I am Jazz. ***Trans content. Please do not open if you just want to post insults or whinge about another trans thread***

[CosmicPineapple]

I am Jazz is a reality show focusing on the journey of a teenage transgirl/woman whos parents supported transition from aged 5 and has been on TV since aged 6.
Now aged 16.

I don't watch the show as I strongly disagree with everything about it. However I briefly saw a clip of the next episode as the tv happened to be on the channel that airs I am Jazz I had been watching say yes to the dress and it was about dating.

Jazz goes to a sort of speed dating event where everyone is sat in the dark. Jazz wants a relationship, which is normal for a teenager however Jazz does not tell the boys/men that they are trans and in fact male.
As they are in darkness Jazz feels that if they get to know each other without the barrier of seeing each other/being trans it may lead to a relationship.

For me this is totally wrong.
Why should it be ok for Jazz or anyone to withold the truth about a very important aspect of who they are?
Plus I would imagine there to be some very upset and angry teenage boys when they find out they have been duped and lied to.

I remember a good few years ago where a man killed his partner after finding out on a TV show that they were trans. There have been a few similar murders over the years.
I am in no way condoning the murder or harm of another person I am just highlighting the danger that can come if you lie about the sex you are and it should not be encouraged as no relationship can survive on lies.

I just wondered what other peoples thoughts are on the subject of lying about your sex to the people you date?

Oh and just another thought about lying - I lost my virginity to someone who claimed to be five years younger than he was - ie just five years older than me instead of the ten years older he was in reality. I felt robbed of an important decision that I probably wouldn't have made based on his lie.

In reply to Maisy ... I think it is one thing for this to happen 'off air' and one thing for it to be televised. I can't help thinking it is setting up two very vulnerable young people in a situation that there are no etiquette manuals for.

Why is Jazz dating if no libido etc? I'm a bit confused.

Need for normality?
Having a bond closeness with another person.
Wanting to fall in love?

I hope that Jazz gets all those things but I cannot see that happening if the person who Jazz is, is kept a secret.
Then again Jazz is so high profile now i doubt anyone would not know about her identity/status.

WhichJob

I don't know. It's incredibly difficult to find information about this online.

I know that the head of the penis is positioned to make a clitoris. But that's assuming a fully developed, mature penis. Coupled with the fact that a penis has half the number of nerve endings of a clitoris, it sounds like an unsatisfactory clitoris for anyone. And I believe achieving orgasm is quite difficult for adults.

As Jazz's genitals remain those of an 11-year-old, I'm assuming that any sexual function, should she retain them, would be that of an 11-year-old.

Also, although puberty blockers are reversible, something like 99% of children who on them, go on to cross sex hormones. These hormones then induce puberty of the opposite sex.

The doctor said, pointing to Jazz's breasts, that they have done him a favour there, but not down there, pointing to his crotch.

I have no idea what would happen if Jazz was suddenly put on male hormones, instead of female. Research on the long-term use of hormones and puberty blockers is scant. I do know that cross sex hormones are considered irreversible.

Women who detransition still grow facial hair and have a deep voice that they can't change.

It's like Iran. The "doctor" is a family member if I'm thinking of the right child. Jazz is a walking gender experiment to some. Poor child, I hope they find happiness.

If left alone, or fifteen years ago before all this was a fashionable 'thing', Jazz most likely would have grown into an effeminate gay teenager - absolutely nothing wrong with that - and grown into gay sexuality during adolescence with a dating pool of men finding Jazz very attractive and physically perfect exactly as is. At eleven there was no way to know that might not happen as puberty kicked in properly. It's awful that Jazz no longer has that door open, and never will.

"she has blithely asserted that she can use one of her sisters as a surrogate."

Datun, on a similar note, I watched Leo: Becoming A Trans Man recently in which Leo declared they would like their eggs frozen before taking T so that in the future they can use donor sperm and their wife or girlfriend can have a 'small operation' to have the embryo implanted so that Leo can have biological children.

The level of entitlement is astounding.

I've seen one episode, the last one when Jazz was meeting the consultant re the neo vagina
I only watched because it was on after my guilty secret say yes to the dress
It's terrible how Jazz is being exploited and disturbing how the whole family, including grandparents, are involved with discussions about sexual feelings
Jazz said they had never experienced any sexual feelings at all. Jazz also talked a lot about romance and meeting the man of her dreams and that she is like any other girl
Of course she isn't. An animated Jazz does not pass as well as a carefully shot photograph
The whole thing is very disturbing
I would expect to be told early in a relationship if my partner had been born the opposite sex that I believed them to be

I would expect to be told early in a relationship if my partner had been born the opposite sex that I believed them to be

And is sterile and sexually dysfunctional.

I don't understand the point of giving jazz a neovagina. It smacks of being utilised as a hole and nothing more, for someone else.

It's this patriarchal concept that vaginas are nothing more than a receptacle for penises.

It would have no biological function. It doesn't 'give' in the same way as a natal vagina and she's not going to feel sexual pleasure.

So who's it for?

If left alone, or fifteen years ago before all this was a fashionable 'thing', Jazz most likely would have grown into an effeminate gay teenager - absolutely nothing wrong with that - and grown into gay sexuality during adolescence with a dating pool of men finding Jazz very attractive and physically perfect exactly as is. At eleven there was no way to know that might not happen as puberty kicked in properly. It's awful that Jazz no longer has that door open, and never will.

This ^^. I won't even let my DC decide about piercing their ears because I consider them too young but an 11yo can decide to do this to their bodies? No.

Datun I would assume it is for Jazz so she can have the body that she has always wanted....a woman's body. And I'm sure if she's dating men it will eventually prove quite handy as a 'receptacle for a penis'. As it does for many women.

'And I'm sure if she's dating men it will eventually prove quite handy as a 'receptacle for a penis'. As it does for many women.'

This is becoming increasingly uncommon, surely?

Women who do not experience sexual pleasure are much more confident about refusing sex now. Many identify as asexual.

Mizk, my vagina is not a 'receptacle for a penis' it is a space for me to enjoy sexual pleasure and I gave birth out of it too.

This is all quite sad and worrying. I've just read the link that says she has depression. She shouldn't be going through this on TV, we have no idea that it's going to end well. Her parents should be looking out for her mental health and this level of scrutiny isn't helpful.

As it does for many women

Most of us expect to get reciprocal pleasure out of it though. We don't, or shouldn't, exist just for men...

I would assume it is for Jazz so she can have the body that she has always wanted....a woman's body

They won't have a womans body though. They will have a pastiche of one at best. A non working fake vagina that has no function is not a womans body.

Mizk, my vagina is not a 'receptacle for a penis' it is a space for me to enjoy sexual pleasure and I gave birth out of it too

That is the point, the fake vagina won't allow for sexual pleasure at all, and the owner of it will never give birth.

I get that, I was pointing out to Mizk what ours are actually for which Jazz will sadly never have. For what it is worth if I could switch bodies with DH for a day, I would love to find out what sex feels like to him, I bet it is quite different, but as that isn't actually possible, despite what people are promised, I will stick with the body I have got.

MizK

We will have to disagree. I don't think an 11-year-old boy is capable of asserting with any degree of autonomy that he wants a 'woman's body'. Neither has he got one.

When I said a receptacle for a penis, that's exactly what I meant.

Apart from the biological function , a woman with a vagina (and clitoris) will usually experience sexual pleasure.

Jazz will have nothing to sexually stimulate.

By no stretch of the imagination has Jazz 'become a woman'.

Her parents should be looking out for her mental health and this level of scrutiny isn't helpful.

Nobody is protecting Jazz in any way. It's exploitation of a vulnerable child. The parents are making money, as are the TV companies.

aginghippy

I agree. But the spin is so effective that people are not dismantling any of this.

People watch the show. They may or may not come away feeling uneasy. But when you actually point out the enormity of what has happened to Jazz, there's a slight disconnect.

What they've seen somehow doesn't quite correlate with the reality, even when they know it. Until a small mind shift takes place.

It's actually rather chilling.

I would assume it is for Jazz so she can have the body that she has always wanted....a woman's body

Any "neovaginal" cavity will either be made out of constantly mucus producing colon tissue, which has a unique...odour, or, out of the flesh of Jazz's thigh.
The "neoclitoris" sometimes necrotises and falls off in surgeries that use such methods, (as opposed to penile inversion,) which is why at least one doctor who does these surgeries, adds what is essentially a "back up neoclitoris" which Jazz does not have the amount of penile tissue for.
They will have to dilate daily for many years, and will unlikely ever experience genital sexual pleasure, being as their genitals will be constructed from prepubescent penis and scrotum, (of which they apparently have very little,) as well as colon, or penis, scrotum, and thigh skin.
Their neovagina's normal state, bacterially, will most closely resemble that of a woman with BV.
Their breasts are abnormally developed (tuberous,) so they will eventually likely have surgery on those, and they are sterile, depressed, isolated due to their unique issues, and all of this is irreversible.
It's terribly, terribly sad, and I think the worst thing about it is that the adults in Jazz's life have groomed them into it from the age of 5, under the guise of "helping." The people who should have protected Jazz, have led them into a position where Jazz is depressed, in a body that will never function normally, and due to irreversible biological changes and financial reasons, is unable to change their mind

What is BV?

@WhichJob bacterial vaginosis

Thanks, this is an informative thread.