Carly-May Kavanagh

[NitroNine]

There are rumours circulating on Twitter that Carly-May Kavanagh (the one who screams at babies: Daily Mail) has, despite her “apology” been suspended from the Labour Party. Presumably such a suspension would have an impact on her job as Lloyd Russell-Moyle‘s head of policy?

Apparently if she is suspended it [probably] won’t be made public. Given the reason for her [potential] suspension; if Labour actually do take action, you’d think they’d want to reassure people that they expect their members to uphold certain standards. I mean, “not screaming abuse at infants” is less upholding a standard than it is failing to trip over pebbles of basic decency…

Clearly one cannot put too much weight into Random Person Says Unevidenced Thing. However, it would be a foolish rumour to start without cause, so I thought it was worth starting a thread here to see if there are developments to follow.

Should Kavanagh face consequences for her behaviour it will be a watershed moment: Labour acknowledging women have rights all their own, including the rights to assemble & to speak on issues of concern to them, such as their need for single sex provisions.

She has zero evidence of these women being abusive, or fascist. And overwhelming evidence of the tactics of TRAs

Yeah this.

I mean, you can see it in the wilful self-deception of Fox, when they are saying that the booted, masked men in black are just dressing like that to protect themselves, and now their efforts just to protect themselves, are being used against them.

Any fool can see the lying self-deception in this. Every single gender ideologist there knows that the GC women are not a threat to them. Every single GC women there knows aggressive males behaving like that are a threat. We all know what would have happened to the GC women if the police had not been there at Brighton, at Bristol. We all know these people are escalating in their behaviour.

They are lying to themselves, to maintain their belief that they are all the good guys, by pretending that men masking up, screaming abuse, and throwing projectiles, are good men protecting themselves from a group of women with a microphone.

Not to be rude but Carly-May Kavanagh looks like an overgrown toddler in this footage. What is it with this pastel coloured, dungaree style? I've seen it on a few 'non-binary' women it's such an infantilising look and in stark contrast with the aggression displayed.

I think it's just kind of the uniform adopted by TRAs (along with the multi-coloured hair), maybe to desexualise themselves mimicking a pre-pubescent state - perhaps in support of the use puberty blockers? So either that or the black militia style outfits will signal to others of the same mind-set that they are 'one of them'.

I don't feel sorry for Carly-May in the slightest, I hope the consequences of her actions are harsh.

Carly-May still thinks that what she was saying was right and what she did was right she still feels her actions and words were justified the only thing Carly-May is sorry for is the exposure her actions have had and that the light has been thrown very clearly and publicly on exactly what her and her TRA chums, think, believe and how they act. There will be no long night of the soul for Carly-May, Carly-May does not regret shouting at the man and the baby, nor what she shouted at them one iota.

If Carly-May had an ounce of humanity, dignity or self awareness then she would have apologised to the man for her actions and words, instead she played the victim card on her behalf and on behalf of her TRA chums.

Remember his tetchy appearance on Daily Politics a couple of years ago, getting increasingly riled by the cool, calm, reasoned Selina Todd, who persisted despite LRM’s incessant attempts to talk over her?
www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1241298/Rebecca-Long-Bailey-Labour-leadership-contest-Lloyd-Russell-Moyle-bbc-news-politics-live

In full (audio only) here:

The dungarees are from Lucy and Yak who are quite on brand with gender identity ideology.

Datun I think the realisation will dawn on CMK .

It might have already happened after the deafening silence from her 'trans friends'. Not a single TRA has defended her. She's lost her job and her reputation is in ruins and they won't be there to pick up the pieces.

If not now, it might be in the antenatal class where she's called a birthing person or a chest feeder.

It might be when she herself gets called a Nazi fascist for requesting a female nurse for her smear test or mammogram.

When the realisation dawns I hope she tracks down the father and baby and apologises properly.

The dungaree-cladders need to chill out, line up and conga to the Brum theme tune.

If not now, it might be in the antenatal class where she's called a birthing person or a chest feeder.

It might be when she herself gets called a Nazi fascist for requesting a female nurse for her smear test or mammogram.

Doubtful, someone as steeped in the ideology as Carly-May is wouldn't care about the first and probably wouldn't request the second, after all in her mind TWAW no matter what and she is there to serve and validate.

The only thing that may sting is the fact that none of her TRA chums have defended her, hence the apology to them, they are angry because her actions have led to more people seeing them for exactly what they are. Carly-May will accept that her TRA chums are right to be angry at her and will continue her self flagellation until such time as she is forgiven.

Yes vest I agree her crew will not defend her.

She may well never need to request a female HCP or mind calling herself a birthing vessel or whatever.

What's probably more likely is that, as the TRAs become more blatant with the misogyny, they will attract more and more abusive males to their demonstrations. I think this is happening already. At some point she will get harassed or assaulted purely for being female and be shocked that the TRAs don't turn against her assailant. Especially if the assailant conveniently digs out some special pronouns.

What vest just said

I am still trying to get my head around queer theory and gender indentity theory, but I think you are wrong when you say "She has zero evidence of these women being abusive, or fascist. And overwhelming evidence of the tactics of TRAs."

Under her world view misgendering and saying men cannot be lesbians is denying reality, and the rights that come with that reality and when you deny someone's reality it is literal violence. QED standing up for women's rights is by definition bigoted and violent and comes from a position of power. A powerful organisation that is bigoted and violent and oppressive looks pretty damn fascist.

So no, you are completely wrong. She has irrrefutable evidence that the GC movement is literally fascist (and nazis were fascist so standing up for women makes you a nazi, and nazis were scum so GC people are literally scum etc etc).

I think you underestimate the absolute insanity that is 100% obvious and provable once your thought process has been built of the most intellectually incoherent foundations imaginable.

Don't they ever question these ridiculous assumptions though?

I think you forget how absolutely crazy the whole ideology is. If biological reality is not something that merits consideration, and personal belief and sense of identity is 100% reality that deserves complete sympathy and support then someone denying "reality" in order to disadvantage one "woman" compared to another, and if words are literal violence, then they really are doing something akin to leaving some people alone and carting the others off to the gas chambers.

IMHO if you build you belief system off such crazy ground then it is absolutely obvious why you would regard GC people as nazis, and I have a lot of sympathy with treating nazis very badly!

Ultimately every single negative aspect of the whole ideology is 100% justified if you sign up to the absolutely unremitting nonsense that is the foundations of their beliefs.

I haven't forgotten how mad this whole farce is. In your point, you say 'if you believe...' & 'if you build...' - she's studied politics to a high level at uni & has to go through several convoluted hypotheticals to reach the point of trying to make a coherent argument that women defending single sex protections are analogous with nazis & fascists.

It takes conscious effort to go from 'women need & want single sex protection' to 'women are fascists/nazis' or whatever the iteration of abuse is. CMK didn't just stumble into this - she's actively working within the structures of power to affect change on the basis of her beliefs. Bastardising words to dehumanise women defending their sex based rights isn't an 'oops, my bad' scenario. This is wilful, strategic, political & vindictive.

I agree with Datun here:

" Calling the man and his baby a fascist is a tactic. She doesn't really believe it. Every single woman who is standing up for women over this issue gets called a fascist. We all do.

It's a strategy, not a belief. It's to dehumanise so you can abuse. It's pretty hard to dehumanise baby, but she had a go.

No matter what CMK's beliefs may be or how strongly she believes them, it's an absurdity to any reasonable person to frame GC views/perspectives as fascist. She's far too well educated to get away with being a sheep to what her chosen movement pushes as a narrative to intimidate women to shutting up.

Sorry, I just don't buy into any kind of naivety or stupidity or ignorance on CMK's part. She lives & breathes this crap, knowingly.

Thanks for posting that. I hadn't realised until this thread that I haven't heard or seen him on politics programmes recently.

Anyway, I've listened to it, against my usual inclination. Here he has an argument but he hasn't applied it to the rights of women, as Selina Todd had to point out to him when she managed to get a chance to speak over the attempted interruptions.

Someone quoted Aldous Huxley earlier and this clip reminded me of another thing Huxley said: The propagandist's purpose is to make one set of people forget that certain other sets of people are human.

"This is wilful, strategic, political & vindictive." I would have no problem with being those things if I was standing up to a literal Adolf Hitler style nazi. I believe that these dangerous clowns genuinely believe that standing up for sex based rights makes you a nazi, so everything that follows is reasonable. I honestly think that all of the problems we see in action are 100% inevitable if you accept the basic premises of the insane ideology.

I also think you underestimate how much nonsense and how little critical thinking is taught in universities now.

Maybe I am wrong and she actually thinks GC people are OK and she is just pretending to hate them.

it will have felt on a par with the BNP holding a rally in central Brighton.

Really? Everyone has a choice to scream at babies or not. I'm Jewish and if I was protesting a BNP rally I would stop screaming if I saw a baby, both for optics and for basic human decency. I'm sure I could find someone else to scream at.

So why exactly do you feel sorry for her?

OK, I do feel sorry for the many autistic people who have enthusiastically taken up one side or the other and then got carried away and behaved inappropriately and it will always haunt them. They are often profoundly singleminded and equally profoundly unaware of how they come across to others. Whether it's the young man at the LGBA conference who called Jen Ives names instead of calling security, or Kirrin Medcalf sending an inappropriate email and then staunchly and devastatingly sticking to Stonewall's politics at Alison Bailey's tribunal, or the drag queen guy putting up a video where he'd failed to tuck properly. Do you think she has autism?

Posie Parker could start a fight in an empty room but that doesn't explain or justify CMK's behaviour. I'd expect protesters to be more careful, not less.

CMK just hasn't caught up yet. She thinks she is supporting her sweet MTF transsexual neighbour who fully transitioned in 1997 or the mild mannered trans guy colleague who used to be a lesbian.

That's minimising and making excuses. OK, I'd believe that for someone who has been out of the loop for a while. Not someone in the thick of it.

When she realises she is supporting a men's rights movement, that the local women's services are alienating women to cater for males with a paraphilia, that will be her wake up call.

Will it? What more evidence do you think it would take to make her "realise" or "wake up"? Why wouldn't she just dig in deeper and deeper?

The SFW event was being live streamed from the inner circle by Hearts of Oak. Who are in fact far right nationalists.

Posie Parker must have know this - it was a camera set up on a tripod right by the speakers, not a random phone.

So CMK had a point. There were actual fascists there at the rally in central Brighton, all condoned (and possibly arranged?) by PP.

No obviously not the dad and the sweet little baby and CMK shouting at them was deranged.

You seriously think CMK was there screaming because a couple of no mark right wing blokes who nobody has heard of, nobody agrees with, and nobody recognised, were there?

If so it makes you wonder why she was screaming at a random baby when there were real fascists that she could have screamed at.

People like this scream "fascist" partly for effect, partly as a silencing tactic and partly because they think that's what politics is. I should know, my ex tells DD that I'm a nazi, knowing full well I'm a life long leftie and trade unionist.

So this was all done without Posie Parker's consent?

If so it's really unfortunate that a fascist group that platforms Tommy Robinson managed to get close enough to film Helen Joyce and share it on their social media.

I am not condoning CMK's behaviour but there were definitely fascists there and it looks a lot like they were invited.

I mean how are we ever going to persuade anybody outside our own bubble, if people outside of it shouldn't even be allowed to turn up and listen? Osmosis?

So this was all done without Posie Parker's consent?
I've no idea whether it was or wasn't, you'd have to ask her.

Right wing people are after all, just as affected by this as left wing people, and if it was possible for your mind to be changed about some things Sappho, why is it impossible for other people's to be, if they're allowed to listen? Or do you think racism is somehow innate?

Right wing parents lose their children to what you call a cult, right wing trans widows lose their husbands. This is a great equaliser.

Women on FWR showed great patience with you (not me I'm a cow), explaining the error of your TRA ways, but other people are not allowed the same privilege? That smacks of pulling the ladder up.

Yes, you might be right that she's an unhinged zealot. It doesn't stop calling women and babies fascists, being a tactic.

And if she genuinely believes that misgendering someone makes the person a fascist, then her education has been completely wasted.

Personally, I'm going with misogynist who has been encouraged to abuse women and likes both it, and the back pats.

I'll be interested to see the next invented insult. Transphobia is meaningless, bigot has become almost comical, fascist is going the same way. What next?

I am not condoning CMK's behaviour but there were definitely fascists there and it looks a lot like they were invited.

It was a public event in a park. Anyone could turn up. No invite required.