Thread three: holding on to the end of the rope, life in the bunker with the PoTs, where parenting a teen is adversely affecting your mental health

[Pegsinarow]

Thread one here.

Thread two here.

With thanks once more to Billybagpuss for inspiration for the title and to Ticklingcheese and many other parents of teens who are emerging from the worst, or currently going through it, this is a support thread for parents who are being driven to despair by their teens. It is a continuation of two previous threads where many of us clubbed together to exchange experiences, possible strategies and understanding of what can be a very draining, isolating and distressing time for all!

Special thanks also to McMen05 who has kept this thread running smoothly and welcomed and responded to many newcomers and returnees this summer

And thanks again to Godmother for our "club" name: the PoTs!

Several helpful things emerged from the previous threads. First, so many of us are experiencing the same challenges or extraordinarily similar behaviour from our teens, in all sorts of different households and circumstances, that it can't all be down to poor parenting, despite what a tiny fraction of posters tried to tell us! So, whilst acknowledging our own mistakes and less than perfect parenting, and trying to find solutions and expert guidance, we also need to try and ditch the guilt and feelings of failure.

Also , it is evident there isn't as much state help available for teens as required, CAMHS for example is very over-stretched and under-resourced.

It was suggested by some posters that distancing ourselves from the very personal remarks and being slightly less "available" can be helpful and Tarragonsauce said that picking our battles, addressing our own symptoms, keeping in mind (with reference to school non-attendance, exam failure, bf issues) that there is more than one way to skin a cat, and remembering that "this too shall pass" can be helpful strategies.

Daintytoes explained an extremely helpful model of parent-child interaction in thread one at 07/04/2019 23:O6 .

Finally, remember that people don't tend to talk about their tortuous times with their teens because of shame, weariness, bewilderment and fear of being misunderstood or judged, but trust me, you are NOT alone! So last but definitely not least, thank you to each and every contributor to the first and second thread. PoTs tend to arrive on the thread feeling quite raw and demoralised but depite their own distress, they help other parents and it's great to be able to share the angst.

Tin hats on everybody for round three!

_

And finally, here is the original letter posted by BillyBagpuss on the first thread:

Dear Parent:

This is the letter that I wish I could write.

This fight we are in right now. I need it. I need this fight. I can’t tell you this because I don’t have the language for it and it wouldn’t make senslee anyway. But I need this fight. Badly. I need to hate you right now and I need you to survive it. I need you to survive my hating you and you hating me. I need this fight even though I hate it too. It doesn’t matter what this fight is even about: curfew, homework, laundry, my messy room, going out, staying in, leaving, not leaving, boyfriend, girlfriend, no friends, bad friends. It doesn’t matter. I need to fight you on it and I need you to fight me back.

I desperately need you to hold the other end of the rope. To hang on tightly while I thrash on the other end—while I find the handholds and footholds in this new world I feel like I am in. I used to know who I was, who you were, who we were. But right now I don’t. Right now I am looking for my edges and I can sometimes only find them when I am pulling on you. When I push everything I used to know to its edge. Then I feel like I exist and for a minute I can breathe. I know you long for the sweeter kid that I was. I know this because I long for that kid too, and some of that longing is what is so painful for me right now.

I need this fight and I need to see that no matter how bad or big my feelings are—they won’t destroy you or me. I need you to love me even at my worst, even when it looks like I don’t love you. I need you to love yourself and me for the both of us right now. I know it sucks to be disliked and labeled the bad guy. I feel the same way on the inside, but I need you to tolerate it and get other grownups to help you. Because I can’t right now. If you want to get all of your grown up friends together and have a ‘surviving-your-teenager-support-group-rage-fest’ that’s fine with me. Or talk about me behind my back--I don’t care. Just don’t give up on me. Don’t give up on this fight. I need it.

This is the fight that will teach me that my shadow is not bigger than my light. This is the fight that will teach me that bad feelings don’t mean the end of a relationship. This is the fight that will teach me how to listen to myself, even when it might disappoint others.

And this particular fight will end. Like any storm, it will blow over. And I will forget and you will forget. And then it will come back. And I will need you to hang on to the rope again. I will need this over and over for years.

I know there is nothing inherently satisfying in this job for you. I know I will likely never thank you for it or even acknowledge your side of it. In fact I will probably criticize you for all this hard work. It will seem like nothing you do will be enough. And yet, I am relying entirely on your ability to stay in this fight. No matter how much I argue. No matter how much I sulk. No matter how silent I get.

Please hang on to the other end of the rope. And know that you are doing the most important job that anyone could possibly be doing for me right now.

Love, Your Teenager

_

Hello I'm new to this thread but desperate for some help or even someone to say they're going through it too!
My son is 17 (18 in July) left college last year as it was boring and hasn't done anything since.
He applied to the raf but was turned down on health reasons ( another thread I had running)
I can't explain how frustrated and fed up I am. No one seems to be able to help and I don't know what to do.
You can't talk to him because you're 'lecturing' or saying 'the obvious'
We say to him, gently, you really need to get a job or do an apprenticeship but nothing gives him any 'passion' 😡
He's musical, but there's no money in that. He's in a band but they're all considerably younger than him so still at school.
I could weep with the loss of control. We can't have a conversation as he AUS he knows he has to get a job, yet isn't doing anything about it.
I've sent him lots of ideas for local jobs and he does nothing.
He got up today at 3pm.
His dad seems to be awfully tolerant right now but even he said 'you just can't talk to him, can't have a conversation at all' because he says we're having a go at him..

I KNOW there's worse, he doesn't hang round the streets, he's not on drugs , doesn't smoke or drink, he's just sooooo lazy.
Eats takeaways far too often and never ever eats fruit or veg. Or even cereal!
He has a job on a Friday night for 3 hours that pays him £25, that's where his money comes from ( oh and he walks my friends dog for £10 a week)
I'm terrified of him becoming a recluse. He never seems happy.
I know a job would give home some pride etc but every time we try to discuss he storms off.
I hope someone can help me, I spend too much time in tears. He doesn't seem to care!
I go out with our dog far too often ( poor dog!) to get away from him.
If I'm doing something wrong I'll stop it but I'm too close to be able to see it.

Mairyhinge

No advice, but I just logged on to pose an almost identical problem to yours. My DD will be 18 in June, diagnosed with autism. She dropped out of A levels after her first year as low grades. She put it down to lack of friends and being lonely. We asked if she could study online, and being supportive parents we duly paid... She has hardly done any study, spends most days, every day in bed to at least 3pm... She has a paper round, but she hardly goes out so she reasons there is no need for a better paid job

There is no reasoning with her, how much is down to autism and how much is down to teenage years or both, I don't know....

Thanks sandwiches..
I didn't want to mention but he has slight PDA, which has really increased the last couple of years.
He's the same, has no reason to earn money as doesn't go anywhere or do anything 🙄
We pay for driving lessons and drum lessons. I've tried not doing and they just stop. He's got no motivation AT ALL.

Mairyhinge

I suspect that DD has PDA, but not mentioned at the diagnosis, so I can only assume that she isn't and is just me inferring from some of her behaviour.

DD not interested in driving lessons as we live on a good bus route into the City centre and as I say, she doesn't go out, so no motivation to learn

I wish I had answers for you, can only offer hand hold and

Sandwiches77 - a hand hold is enough! It's nice to know it's not just us/ me.
He's got a car because we've bought our other kids their first car so he KNOWS he's to get a job to fund running it but I fear it may sit on the drive and rot!
3rd attempt at his theory test this week, and I've said if he fails again I won't pay for any more lessons soo that MIGHT help but the pda means the more I expect the less I get.
Ugh 😑
People say " he'll grow out of it " or "one day he will realise he needs money"
But WHEN 😫😘

Mairyhinge
People say that to me, and I say exactly the same, but when will DD grow out of it? (and I think to myself, what if she doesn't. What if, she does stay as a recluse? What if, the only job she has is her £7.50 a week paper round)

like your DD, she doesn't do drugs, smoke or drink. I keep trying to tell myself that at least I don't have that to worry about, doesn't really help though

Also get the comments about us lecturing her, or we are being negative (hard to find much positive in just seeing her lying in bed all day, every day)

Interested to know about your DS PDA, and your comment about the more you expect the less you get...

You are definitely not alone xx

I have to word things very carefully ( which is exhausting) because if I ask him to do something he will do it when he's ready. If I ask again he says ' asking me again won't make me do it any sooner. I'll do it in a bit' 😡
Ask again... compete refusal .
It's like if you say something the wrong way he shuts down. So you've to be careful how you say it, and when!!
Loads of other examples but I think when you live with it it almost becomes normal. Exhausting though.

My DD is exactly the same, and gives the same response!

I'd be interested to know how you word things that generally work, DM if easier - I have been reading on the PDA website, but the strategies they give seem to be aimed at younger children. Eg making teeth brushing into a race..

Thanks

Do you ever feel guilty for doing something on your teenager.
On a Monday she has 3 hours of after school activities break in between which she loves the classes. Sing drama and choir.
She hadn't seen her bf on Saturday or Sunday so they where meeting after school to 6 when her class was to start. I text when I got home from work just to make sure she was safe at class she said it cancelled to wed ( total bull) as we always get a message If a class changes. So I told my dh to take scart lead out of TV so she couldn't watch love island and now I'm feeling bad but I know she is lying.
I will tell her in morning so she knows not to lie again. Because it would be a bit wasted off a punishment if she didn't know.
ThoughtS tell her or not

@mcmen05 I guess you have to ask yourself whether it will be a battle worth fighting. In some ways she is punishing herself by missing activities she loves albeit to see her bf. If you think this is a one-off then I would let it go and say nothing but if you think this could be a slippery slope then yes have a word.

Hello, I'm new here and from the States. I have a 15 yo boy. I've had several ( ok many ) major breakdowns over him. Both he and I suffer from depression. He is on medication and so am I. The rope poem made me cry. I realized I'm being more childish than him! I got soo angry at him because we asked him to take pictures while on vacation, or holiday as you guys call it, with the $900 camera WE bought for him and when we got home there were NONE. Not one! When I asked him about it, he said casually, I didn't like any. I lost it. I cried and yelled took to my bed and have been here ever since. He's homeschooled which is a joke because he does nothing. His attitude is of course awful. His father and I are stupid. We are Older parents. I am 56 and this is just taking so much out of me. I don't think my body or Soul can take another major meltdown. And I'm talking about me. I'm the one having meltdowns. He was and sometimes still is Such a sweet and loving boy and we were so close. I never thought this would happen to us... He is my only child. I don't think I'm going to survive these years. I am pretty sickly as it is. I had a terrible childhood myself. I need this support group.

@Rachel561, sympathies. It is difficult to keep sane. I know how you feel, my 15 year old DS has caused both me and my ex extreme strain and torment. Like you we always had a good relationship, recently he has been exceptionally rude, secretive, taking drugs, not telling me when he will be home etc. I have had some CBT which I gave to say has been some help. I also try and get out of the house, go for a walk, do something else. It does help. But it’s not a cure - just small steps to keep us getting through this!

@Rachel561 If you can I would try counselling that might be helpful and talking on here is cathartic too. I find it hard sometimes to express my worries to friends in RL as their children all seem perfect and I just get 'no my dd/s are the complete opposite etc etc'. So when it comes to worries about my teenagers, I often feel quite lonely.

Hello @Rachel561. I’m older too and exhausted. I keep trying to hold up a wall against my son’s downright nastiness but rarely manage it. Life has shrunk to arguments about phone, food, going out. Every day I get told he hates me, over and over. Plus other sundry insults. I wouldn’t mind so much if there was ever any pleasant time but it’s rare. I don’t know how you can homeschool though! Two weeks kills me!

@Fleethart, thank you.
@DontCallMeDarling, I feel alone too and almost too tired to drag myself to counseling. But maybe I should.
@Aramox it's not like he's doing much work. I love doing it if I had a willing participant, but it's like I have to beg him to do anything. Simply exhausting and he's only cheating himself out of a good education. Ugh. If I dare ask him what he's learned today he fires back at me with..." What did you learn today." I feel like screaming and sometimes do. I say it doesn't matter if I never learn a single damn new thing, I've already graduated from High school and had MY career. Ugh. Honestly I'm not gonna make it 3 more years unless things get better. And I haven't even heard the dreaded I hate you words yet.

@Fudgecakes, I know this is old and I hope things are better but I had to laugh when I read what you wrote " So...I was like a screaming banshee....threw everything within reach....it was awful. Now not only am I horrible, I'm also a psychopath hmm. Not my finest hour " I had to laugh because that was JUST ME the other day. I was acting more childish than my 15 yo. Just could not hold it it. Now before anyone gets the wrong idea This boy knows he is loved more than anything else in my world! That's what makes it so hard. We love them so much and they hurt us so terribly. Anyway, once I cleaned things up I apologized for my horrible Behavior.

Does he have to be HEd? Seems like it’s not working for either of you. Mine will comply with school’s structure, mostly.

Sorry to hear of the struggles you lovely people have

My 17 yr old son is just so lazy... hasn't been into college for weeks... always on his Playstation... rude and cheeky... I just despair... so worried about him

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Hello PoTs!

I'm so very sorry to have been absent from the latter half of this thread. There has been a lot going on at home, at work and health-wise.

I hope you are all as ok as it is possible to be in current circs.

I promise to catch up shortly but as this thread is at 998 posts, I thought I would go ahead and set up:

NEW THREAD here.

See you on the other side!

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