Agenda, much?

[Malificence]

I don't usually wander onto the MN facebook page but I was pretty horrified to find what looks very much like an MRA agenda posted on there.
I'm trying very hard to see what relevance the photo used for their site has regarding the voices of unheard children. Looks more like how they would like to see their women to me.

www.facebook.com/#!/mumsnet?sk=wall

I repeatedly got called a "silly girl" by the F4J men, despite remaining, for the most part, reasonable (OK, I had a little dig at Yarmouth, but that's not racism. Nor is it "man hating", or whatever you anti-feminists like to call it.

In fact, your darling little comment about us being "screeching, man hating banshees" shows the misogyny in your own mindset.

I said it yesterday, and I'll say it again. At least 75% of mothers who deny access do so because there is a real reason for them to fear their child may be harmed in access. Yet, the mothers are routinely made out to be evil, man hating banshees by F4J. What man is truly going to admit to being an abusive partner/father? Really?

Pfft, again? Aye, I'm still waiting on my prize from last night's full house...

Where do you get the figure of 75% from? Do you have research to back that figure up?

TeaJennie - FYI I'm a woman, a mother and a wife , married to a wonderful man for 27 years who is a fantastic father, sorry to burst your bubble but I am not projecting my "failed relationships".

The posts by those woman hating idiots were laughably transparent , if they were immediately recognisable to me, someone with no experience of men like that , well, do I have to spell it out?

It's precisely because I know what good men are, by what they do and how they behave towards women in particular, that I can spot the bad ones.

1 - I live with my daughter, who is not as you have described.

2 - I am not a woman-hater by any stretch, however I do deplore the level of abuse shown by women towards men (and myself on this thread) as displayed on the FB page last night.

3 - Its residency, not custody - custody hasn't been used in legal terms for a number of years.

4 - Shared parenting is not about a 50/50 split of time, its about both parents caring and taking responsibility for their children.

5 - You have made some very wide-sweeping generalisations, which are unhelpful, and not conducive to a proper debate.

But then you dont want a proper debate, do you?

Looks like they have arrived here instead, folks!

Are men excluded from shared parenting while still in a relationship with the mother? Does it only apply in the event of the breakdown of a relationship?

Oh Pu-lease...

Firstly, I'll have to double check the stats, proving quite difficult when the MRA's have overtaken most of the pages on google's results, and I need a paid membership to Sage to access the scholarly articles.

1. I live with my son. My three closest friends are men. All of which know me as a radical feminist. All of which laugh every time someone labels me a man-hater.

2)I believe the first blow came from Ludmil, who insisted on telling us how women use children for state benefits, etc... Are you as concerned about PHYSICAL violence against women, carried out by men, as you are about words that women type to men?

3. Regardless, they mean the same thing

4. But before a split, very few men take 50% of the responsibility of raising a child. Hence why 50-50 wouldn''t work. It's also disruptive to the child to be consistently back and forth.

5. So did the dear fellows from F4J...

Stop living in the patriarchy's shadow, and pandering to everything men say. It's ok to challenge them once in a while. Which is all we did.

SGB, just seen your post. :(

One of the idiots on FB has his own little page linking a recent AIBU thread about PMT symptoms - it's his proof about how horrible women are.

"This thread highlights and supports my view that mumsnet is guilty of sexism and hypocrisy. Women are openly discussing how violent they are to their Husbands and Children pretty much agreeing with one and other vindicating and excusing their committing domestic violence."

The shallow end of the gene pool springs to mind.

Beertricks, you've just reminded me...

No matter how often I tried, and I believe I was pretty persistent with the point, none of the F4J members found the idea of posting a picture with a girl (we were assured she was a child by Rod) gagged by duct tape disturbing.

None of them could understand why we found it disturbing.

But none of those men are likely to be the victims of Violence Against Women, are they?

I know gagging is also used in the BDSM scene, that's another debate, but again, same issue applies... None of them are likely to be teenage girls, photographed in an image that sexualises them in a BDSM manner. In fact, I'd hope to high heaven the girl in question doesn't know what BDSM is, yet. But the fact a group of men chose to photograph her in that manner STILL disturbs me.

Interesting that they chose a girl child not a boy child to gag isn't it.

Actually no, it's not that interesting on second thoughts.

It's predictable.

It's what they'd like to do to women.

I took a look at the video. They had one boy gagged. And three or four girls. The girls have become the forefront of the campaign.

By the forefront, I mean, they're the pawns in this game. They're being exploited by F4J, but aren't able to see it yet. :(

I presume they're child actors are they?

No, they're children who really don't see their fathers, or in one or two cases, their siblings, from what I've gathered...

I see that all last night's posts have vanished. Did Rod or Ludmil answer any of the questions put to them? I was waiting with little hope of a reasonable answer baited breath for their responses.

FrothyDragon - if I am who you thought I was, thank you for the compliment!

@ Frothy

1 - Congratulations on having male friends and being a feminist - I am unsure of the point you are trying to make.

2 - As someone who has experienced violent abuse themselves, of course I am concerned about domestic violence, which for the record, is not purely perpetrated by men on women - A Parity survey showed that around 40% of DV victims were men, abused by their female partners (HO stats back this up), soplease, lets not make the issue of DV a gender one.

3 - In an intact family, it is usually the man/father who is working long hours, all to provide for his family. Working hours are often not conducive to both parents being able to equally share care - but it is the quality, not the quantity that is important. Fathers who serve in the Armed Forces, emergency services, shift workers etc are by the very nature of their employment restricted in the amount of time that they can spend with their children - should they too be branded as irresponsible simply due to time constraints? As I stated before; shared parenting is NOT about an equal time split.

4 - I live in no-one's shadow, and follow only my own beliefs, if you find those unpalatable, then that is your prerogative, and we must agree to disagree.

Anyone who sees a sexual context in the posters that are being talked about is missing the point of the posters and video entirely - I suggest you watch the video (real children, not actors) and hear the messages for yourself.

That campaign is not very succesful if it makes people think of abuse against women and children, bdsm and silencing of women. Or maybe it is - it's very succesful in showing the mentality behind it.

Are you a member of F4J Jennie. You appear to be trying to help them promote their campaign.

How, for instance, do you know that those are real children?