Is the term 'Angry Fucking' potentially offensive to some women?

[Ohsiena]

Ok I said I wouldn't start this, but I've been challenged to do so enough times, so I'm giving in.

It's about this thread - To think you should stay out of other people's bedrooms (378 Posts) 1This thread.

A very few of us understood why the term angry fucking was offensive to MrsC originally.

Most thought she had no sense of humour and just didn't get the joke.

Discussion was widened as a poster thught it was worse as used by a man. This has been attacked as sexist.

I stated on there that I'd like to see what some of the more feminist minded posters would make of this discussion.

I didn't want to start this, I've felt like a bit of a lone voice on there at times and need to do some RL stuff, but I've been called again and again to do so, so I have.

You'll see the phrase pearl clutching a lot....

Of course, to be fair, could have said girl scouts....have no wish to get flamed for THAT mistake..

lot of putting words in other people's mouths here...

I think putting words in other peoples mouths was the whole point of this thread. It seems to be an attempt to get as many feminists as possible to fight the op's corner.

Cant say as im impressed with someone trying to manipulate me into doing their bidding but im not gonna fret over it. the word fucking dosent offend me either in general use or in relation to sex. (sometimes I want to make love, other times I want sex and sometimes .... shock horror I like to fuck)

I found the term unnecessary and distasteful. It was a bit aggressive...enough for me to look at the poster name.

What was more awful, though, was the chorus of dismissive comments to the posters who said they were uncomfortable with the term.

And somewhere on the thread there was a reference to 'double teaming' or something similar. I hooked my judgey pants at that too.

And yes, a man making those comments is more offensive, not least because I conjure an image of him doing the deed...be it angry fucking or double teaming or whatever the term was. All seemed a bit degrading, somewhat aggressive and definitely unnecessary

Hoiked

Um, late to this but fwiw.. No, angry fucking shouldn't be offensive.

Fucking is a crude word for sex, sex is consensual. Rape is not consensual.

If the person who was offended based on her past says it was because she was on the receiving end of angry fucking.. she was raped. Two totally different things. Either she wanted to do it do she shouldn't be offended, or she was raped and the fact the her attacker was angry isn't really important, he would have done it either way. I'm probably not saying that well. Hope you can figure out what I am trying to say. .

I don't mean to be unkind I feel for the poster. But she seems to be confusing the two things. I say fucking and quite enjoy a bit of angry fucking but it's because I am in control and in no way of being coersed

'However, you don't get to imply to other people that their choice of a word to describe a sexual activity means they are involved in a violent relationship or are themselves sexually violent.'

DID anyone imply that? No, I don't think they did. I certainly didn't intend to.

'that you turn a thread about someone else's perfectly valid dilemma into a big screamy waa waaa mememe I'm So Offended dustup, or try to, is wanky.'

Er - no again. One person mentioned that she found it uncomfortable. She was told to stop being silly. I came along and mentioned I agreed with her. The reaction to this was fairly strong, and it went from there. I didn't want to turn it into a thread about how offended I, or she was, but it became a big discussion because I responded, and she did, to points raised by others about how we were daft and shouldn't be offended, and so on. That's generally how discussions start.

There was far more extreme language from the 'other' side, there was shouting and swearing. I thought I was being calm and fairly rational though sometimes people read what they think people are saying, not what they are saying, or an overtone is misconstrued.

I had forgotten about the 'double teaming' comment. I don't know what that means but yes I assumed it was something related to porn, and didn't much like the sound of it. There you go - doesn't mean the person saying these things was himself involved in dubious sexual practices.

Or that he did anything particularly wrong. Just some of us felt uncomfortable about what he said. That is all, really.

Hold on Mary! I said the first thing, but NOT the second. DEFINITELY not the second! Yes it made me question it. But just because one man might behave in a less than ideal way on a site like this, it doesn't mean they all do, and yes it was a sexist thing to say. Which I think I agreed you were right about at the time...but it was a feeling/thought I had and for some reason I wrote it down.
Hope that helps clarify.

Plenty of women behave in a less than ideal way on this site IMO.
Doesn't make me question the presence of women here.

I think plenty of posters were behaving in a less than ideal fashion on that thread... You included ed!

Indeed Pickled...plenty.

Hmmm yes indeed

Indeedy doo.

'Less than ideal' is different from the kind of jokes on that thread. Tbh, I have never had a woman friend make a joke regarding angry fucking and double-teaming. Nor have I seen these terms used in a jokey way in MN anywhere else, except by a male poster.

E.g., if I hear a lewd comment about a woman's breasts it is most likely a man making the comment. And it will be offensive. Poinless to compare a what-if scenario of a woman making a similar comment, because it probably wouldn't happen in that type of sexual manner.

Pretty sure I've seen women talking about simmering angry sex, and wasn't there an odd post from someone about their active.... life yesterday. Was that a bloke, as I sort of lost interest in it...?

I saw the thread in question and maybe it's because I used to be a comic nerd, but all I saw was "Don't make me angry.... and Lou Ferrigno".

Still, I'm unlikely to be triggered by anything like that.

Women do use offensive terms, on here and elsewhere. If you look back you might find my post referring to the use of the word 'nigger' by black people and by white people. I won't say it all again but I don't know if that is a point worth considering...or not.

EdsRedeemingQualities

any post's worth considering

What do you think the boundaries are of the words - and jokes - men and women can use appropriately? Who sets these?

I can see that for those who believe in the patriarchal construct that women are the disadvantaged parties, so where are the boundaries set, and where ddo we share them?

[Try and avoid this is a space for women, as mostly everyone seems to accept it isn't]

Chap, I am not saying women are prudes, far from it! I think there are loads of women who have an active sex life, and they enjoy variety, s&m, bondage and all sorts of things.

But this was not a thread about sexual proclivities, it was about boundaries. Women often talk about dildos and vibrators, but rarely make off-hand double-teaming or angry sex jokes. Or jokes about breasts or lesbians.

These are usually made by men. I think it is because women rarely think of other women in sexual terms the way men do. They think of themselves as sensual beings, but that doesn't translate into making inappropriate sexual comments about other women. We may think another woman looks 'hot', but is rarely followed by a thought ' oh I would like to do her', the way it is for many men. I know I am making generalisations, but I am struggling to explain the difference. I think at core it is that as women, we don't consider ourselves as sexual objects and many male sexual jokes tend to treat women as sexual objects.

This is going beyond the current thread. But on an instinctive level, I think that is why some women felt a bit put-off after reading some of the 'jokey' sexual comments.

Chap, I know you asked Ed about boundaries, but I can give one example.

We have a friend who is gorgeous looking. Me, and my other girl friends compliment her, and have told her that she las lovely legs, nice breasts etc. One day, a male friend made a comment to her that he really liked her breasts. We all went silent and our gorgeous friend was offended and uncomfortable. The jerk's excuse was that we had told her that she had a lovely figure so often, so what was wrong with him making a similar comment?

You figure (pardon the pun). There is a difference between men and women making sexual or other sensitive comments that relate to the opposite sex.