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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Do women use certain terms to 'shame' certain types of men?

639 replies

Enzouk · 14/10/2016 23:58

Just wondering about female perspectives on this. I increasingly hear women calling guys 'creepy' as a shaming tactic..generally I think that the women doing so do it only if they don't find the man attractive. Where as they will pander to a guy who is physically attractive to thrm they will hate on a guy who acts the exact same way who physically is not attractive to them. I have seen women do it in front of groups of friends in a sort of 'lets put this guy in his place' way. Thoughts? And what do you think of women who do this?

Also, i suppose on similar lines...are women more shallow than men with regards to physical attraction?

OP posts:
VestalVirgin · 18/10/2016 13:49

And we don't care whether he's good in bed. We only care what he looks like so we can steal his genes

Do we? But I really cannot afford to get pregnant right now ... so it really doesn't make sense for me to have sex, does it? After all, if I am not going to steal his genes, what's the point?

almondpudding · 18/10/2016 13:50

Older women don't count because we're unlikely to get pregnant and so are irrelevant in allowing men of all ages to contribute to the gene pool, as they deserve to do.

Marbleheadjohnson · 18/10/2016 13:51

Indeed, VestalVirgin, indeed.
As I said, Confused

lemonzest123 · 18/10/2016 13:52
Marbleheadjohnson · 18/10/2016 13:54

But is he Brad Pitt, lemonzest?

Oh , wait...

MostlyHet · 18/10/2016 13:55

I think as well, these claims that women have an easier time of it are thinking about a very narrow band of women - young, slim, attractive, probably white, perceived to be 'available', with good teeth (sorry couldn't resist the last one!).

Well, you see, the reasoning goes like this. Men are people. There are these other humanoids in the world who are decorative (but not people) and there for pleasure. Occasionally we hear off-stage noises that sound a bit like speech coming from a further group of humanoids who aren't decorative (and definitely aren't people) saying things which sound a bit like "but what about women who are older, or not attractive" - but though they sound a bit like that they can't possibly be meaningful speech, because (a) they're coming from non-people and (b) women are decorative by definition so older, non-attractive humanoids can't be women.

At least I think that's what they're trying to say. How would I know? I'm only an older, non-attractive humanoid who is incel ... going through a dry patch ... will never get shagged again because I'm a post-menopausal woman ... is single. But you know, rather than whinging about that, I've built a rather nice life for myself - interesting job, fabulous child, interesting and exciting stuff to do in our spare time (planning to go check out the world-record-breaking lego suspension bridge at the ICE at our earliest opportunity!)

Ohyesiam · 18/10/2016 14:00

I've only read the op, but surely being on the receiving end of sexual attention from someone who you want to have sex with is a welcome thing, and from someone you would not want to have sex with is unwelcome.
I can see how creepy could be used as a putdown though.

with

MrsTerryPratchett · 18/10/2016 14:35

And there was a recent study that showed that straight and bi women have the least orgasms. Straight men have orgasms almost 90% of the time, down to 60% for women sleeping with men.

Possibly if we thought it might actually be fun, we might engage in NSA sex more (not me, DH might object).

lemonzest123 · 18/10/2016 16:21

marble Nope but he's such a sweety he blows my tiny mind Smile

VestalVirgin · 18/10/2016 16:35

Possibly if we thought it might actually be fun, we might engage in NSA sex more

I actually read that orgasms are even rarer for women who not only have sex with men, but have anonymous one night stands with men.

I remember being very puzzled as to why these women do that. Having bad sex with a man who is a total sweetie and great partner, okay, but why would I have bad sex with random guys who won't even make me breakfast afterwards?

If the standard way to have sex would be the woman frottaging herself to orgasm using the man's belly, with zero risk of pregnancy, and guaranteed orgasm, then things would probably be different.
(That's the way people have sex in Egalia's Daughters, a novel that takes place in a fictional matriarchy that reminds one very, very, very much of real-life patriarchy, just with the sexes reversed.)

Shiningexample · 18/10/2016 16:37

Possibly if we thought it might actually be fun, we might engage in NSA sex more
nsa is a winner for straight men because in the main they dont need to be fearful of the women , he could physically overpower her if he had to, and even if the sexual chemistry might not be the best ever he has a high chance of gratification.
She probably wont pin him down, ride him hard for 5 minutes and then get off because she's had enough and doesnt care that he's barely had time to get aroused

Marbleheadjohnson · 18/10/2016 16:38

I've had great sex with a random guy. He even gave me a massage. Win.

As long as y'all are on the same page then it can be fun for all involved.

Shiningexample · 18/10/2016 16:40

I've had great sex with a random guy
thats good to know (so have I as it happens) but we'd need a much larger data set to draw any conclusions :o

Marbleheadjohnson · 18/10/2016 16:41

Quite, shining. I must qualify that statement by adding that it was just the one random guy! Twas the exception, not the rule.

Lorelei76 · 18/10/2016 17:17

Zef "If you shame them for trying then youre basically saying that they are not good enough to reproduce (on a basic level) and should be ashamed of their attempts. Youre trying to take away any level of control that these men have over their lives. That is feminism gone too far."

This is kind of hysterical.
If I say, no thanks, that's all I'm saying. I'm not interested in having children so it's got nothing to do with seeing a man in that way. At the risk of causing offence, wouldn't a man be more likely to be successful with a woman who was desperate for a baby? There certain,y seem to be a lot of people in horrible relationships because they were so keen to have children.

And saying no to a guy is hardly exerting control over his life. It would be funny if it wasn't quite scary.

Dervel · 18/10/2016 18:40

My word what a word salad of nonsense! All women are saying if anything is your unlikely to be furthering your genetic line with me sunshine.

Besides even if that risible utter nonsense was true wouldn't it also follow that by not hitting on the women they don't desire are also saying they don't deserve to further their genetic line either?

What an utter fail of an argument.

VestalVirgin · 18/10/2016 18:43

Lorelei, I hadn't even bothered to read this man's shitty opinion, but wow.

He really, really, really hates women and want to rape us all.

Because that is what saying that a man is entitled to have control over whether he reproduces means.

Men deciding to reproduce and forcing that decision on women is patriarchy in a nutshell. It is what patriarchy is all about.

Only, he is a coward and knows he could go to prison for violently raping a stranger in a dark alleyway, and therefore is very sad that women don't , like, let him rape us by using only coercion.

There is a high risk that someday he will find a woman who buys his bullshit, and then he will rape her, and feel good about himself, because in his mind, it is not rape if she didn't fight back.

Lorelei76 · 18/10/2016 18:51

Vestal, it's something else isn't it. Tbh I find anyone, male or female, who reduces everything to reproduction, very alarming. I don't think they can be living in the real world.

VestalVirgin · 18/10/2016 18:51

Besides even if that risible utter nonsense was true wouldn't it also follow that by not hitting on the women they don't desire are also saying they don't deserve to further their genetic line either?

Well, yes. I am daily insulted by millions of men who fail to offer their services in impregnating me. I mean, I don't want to get pregnant right now, but they don't know that.

It is just that women not having any control about whether we reproduce is the status quo in patriarchy, and women are very, very grateful to feminism that now at least we have, in theory, a right to NOT reproduce. (Not really, because abortion is still criminalized, but at least it is not always punished.)

Women just don't feel entitled to reproduce. That's why I don't throw a big temper tantrum about all those men deciding not to reproduce with me, thus telling me that I am so worthless they wouldn't even give me their sperm (which is way more insulting than me not wanting to risk my life and health to reproduce with them, by the way.)

HillaryFTW · 18/10/2016 19:18

Isn't this a site full of women who have selfishly removed their vaginas from the sharking dating pool by being in long term relationships. How dare we?

almondpudding · 18/10/2016 19:27

We should all be doing our duty and having children by as many men as possible in case some man is undeservedly kept out of the gene pool.

MrsTerryPratchett · 18/10/2016 19:41

As my old feminist evolutionary psychology prof used to say... eggs are expensive; sperm are cheap.

Lessthanaballpark · 18/10/2016 19:47

I think all this can be summed up with one word: entitlement

Men, regardless of whether they're hot or pug ugly, are encouraged by society to see themselves as entitled to sex, to see no embarrassment in seeking out NSA sex.

Women on the other hand don't. I haven't yet sex for ages. Would I like to? Sure! But I fit into the kind of description that I'm sure is at the bottom of pile of men's preferences. Therefore I don't see myself as entitled. Where is my power in your scheme of things OP?

Bah! I just get on with life. No point crying about it when there are so many other things in life to enjoy.

scallopsrgreat · 18/10/2016 20:17

Yes completely agree Lessthanaballpark.

MiscellaneousAssortment · 19/10/2016 00:19

Such an interesting thread, thank you :)

The eloquence and level of thinking has really woken my brain up. And it's so illuminating to see arguments reframed and the hypocrisy / woolly entitlement vanish under closer inspection.

Great thread, though just to be very clear, not great in the way the OP intended. Shock Grin