinking Lloyd Russell-Moyle is a nasty piece of work too?"

Yes. Hateful. I mute him any time he appears. Shudder.

A video of an idiotic TRA yelling at a baby and calling it a fascist is exactly the outcome PP would have hoped for and Carly May Kavanagh has played right into her hands.

Posey Parker's almost entire campaign is about stopping the threat to children.

If these people don't want Posie or her supporters to witness them abusing children, then guess what? Don't fucking do it.

Calling the man and his baby a fascist is a tactic. She doesn't really believe it. Every single woman who is standing up for women over this issue gets called a fascist. We all do.

It's a strategy, not a belief. It's to dehumanise so you can abuse. It's pretty hard to dehumanise baby, but she had a go.

This was a man watching the proceedings, calmly holding a baby, while she was standing amidst masked men in black, hurling smoke bombs and abuse at women while doing their level best to drown them out! It's laughable that she doesn't comprehend the issues.

And she's feeding it back up the food chain, to an MP, who says he wants to rout out all the Tories in his town, and he knows where they live because of canvassing.

Trans ideology attracts bullies and misogynists, everywhere. All the time. If you create a situation where people will pat you on the back for abusive behaviour, well, it's a bully's dream.

Hence her apology. She's apologising to her erstwhile back patters.

I don't have any sympathy for her, she's an adult with agency to decide how she behaves. I hope when she grows up this will be a lifelong source of embarrassment for her.

I'm tired of screaming, abusive, lunatics accusing anyone who disagrees with them of being hateful. Despite holding strong views on a number of issues I've somehow managed to avoid behaving in a bullying, abusive or harassing manner towards anyone either IRL or on line.

If someone is suspended for bringing an organisation into disrepute that is not exactly the same as cancel culture.

There have to be measures that employers can take if employees behave in a bad way even out of the context of work.

CMK must have known that she was at risk of being identified and that she holds a position that really ought to expect better standards but she thought it was appropriate to behave in that way anyway. However she appears to be being held to a different standard to her boss if he isn't castigated for some of his behaviours which isn't very fair.

I agree. I wouldn't want to see her immediately sacked but I do think the LP should probably suspend and investigate her in the normal disciplinary procedure for bringing the party into disrepute. Like they did with GC women like Venice Allan or Jennifer James for instance.

Maybe not hoovering but I did feel that I wanted to feed some of the protestors, they looked so thin and malnutritioned. Some of the young girls, one about 10 years old, I just wanted to say it's okay it's just puberty it's not a medical condition.

@Helleofabore "Or is it that they want to live in a world where their life is constantly celebrated because otherwise they feel invalidated?"

The whole movement is about destroying "heteronormative behaviours" 100% if they can. (Obviously straight sex is not heteronormative if the one with the penis is a woman). So in part it is a constant push that can only end when literally everyone is "queer".

I also think that we're talking about confused, traumatised, and mentally unwell people, who at the least are suffering mental distress. Trans people know they are not quite the same as other people of the sex they claim to identify as. Their transition has (unsurprisingly) not eased their anxiety or depression or autism. It is literally only when being explicitly validated or being righteous they seem to be able to find any joy.

If any of my employees were splattered across social media behaving like that I think there's every chance they would be sacked.