Scotttish Hate Crime Bill - part 3

[ArabellaScott]

From For women Scotland's tweets:

twitter.com/ForwomenScot

And we're off!

Characteristic of sex

@JohannLamont
is up

@JohannLamont
says some will agree with her and some disagree but what she will say is not hateful.

She calls out @patrickharvie
for his male entitlement in ascribing to her a motive of transphobia.

Says more about his lack of self-awareness than how we make good law.

Loving Lamont.

legislation is complex: that is our job

sex aggravator may work against owmen because of manipulative men. that is a council of despair. We would never have legislated on rape, coercive control or domestic abuse. This legislation protects women

we're told women can wait

• bit vague, maybe only a year

on the other hand, when people have said should we pause the bill to build consensus, we've been told, no, we cannot wait

there's a lot of talented women who understand exactly what hate crime is, we should be talking to them

it's ludicrous to say the only way forward is to set up a working group

there is no need to stop putting t his into legislation, and let the group work on the detail and address unintended consequences

I have a lot of respect for groups mentioned before. Funded them as a minister

not arguing they are silenced, that is the ScotGov overwhelmingly listens to them above any other group

Scotgov doesn't have a list of women to test ideas on

only the group noted

it's a closed circle

we want to break into that circle

Of course the problem with adding sex is that puts into law the difference between sex and gender, that women are attacked because of their sex not their gender. ScotGov can't have that.

Fantastic point raised by Lamont - that Scotgov listens overwhelmingly to four govt-funded groups re women and ignores the rest of women's groups.

this govt has form in changing definitions

changing definitions round the gender representation on boards legislation

If you listen to women, and look at women's experience, it is self evident they should be in this bill.

'women are people and they more than anyone need the protection of the law'

concerns working group will come back in a year having redefined meanings of women and men

women face hate violence and abuse

vote now

I think I don't understand using the whip fully.

Surely it speaks to the weakness of the case that they have to force their members to vote along party lines instead of letting them be convinced by the arguments?

I think it's crap, greatpurple, yes. But SNP is not noted for being very democratic and open-minded.

Back now. Vote.

I am expecting them to not take Lamont's amendments.

No :(

camera pans a room full of men in suits ...

'add sex'

accept amendments - 53

reject - 68

fuckers.

Scotgov rejects 'sex' in the Hate Crime Bill. And throws women under the bus.

Looking forward to them now getting on with the important business of protecting the people who matter.

Arses. Yes why bother protecting women?

I'm going to stop posting for a bit, this is probably going to be a long one on the HCB overall. Will come back later!

Absolute shite.

Thanks for posting so far, Arabella.

Also can't sit here to listen to them discussing everything else after rejecting protecting women. It's too fucking depressing, frankly.

Now they will spend a lot of time discussing what women are allowed to say and think about their sex based rights.

While we are to sit nice and wait for the working group to decide if we are worthy of protection or not.

Adam Tomkins is up, though. I like him. Maybe he'll say something sensible.

We must guard against: vagueness and overreach

our rights and liberties should be interpreted and understood expansively

I'm raging.

Shady bastards expecting us to come cap in hand (bonnet?) to ask for permission to speak.
Always after the revolution eh?

Also raging. Now for the entire debate Humza Yousaf's pleas to consider the poor victims of hate crime I am always hearing 'but not women' 'except women' after every weaselly point.

it's a shit Bill, it's shit law, it's being rushed through, it's unnecessary and ill thought through.

Hopefully the whole fucking thing will be scunnered and go the way of the Named Person nonsense.

Humza now explaining why words in your own home can be a hate crime, too

JFC I cant believe this passed.