Caitlyn Jenner

[Terfinator]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4398858/Caitlyn-Jenner-underwent-gender-reassignment-surgery.html

(Yes, it's the DM - because it's one of the only news sources which is balanced on the trans issue)

Saint Caitlyn has a book coming out in which she reveals that she HAS had gender reassessment surgery. I think a few people on here thought that they hadn't.

Anyway, the DM have some interesting pictures which show how trans surgery works.

As always, the comments are very telling... Fair play to the DM for keeping them open!

Oh don't worry, I know it's not my fault! Wasn't a woe is me whinge, just to use my example of how devious and manipulative these men can be. Plus this happens in a binge/purge cycle. It isn't all the time. It is like a series of affairs, but with themselves.

birdbandit
I feel I should rtft and see your posts. But in your opinion do you think Bruce''s exs might have had a penny dropping moment over things that didn't add up for them during their marriages when he became 'Caitlyn' so publically?

Terfinator the DM loves to take the piss out of Caitlyn in a passive agressive way. They also allow most of the comments to stand.

It is like a series of affairs, but with themselves.
So creepy and deranged.

Guardian Kris Jenner knew about Caitlyn because he had aready started to transition when they met. He reversed it in order to marry her.
I don't know what to make of Kris Jenner. I feel sorry for her on one level but then she is the one who chooses to monetize her personal family life.
to birdbandit

I'm so on board with the premise that the wives of these people had little idea. One tends to think one would know. But from what I have read that is very far from reality.

Men have managed to have double lives throughout history. With the wife knowing nothing about it. Long-term mistresses, second families, etc. And look how supremely effective gaslighting is.

But I agree that AGP is all about the self.

Holy moly, I wouldn't like to begin to speculate as to show no knew when in their quagmire. I imagine I know only the sanitised tip of the iceberg in my own. I have posted a wee bit about my situ under the username "notwhatiexpected" I forgot to switch accounts when I barged in on this thread!

Regarding monetizing the family, I have some sympathy. The poor woman has probably been on panic mode for so long. My husband when at the frothing peak threatened me and the kids with financial destruction if I didn't accept his true sexy self. She was probably desperate to build something, and to make her kids immune to financial abuse in their future relationships. The ultra feminine appearance and business of the Kardashian empire seems to me a reaction to him.

I know nothing about Kris K except it's all about the money, obviously.

But I have read a couple of accounts from wives who are happy to indulge their husband's fetish. I often wonder whether that sort of arrangement has any longevity.

Because from what I can understand the self obsession just gets worse. You try and understand and accommodate, but the demands increase. Much like transactivists in general actually.

for you bird. Obviously it's one thing sitting here talking about these things in the abstract and the principles involved, it's quite another reading about these comments when you are going through the experience yourself.

I can't work out if you are finding it a help or not. But you have our support.

I feel a huge amount of sympathy for Kris, hate the whole Kardashian thing, but want to build my way out of this without becoming (anymore) bitter.

Imagine how Kris felt when Caitlin got woman of the year, even after the car accident? It must just feel so unfair. She is being told by the world that her hurt doesn't matter. No wonder she wants /needs cash.

My H fooled me, and I lived with him, for so long. Why would anyone else be able to magically see through his bullshit?

It must get so boring. All they talk about it the transition
Im not surprised work is drying up for Cait, what else is there to say
Remember Kellie Maloney on CBB
Watching paint dry was more interesting

The guy tells me he isn't doing it anymore. He's in the purge bit. I am on top of things and building so I can go if he brings this into our home again. Don't worry about me! I am made of stern stuff, mamma bear etc. I don't like sympathy, makes me feel awkward, just want to bring some RL exp to the debate. I REALLY REALLY hope the world would wiser up asap about the shaggy nature of all this. It's all a bit Jimmy Saville.

birdbandit

I think your robust attitude and down-to-earth, practical viewpoint is standing you in very good stead.

birdbandit
My ex is an autogynephile. I had no idea as I didnt know what that was, and he hid it so well for so long. Basically, I walked in on him acting out, and realised he was living a double life.
Its only now with the whole trans thing blowing up that I've found the info online and put all the pieces together.

Its a form of deception, they don't reveal who they are at the outset as they know most women wouldn't be interested. then they gradually reveal their true agenda and use coercion to keep you as long as they can. The entire fantasy is an exciting game of control and the risk of being caught.
Its disturbingly similar to the behaviour of abusive men.

DJBaggySmalls

There was a thread on here recently about netmums, so I thought I would take a look.

I wondered what their attitude to transgenderism was.

I was very surprised to find posts from men who had AGP. Openly talking about it (although not calling it that). I ran out of patience quite quickly, but even in that time there were at least four.

I think it's far more prevalent than people realise.

That is why we have seen such an explosion in recent years. Whilst transgenderism was confined to transsexuals, it was under the radar. Now every cross dresser in the country has been given the green light, they are outnumbering the transsexuals and overjoyed to have their fetish sanitised/legitimised.

Do you think people know about this side of transgenderism? Or do they all still think that it's harmless?

dj did you have kids? We're you married, did you walk away there and then, or? Sorry if that's too personal. Please feel free to not reply or pm. Bloody men are weird. Read in the Daily Mail earlier (sidebar of shame!) about a man, pissed up, who was trying to have sex with a motorbike in public. I do not understand men.

I also read the guardian etc all. Thought I had better clarify!

There are a multitude of threads on Crossdressers.com about how to manipulate the wife, how to drip feed the info to make her more likely to accept. And they think they are doing this NOT just for their benefit!?!.

I agree about the weirdness of male sexuality caveat: not all men I don't get it. I can understand that fantasies, like dreams, bubble up from the unconscious and can be weird - in women too - but the compulsion to act them out, to create porn to see them acted out, pay prostitute's to act them out or commit crimes to act them out. It's just so fucking freaky and perverse. And entitled.

To live with an AGP is to truly understand the compulsion. The purge/binge cycle is the thing they all seem to have in common, until something seems to snap and tip them over, and then they crossdress/transition full time (usually this happens after a life-time of secret crossdressing, around their mid-40s). Don't know if they are done using male privilege, where they are at their highest professionally and have a wife's life-time's work and/or captured by children, or they just have crossed every thrilling barrier and need the ultimate thrill of everyone seeing them as female all time, everywhere.
Therapists cannot help wives and SOs as they haven't really seen it up close and personal, the clever tricks and mind games these men seem to be expert at.

A therapist would be hard to come by who knows that most of the AGP partners have been unwilling and guilted into sex and intimacy, that the subtle erasure of your own boundaries and what you are comfortable with is gone so much you cannot even express it.

BTW I appreciate you rl experience in the debate bird & baggysmalls.

I can't get my head around the partners who 'support their transition' and even fund the srs. It's always presented like that in the media. What about her own needs?

Perhaps it's like a pr thing women get advised to trot this line out when they speak to the media.

Thanks MightyMikey a very sobering post.

I remember many, many years ago seeing a Mtt working in a cafe at the till, long before I knew about any of this and I was an ordinary liberal/lefty, understanding/compassionate youngster.

This Mtts behaviour was really odd - an almost deranged and hysterical joy at simply serving customers and using the cash register. My friend and I threw each other a smirking glance like 'weirdo!', and I also felt irritated by the Mtt, which made me feel uncomfortable about my self-perception as an uber understanding, kind, 'live and let live' person. 'Why was I being so judgemental and unkind?' I asked myself.

Now, all these years later I understand what was going on, why he seemed so hysterical and why I felt irritated. It was because he was clearly getting off on it. The look in his eyes was not normal - it was kind of manic, like watching someone on a winning streak on the slot machines. I was annoyed because this bloke was getting off on dressing up, getting a job, seeing his painted nails tapping at the cash register, serving me a cup of tea, as a woman, and he couldn't believe he was getting away with it. No wonder I felt annoyed - I was being used- and there I was doing all that soul-searching.

I sometimes buy clothes on eBay. If I want to buy female undergarments it's becoming more and more common to see men dressed in them. It makes me so angry - they're invading female space and getting off on it.

ladyballs

Do you mean they're selling them? Who is their target market?

Datun
I think most peoples view is that its just wearing womens clothes in private, a bit of harmless fun, till they start to get dragged into it and see where it leads.

birdbandit
Yes unfortunately, I have one DC by him. He couldn't cope with the responsibility of parenthood, has never paid a penny in maintenance.
He trashed me to our friends, made me out to be a psycho ex. We lived in poverty for years.
DS doesnt know about that side of him. He knows he is a pathological liar, he's been caught out by him. DS got disgusted with him and went NC.

That's interesting ladyballs at one point I was using eBay all the time and I kept getting suggestions on things like transvestite porn mags - which really confused me. Maybe it's because AGPs use eBay for exhibitionism and it skews the recommendation algorithms.