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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Lush Edinburgh say they wouldn't serve anyone in "woman" T-shirt

388 replies

Alicethroughtheblackmirror · 03/08/2020 19:55

Apparently some stickers found their way onto the Lush Edinburgh storefront causing horror and consternation on Princes St this morning. They are too awful to be shared, obviously, but clearly they carried some message of hateful bigotry - or biological fact as it used to be known.

Anyway, staff on the thread are letting it be known that anyone wearing a T-shirt carrying the dictionary definition of a woman would not be served - haven't seen a comment on what would happen if it said 'I ❤️ JKR'. Not sure how legal that is.

www.facebook.com/116815671689234/posts/3431297510241017/

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SerenityNowwwww · 04/08/2020 14:03

@MrsJamin

They've deleted all the comments on their Instagram post! So cowardly. If you're going to be against single sex prisons then at least be proud of it!
Well, better just help them out and let all your friends and family know. I point things like that out whenever I pass by the store in a stage whisper.
Roomba · 04/08/2020 14:09

Any recommendations for a good shampoo bar from another supplier? I'm happy to have an excuse to avoid Lush anyway.

I use this and it's great (also available in other scents, I know some people detest patchouli!). I get mine in my local health food/hippy cooperative, but Suma are a well known brand so they should be available elsewhere.

I've tried to post this three times now so apologies if I end up spamming the thread accidentally...

Lush Edinburgh say they wouldn't serve anyone in "woman" T-shirt
SerenityNowwwww · 04/08/2020 14:21

I see Sula have a website too. Not to be confused with the us company of the same name (similar products). .coop.

FairfaxAikman · 04/08/2020 15:01

@Smallsteps88

I really want to test how far they’ll go with policing the language of women.

Lush won’t serve me in a woman - noun- AHF T-shirt.

Would they serve me in a t-shirt that just says female or woman?

The I 💖 JKR poster was removed from the rail station. Would one simply saying JKR be removed?

I have the template for the t-shirt I Gaelic. I wonder how that would go down?
FairfaxAikman · 04/08/2020 15:09

@OneWomanOneDog

Thank you to the person who prompted me to look up the CEO's photo. Yes it's damn obvious where the mysogyny of lush comes from.

I stopped buying their shyte when they supported the hunt sabs - an organisation with a long history of violence against animals and people whilst claiming to be against violence towards animals.

The police campaign was controversial not because of what they were claiming to support but how the marketing was executed made it look like they were anti (all) police.

The kissing campaign that was women (no extra large women though) wearing t-shirts which members of the public were encouraged to kiss.

They did a 10 hour live stream "animal testing" on a performance artist dressed in nude clothing on a leash in their window. She was force fed, injected with saline and some other stuff.

It was female staff who were "strongly encouraged" to go naked under their aprons for a campaign about excess packaging.

They're no stranger to controversy in their marketing. It's a deliberate strategy. They know exactly what they are doing. They're courting the woke brigade. This is exactly in alignment with their target market, woke young women who have drunk the kool-aid.

I think the most effective response to this incident is to stop giving it airtime. One person placing one sticker has given them the opportunity for outrage porn marketing for free. Let's not.

We are not the target market - as you can tell by the proportion of people replying who are disappointed to not be able to boycott them. We are just props in their outrage porn movie.

They lost me at the sabs campaign too. I'm by no means pro-hunt but the sabs are a thinly veiled cover for thugs who enjoy violence. They are the woke equipment of football casuals.
CharlieParley · 04/08/2020 15:33

@CountreeGurl

I think it is great to see a business standing up for what it believes in. If you don't like it don't shop there, simple.
They did so in response to one solitary sticker saying

KEEP
PRISONS
SINGLE
SEX
XX

So they are standing up against international human rights law which stipulates that for their protection, female prisoners must be accommodated seperately from male prisoners. On the basis of their sex.

I don't know about you, but a shop publicly declaring that you will unlawfully discriminate against a protected group asserting their protected characteristic because the shop opposes international human rights law designed to protect that group is a shitty stance whichever way you look at it.

SerenityNowwwww · 04/08/2020 15:35

Is it what the ‘business believes’? Or a Wokey staff member who wants to get their points? The one near me had hand made ‘black trans lives matter’ in their windows. Sounds like HQ just lets the kiddies get on with it.

NeedToKnow101 · 04/08/2020 15:39

@Thisismytimetoshine

The sticker just says "Keep prisons single sex"?? And there were numbnuts posting on Lush's Facebook "OMG, hope you guys are safe"?! I literally can't comprehend most of this, it just won't compute. 🤯
What you said! HmmShock
OneWomanOneDog · 04/08/2020 15:41

Who are Lush's target market?

The young and the woke. Pre-teen through to 20-something year old women or rather anybody who identifies as one who like to think of themselves as warriors for justice doing their bit by buying overpriced, overperfumed "ethical" cosmetics.

That's not to say that people who aren't that demographic don't shop there too, but they're not the main target money.

SophocIestheFox · 04/08/2020 15:43

[quote JudyGemstone]I've recently discovered Facetheory skincare products, they have great quality ingredients for really decent value. 'Vegan' and made in U.K.

www.facetheory.com/[/quote]
Thank you, I’ve looked at all the suggestions on this thread for an ultrabland cleanser dupe, and the vitamin c hot cloth one looks the closest yet! Bye bye lush.

OldQueen1969 · 04/08/2020 15:45

Haven't read the whole thread, but initial thoughts are....

FFS - Retail shops should display goods, people come in, buy them, walk out. When did retail have to become so damn politically fraught??

I have my own (in death throes - thanks interweebz and Covid) bricks and mortar shop. I have never refused to serve anyone because of what they were wearing. If they're handing me their moolah, I give not one fig - I would probably be less than welcoming to anyone wearing Nazi regalia and the item they desired may suddenly not ne for sale - likewise any white power symbolism - but that's me and my perogative and it's never happened because we're blatantly an inclusive space - inclusive to ALL unless behaviour is bad (like the drunk chap who fell asleep on my floor after terrorising my MIL with dementia and whom the police were most put out at having to remove as I apparently should have manhandled out said volatile chap myself apparently.... ) anyhoo, my point is that Lush stink. Literally. There is nothing remotely offensive about the dictionary definition of woman - it's a fact.

I'm offended by many "facts" but it's no=one else's problem and mine to manage.

Blanket political posturing by commercial outlets especially in this area really gets my goat.

Sorry for minor incoherence - breaking down my shop and it's depressing me. Oh for the luxury to be so wrongly picky about one's clientele......

ErrolTheDragon · 04/08/2020 15:49

@Thisismytimetoshine

The sticker just says "Keep prisons single sex"?? And there were numbnuts posting on Lush's Facebook "OMG, hope you guys are safe"?! I literally can't comprehend most of this, it just won't compute. 🤯
A more rational and compassionate response would have been "OMG, I hope women prisoners are safe".Hmm

Though I suppose they might be sufficiently blissfully ignorant as to not realise that 'keep prisons single sex' is shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted'. 'Return prisons to being single sex' would have been more accurate.

NonnyMouse1337 · 04/08/2020 15:56

Very sorry about your business struggling in the current circumstances OldQueen1969.FlowersFlowers

contactusdeletus · 04/08/2020 15:58

@StillNotAGirl

Would they serve someone wearing a man definition tee-shirt I wonder?

And would it make a difference whether it was a man or a woman wearing said tee-shirt?

Hmm

This interests me, and could be an eye-opening way to protest. Get male allies to wear the "woman = adult human female" t shirts, and watch as Lush predictably does not confront or refuse to serve them. Then get women to try the same. Undercover record the experiences of each, publish the video online, and then threaten legal action (as at this point sex-based discrimination would clearly be at play).

Note: I would blur the faces of the shop employees if anyone does pick up on this idea, as the rot comes from the top and it's not fair to punish them for obeying orders from management. I would also not initially attempt to engage staff in conversation about the issues. Just walk in with the shirt on full display and buy some small (preferably returnable) item. If challenged we and our allies can then calmly ask what's offensive about defining a woman according the dictionary, and why we can't choose to self-identify according to sex.

There's no Lush store near me and I don't have any male allies who would care enough to get involved, but I would really love to do it. I'm sick of this sexist nonsense going unchecked by corporations who specifically market their products to women. Bad PR is the least they deserve.

SilverOtter · 04/08/2020 15:59

I've hated them ever since discovering they backed hunt sabs years ago. Their current stance does not shock me unfortunately.

SophocIestheFox · 04/08/2020 16:04

I fully expect to order a takeaway without being lectured on whether there is a solution to conflict in the Middle East, I generally get my gas supplied without the company handwringing over Faroese whaling, so why can’t I buy my fucking moisturiser without the side order of moralising??

Coffeeandbeans · 04/08/2020 16:06

They lost me at their police campaign. Over priced smelly stuff.

Onestepup · 04/08/2020 16:07

Shame Lush are truth phobic, science phobic and woman phobic.They are also uneducated on trans topics if they think recognising biological sex is 'transphobic'.

OldQueen1969 · 04/08/2020 16:07

@NonnyMouse1337 Thank you..... much appreciated xxx

JudyGemstone · 04/08/2020 16:09

Sophocles - they have an online test thing that recommends suitable products, although they're really responsive on Facebook if you have any questions and will refund if no good.

(I don't work for them!)

MrsJamin · 04/08/2020 16:10

It's just a big pr stunt isn't it? Be woke and be offended to get your shop in the spotlight. I wonder whether any of them at lush actually believe prisons should be unisex. They got into an Edinburgh online news site that just copied the info from the Facebook post without saying what the sticker was, which suits lush's chosen narrative. I wonder whether lush Edinburgh just tipped them off and paid for the article? It actually seems like the most likely reason for them putting that big sign in their shop.

northstars · 04/08/2020 16:11

Have they deleted their Facebook post? Shock can’t open the link

Sexnotgender · 04/08/2020 16:13

@northstars

Have they deleted their Facebook post? Shock can’t open the link
I can’t either. I suspect they’ve either deleted it or banned us terrible women from it.
SerenityNowwwww · 04/08/2020 16:14

Nope it’s still there. Have you been put on the naughty step?

FairfaxAikman · 04/08/2020 16:17

@MrsJamin

It's just a big pr stunt isn't it? Be woke and be offended to get your shop in the spotlight. I wonder whether any of them at lush actually believe prisons should be unisex. They got into an Edinburgh online news site that just copied the info from the Facebook post without saying what the sticker was, which suits lush's chosen narrative. I wonder whether lush Edinburgh just tipped them off and paid for the article? It actually seems like the most likely reason for them putting that big sign in their shop.
Edinburgh Live by any chance? Their Editor is Hilary Mitchell (formerly of Buzzfeed) and she is a self-described trans ally.
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