I am Jazz. ***Trans content. Please do not open if you just want to post insults or whinge about another trans thread***

[CosmicPineapple]

I am Jazz is a reality show focusing on the journey of a teenage transgirl/woman whos parents supported transition from aged 5 and has been on TV since aged 6.
Now aged 16.

I don't watch the show as I strongly disagree with everything about it. However I briefly saw a clip of the next episode as the tv happened to be on the channel that airs I am Jazz I had been watching say yes to the dress and it was about dating.

Jazz goes to a sort of speed dating event where everyone is sat in the dark. Jazz wants a relationship, which is normal for a teenager however Jazz does not tell the boys/men that they are trans and in fact male.
As they are in darkness Jazz feels that if they get to know each other without the barrier of seeing each other/being trans it may lead to a relationship.

For me this is totally wrong.
Why should it be ok for Jazz or anyone to withold the truth about a very important aspect of who they are?
Plus I would imagine there to be some very upset and angry teenage boys when they find out they have been duped and lied to.

I remember a good few years ago where a man killed his partner after finding out on a TV show that they were trans. There have been a few similar murders over the years.
I am in no way condoning the murder or harm of another person I am just highlighting the danger that can come if you lie about the sex you are and it should not be encouraged as no relationship can survive on lies.

I just wondered what other peoples thoughts are on the subject of lying about your sex to the people you date?

If a boy with a very feminine voice did the speed dating in the dark then only revealed their male self to the boy who liked them in the light that boy would feel duped. It's the same thing and needs said straight away. I allways hated Jackie Kay's trumpet for this reason, and while boys don't cry is hugely sympathetic I allways wondered why the girl didn't feel angered by this deception.

Part of me wonders whether there might be a subconscious parental motivation for rendering trans children with a very muted ability to experience sexual feeling.

I also can't quite understand why this type of interference is not perceived as similar to, say, FGM. With FGM, you remove part of the genital source for sexual feeling in girls; with puberty blockers and cross hormones in someone like Jazz, you are stopping those genital sources from developing.

The outcome is pretty much the same, surely?

I am not a dick bin

The outcome is pretty much the same, surely

Yes, it is. It's also, I think, something to do with looking at your little boy child and imagining a girl child, without considering that they will become adult with a fully comprehensive sex life.

The only thing 3yrolds are consistent, persistent and insistent about is not sleeping. And eating their own snot. Hope to fuck this kid sues the hell out of the show, his doctors, parents and anyone else who encouraged this circus.

Jazz may not know what it is like to have a libido personally, but as an adult will be surrounded by other adults who do, and every form of media including sexuality as a large part of being an adult being. It will be another form of alienation and exclusion from the world.

I keep thinking of the case in the media lately of Charlie Gard, another situation where the basic common sense rights of the child to protection have been sacrificed to modern niceness to adults needing to make their choices and being pulled towards band wagons, and social media providing a very influential framework for it all. Two vulnerable kids whose interests should have been put first, and adults should have been brave enough to say no.

datun the equivalent thing would have been to get your son hair plugs, lifts in his shoes and maybe some kind of facelift

Why do we let people do this to children?

Gonegonegone

I know (you had me at snot).

Where the fuck is commonsense? And experience/intuition/knowledge.

AdalindSchade

Well exactly. And I did muse for five minutes on whether or not I would ever have contemplated it.

What if he had gone online and been sucked into like-minded individuals pissed off over their hair, height and forehead? And that 'tribe' joined another tribe.

Then you have pro ana all over again.

And I'm not disputing that gender dysphoria is a very real thing and very distressing. But people are taking A and getting to Z.

When did we become so scared to parent our children?

I suspect Jazz became Jazz because money and fame was in the parents sights?
I think I may need to watch the show even though I disagree with it I want to watvh and listen to the parents.

Poor Jazz. I didn't realise doing it so early me at no libido and no sexual function. Surely that is a compelling reason to wait til post puberty, if anymore were actually needed.

I have never watched the show but have just found a few clips on YouTube.

There was one where the mum tells her husband they're going to a drag show for Jazz's 16th birthday and the husband can barely say the word penis to his wife and it's very stilted and I just wonder how on earth they can be in the situation they're in with Jazz given that they giggle and are awkward saying the words "balls" and "penis" to each other. Or maybe that's exactly why they have got to where they are.

HarryBiscuit

Apparently Jazz was concerned over what his genitalia would look like should he go for the neovagina.

I haven't seen it, but I've read that there was a cringing conversation where he asked his father quite how much of a vagina a man would see when he was having sex with a woman.

Apparently the dad was too embarrassed to answer.

What struck me was it was like some kind of weird tea time conversation.

The sort of things that might floor a parent momentarily is stuff like what is sperm, what is an orgasm, etc. Not how much of mum's vagina do you see when you're having sex with her? Because, not only is the answer all of it, but I couldn't help thinking it was a very juvenile thing to ask. Not something a 17-year-old would ever contemplate. Unless they had the mind of a child, which is a horrifying thought.

My son doesn't feel the need to bond with a girl and he assures me he is 100% heterosexual. He is 16.

I honestly feel that this child is being fed to the wolves. It's disgusting to read about her. She will get all the affirmation she needs regarding being female but she isn't at the end of it all.

So sad that a young person has been mistreated in this way and exploited by her parents.

Gavel it's a catch 22 situation. If the child goes through puberty then it will be much more difficult for them to 'pass' because they will have gone through the puberty of their undesired sex and therefore will have acquired physical characteristics of that sex (size, deeoness of voice, body hair distribution, etc etc). These characteristics are difficult to reverse, even with hormone therapy and surgery. If they are given hormone blockers the genitals don't develop enough for successful SRS to be carried out. So it's a choice of a being more likely to 'pass' or having a 'functioning neovagina'.
I feel sorry for Jazz. She doesn't seem to understand sex at all. In one scene she was asking her dad if men looked at their partners vaginas a
lot. And I've got to add, I don't think she does look that feminine, even with with puberty blockers and oestrogen therapy.
I think her father is starting to have some regrets and guilt now. I suspect the mother has either munchausens by proxy, or they cooked up a plan between them to monetize their child. See Lauren Harries and her parents.

The more info you post Datun the angrier i become at what this child has been put through.
Why has this been allowed to happen?

And I'm not disputing that gender dysphoria is a very real thing and very distressing. But people are taking A and getting to Z.

What do you mean by this Datun

CosmicPineapple

Believe it or not, I try very hard not to be one-sided. But I think the odds are stacked against Jazz. I just do.

Being sexually dysfunctional for the rest of your life cannot be considered living your 'authentic' life, surely?

Elendon

What I mean is gender dysphoria is a real and distressing condition. I don't think it should lead to somebody like Jazz.

As an adult, maybe, possibly. Although I would far rather see some kind of therapy (rather than medicalisation) that could reconcile people to their natal sex.

I think there are many reasons for being trans. But none of them include a female brain in a male body.

It isnt Datun.

My mum bless her always told me not to ingore my instincts. If it feels wrong then it probably is. Thats how I feel about Jazz.

The questions I would like answered are why is autism so over represented trans community?

Why are late transitioning transwomen over represented in male dominated areas, like tech, the military, etc.

Why is there a correlation between stringently defined gender roles in a family who then produce trans children?

Why is there a correlation, in America, between Christian fundamentalists who then produce trans children?

Why are women who transition over representated terms of experiencing domestic/sexual abuse (of either themselves or their mother) or those who have a homosexual orientation?

Why are women transitioning to escape female gender roles, and men transitioning to achieve female gender roles?

Why are we not allowed to ask these questions? Why are people being shut down?

Well we all know that vaginas do not give a woman sexual pleasure. That would be the clitoris, the uterus, the cervix and the fallopian tubes and ovaries. The vagina is a vessel. A vessel that receives and expunges. It expunges blood products and babies and bacteria (sorry but sperm that doesn't make it essentially becomes bacteria).

Of course part of the pleasure in heterosexual sex as a female is receiving the penis, and being connected. As well as a multitude of other things. Skin, brain, breasts. This child will never know those pleasures in a tactile sense, and will only imagine them.

Thanks Datun

Yes that is really odd/disturbing Datun.

I'm not sure it's relevant but I agree with pp who say that Jazz doesn't really pass. I'm really not trying to bitchy or anything but I think when you watch the programme if I hadn't known I think I would have thought they were a boy with long hair. Some men, straight and gay (but perhaps more frequently gay), do have long and glossy hair. I don't think it's the main problem in this situation though, the other aspects are far worse.