Thread three: holding on to the end of the rope, life in the bunker with the PoTs, where parenting a teen is adversely affecting your mental health

[Pegsinarow]

Thread one here.

Thread two here.

With thanks once more to Billybagpuss for inspiration for the title and to Ticklingcheese and many other parents of teens who are emerging from the worst, or currently going through it, this is a support thread for parents who are being driven to despair by their teens. It is a continuation of two previous threads where many of us clubbed together to exchange experiences, possible strategies and understanding of what can be a very draining, isolating and distressing time for all!

Special thanks also to McMen05 who has kept this thread running smoothly and welcomed and responded to many newcomers and returnees this summer

And thanks again to Godmother for our "club" name: the PoTs!

Several helpful things emerged from the previous threads. First, so many of us are experiencing the same challenges or extraordinarily similar behaviour from our teens, in all sorts of different households and circumstances, that it can't all be down to poor parenting, despite what a tiny fraction of posters tried to tell us! So, whilst acknowledging our own mistakes and less than perfect parenting, and trying to find solutions and expert guidance, we also need to try and ditch the guilt and feelings of failure.

Also , it is evident there isn't as much state help available for teens as required, CAMHS for example is very over-stretched and under-resourced.

It was suggested by some posters that distancing ourselves from the very personal remarks and being slightly less "available" can be helpful and Tarragonsauce said that picking our battles, addressing our own symptoms, keeping in mind (with reference to school non-attendance, exam failure, bf issues) that there is more than one way to skin a cat, and remembering that "this too shall pass" can be helpful strategies.

Daintytoes explained an extremely helpful model of parent-child interaction in thread one at 07/04/2019 23:O6 .

Finally, remember that people don't tend to talk about their tortuous times with their teens because of shame, weariness, bewilderment and fear of being misunderstood or judged, but trust me, you are NOT alone! So last but definitely not least, thank you to each and every contributor to the first and second thread. PoTs tend to arrive on the thread feeling quite raw and demoralised but depite their own distress, they help other parents and it's great to be able to share the angst.

Tin hats on everybody for round three!

_

And finally, here is the original letter posted by BillyBagpuss on the first thread:

Dear Parent:

This is the letter that I wish I could write.

This fight we are in right now. I need it. I need this fight. I can’t tell you this because I don’t have the language for it and it wouldn’t make senslee anyway. But I need this fight. Badly. I need to hate you right now and I need you to survive it. I need you to survive my hating you and you hating me. I need this fight even though I hate it too. It doesn’t matter what this fight is even about: curfew, homework, laundry, my messy room, going out, staying in, leaving, not leaving, boyfriend, girlfriend, no friends, bad friends. It doesn’t matter. I need to fight you on it and I need you to fight me back.

I desperately need you to hold the other end of the rope. To hang on tightly while I thrash on the other end—while I find the handholds and footholds in this new world I feel like I am in. I used to know who I was, who you were, who we were. But right now I don’t. Right now I am looking for my edges and I can sometimes only find them when I am pulling on you. When I push everything I used to know to its edge. Then I feel like I exist and for a minute I can breathe. I know you long for the sweeter kid that I was. I know this because I long for that kid too, and some of that longing is what is so painful for me right now.

I need this fight and I need to see that no matter how bad or big my feelings are—they won’t destroy you or me. I need you to love me even at my worst, even when it looks like I don’t love you. I need you to love yourself and me for the both of us right now. I know it sucks to be disliked and labeled the bad guy. I feel the same way on the inside, but I need you to tolerate it and get other grownups to help you. Because I can’t right now. If you want to get all of your grown up friends together and have a ‘surviving-your-teenager-support-group-rage-fest’ that’s fine with me. Or talk about me behind my back--I don’t care. Just don’t give up on me. Don’t give up on this fight. I need it.

This is the fight that will teach me that my shadow is not bigger than my light. This is the fight that will teach me that bad feelings don’t mean the end of a relationship. This is the fight that will teach me how to listen to myself, even when it might disappoint others.

And this particular fight will end. Like any storm, it will blow over. And I will forget and you will forget. And then it will come back. And I will need you to hang on to the rope again. I will need this over and over for years.

I know there is nothing inherently satisfying in this job for you. I know I will likely never thank you for it or even acknowledge your side of it. In fact I will probably criticize you for all this hard work. It will seem like nothing you do will be enough. And yet, I am relying entirely on your ability to stay in this fight. No matter how much I argue. No matter how much I sulk. No matter how silent I get.

Please hang on to the other end of the rope. And know that you are doing the most important job that anyone could possibly be doing for me right now.

Love, Your Teenager

_

Oh and trust me I did a whole ton of shit as a teen. But at least i had the sense not to do it right under my parents noses

Feel like I am going to have a breakdown.
Single mum to DS 16 and DD13. Their dad see's them every 2 or 3 weeks, just comes here for a few hours when he does. Does not help financially and does not have them to stay with him. Nothing I can do about it.
Just moved house and been commuting to work, could be up to 2 hrs each end of the day, so on a bad day am driving for 4hrs. Can barely keep up with the housework let alone do anything nice with the new place, still have boxes everywhere.
Kids do nothing, many arguments, wifi going off, doesn't work.
I'm fed up of coming home after being up since 5am and they are just up in their rooms, not a single thing done. DS has a whole free day during the week and still does nothing, just sits on his computer all day.
I have tried everything nothing works. My daughter just goes around making a mess and then her excuse when she doesn't clean up after herself is 'I forgot' or 'I didn't see it' She likes to 'make' things.
My DS has been in his first job for just over a month now, but he is late every time because he can't prise himself away from his computer long enough in the evening before just to make sure he has everything he needs ready (it all gets chucked in random places). I call up and ask him to sort his stuff out for next day and I just get ok, but no action, if I push it and keep asking I get a tantrum, so I don't really bother anyone, we just have to deal with the stress the next day when he can't find anything.
They chuck their shoes, coats, bags wherever they feel like. They leave rubbish all over the floor, they can't flush a toilet, its goes on and on.

I don't know how much longer I can take it.
I have resorted to just doing the bare minimum myself and just going to bed as soon as I can, usually leaving mess for the next day, and the spiral repeats itself.
I feel like my relationship with them is deteriorating because they don't want to come downstairs becauseI'm 'always moaning'

I don't know what to do anymore, I can't live like this much longer.

@Dorsetcamping, I’m not sure what to suggest. I caught my DD having a swig out of my wine bottle, which she denied, apparently she was just smelling it. Give me strength! So I stopped buying alcohol, I don’t really miss it. Her dad, however, has lots of alcohol in the house, and he gives her a glass when she asks for one. I despair!

I come home roughly an hour after she does, and I run with a club one evening a week, I go to book club once a month etc, there are opportunities for her and pals to get hammered. So I stopped buying it.

@Nelumbo 4 h commute is not feasible, no wonder you are shattered!
Do they have washing baskets in their rooms? Stop doing their washing, it really isn’t that hard to bung a load in and press a button.
DD comes back to all the dishes and cups she left to rot in her room...in her bed. I had to do it twice, She got it the first time, the second time she left them ‘in the area’ where the dishwasher is, so I put them all back in her bed. Now they all go in the dishwasher.
When you are home, turn the WiFi off until one of them hoovered, the other dusted. They take turns, once a week.
Take one of those collapsing baskets, gather all their crap from around the house and empty it in their beds. If it happens the second time, it’s not a basket, it’s a bin liner and straight to the dump. They’ll soon learn.

Mine had a total meltdown and screaming banshee episode this afternoon because she couldn’t find her earphones To go out into town. And wanted to take mine. And I said no. She eventually calmed down. But by the end of it I had to have a lie down.(she has form: gave an iPhone to a friend, her brand new speaker to another, because ‘they don’t have the money’. And I have never let her go without, but she doesn’t quite connect me working my arse off with her having luxuries).

Hello, newcomer here. I’m so glad I found you all! Reading through this thread has made me feel less like I’m losing my mind/failing at life and about 1000% less alone. THANK YOU.

Thanks @SeaSidePebbles
They do have wash bins but we have had years of them chucking clothes on the floor, I have tried refusing to wash anything unless its in the basket, but they honestly don't care, my DD doesn't even change her underwear daily after years of nagging, I really don't know why they are like this. My son has attempted to wash stuff, but then cannot hang it up, he literally just stuffs it on the radiator, which Is quite funny I guess, and yes I have shown him several times.
If I chucked their stuff on their bed, I honestly don't think they would care, my DD has a huge pile of dirty clothes on her bed, and I keep finding food wrappers and crumbs in her bed where she eats on it, even though she shouldn't,

I've been home from work 40mins and they haven't even emerged from their rooms, nothing is done. Even after I spoke to them yesterday and tried to explain how tired I am and struggling a bit, they don't care.
I asked my son to do something for me today as he had a whole day off, has he bothered, course not.
But can I be bothered to start threatening to turn the Wi-Fi off and arguments ensuing?, or do I just want to sit down for a bit with no stress before I have to get up and start again with dinner etc
They are so rude to me and my son especially is very sarky, I don't know how to mend this, I don't want to lose my relationship with them, but I also can sit back while they do f-all!

I know I'm not being harsh enough but I think I'm just exhausted with it all, years and years of the same stuff, they never change, so I have given up, which I know is not good.
I have given up my job as I can't do the commute and look after them and the house on my own, I was hoping to have another job secured by now, but unfortunately I haven't and now I'm getting quite worried as I will be out of work come next week!

DD misbehaved, so I took her phone of her. She then says I want to go to my dad’s this weekend. I go, ok, I text him, he comes and gets her. DD asks for her phone back, I said no, you’re still punished.
He then started banging on the door, I open, he starts demanding the phone and insults me and tries to push past me, it all came back, all the abuse. I managed to push the door and lock it. He then banged on the door and rang the bell and shouted insults for ages. In front of Dd. I keep bursting into tears since yesterday. I know I should have called the police, the reason I didn’t do it was DD, which makes no sense, but I just broke down.

I’m going for a run, to try and decompress a bit. What are we doing to this poor child?

Seaside this is not your fault. His behaviour is abusive and unacceptable. His actions are a parenting choice, to show a total disregard for the well being of the mother of his child never mind the child herself highlights the deplorable individual he is.
My advice would be when he drops her off for it to be somewhere open and neutral. If he refuses( highly likely with control freaks) then don’t get into a texting argument agree to home drop off but have a trusted friend or relative with you. If he starts any nonsense call the police they have a zero tolerance for this sort of behaviour. Stay strong and remember he is choosing to behave in this way, you are not to blame.

Thank you, @Alittewornout.
I forgot he can get physical, last time he did that he stopped in his tracks seeing my 6 foot 10, 15 stone partner in the living room. Now news got to him I’m no longer with my partner, so he seems to think: no man, I’ll take my usual place. God, I forgot, I bet you he’ll send me long emails again asking me to think carefully and if I’m repentant enough, he might come back 😂.
I feel better after a run, I’m blitzing the house listening to carols :)

Oh, sorry, DD is old enough to take herself to his, she’s taller than him, we don’t need to do pick ups/drop offs.

Sorry to read about this Seaside; awful for you and DD. Assuming he behaves himself around her I'd definitely be inclined to let her make her own way to his place.

nelumbo I’d be turning WiFi off EVERY day until rooms reasonable and chores done. Only turn back on when completed. Not completed, no WIFi. Try and live enjoy your life otherwise - though I know it’s easy to feel ground down by it. I hope your time off work gives you a chance to rest and re-appraise.

DD 17 was struggling with A levels both academically and socially. At the end of her first year she got grade U in each of her 3 A levels.

We discussed other options with her, she would not listen, instead throwing accusations at us that we don't believe in her. She was attending a local college to do her A levels, she said she was also struggling with the social side (she has been diagnosed with autism in July this year)

We agreed for her to study at home online, but she has hardly done any work, instead spending the day in bed watching TV. We have tried to talk to her about it, but apparently she has it all under control and by asking her about it makes her feel under pressure and less likely to study.

The January UCAS deadline is fast approaching, she hasn't done her personal statement and has all her assignments under control

I'm leaving her to it in January, she has made it quite clear that she has it under control

She does have the option to continue online study for a second year. We are still paying for phone contract (although very low cost) and an exercise class. When do I stop paying for this, I feel guilty about not paying for the exercise class as originally to help her mental health when she was seeing CAMHS. It's an emotive decision

I can't hold onto the rope any longer. I'm not strong enough.

I found an old style Nokia phone charging in my son's room on Sunday morning. I asked if it was a burner phone and got the usual bullshit excuses like, it's my friend's old phone I borrowed as mine has broken etc (although yesterday apparently it's a phone he bought to use last time his broke but there's no credit on it and he doesn't know the number ).

Added to this, our landlord has decided to sell the house we've lived in for 7 years. My partner is now living during the week in a city he has moved to for work and is thoroughly pissed off with my son's behaviour and attitude over the last few years.

I feel like I have to stay in this area somehow to be near to my elderly father and to totally pathetically and impossibly help or save my son. I know I can't do this. I also know we need space from each other.

He walked out on Sunday and told me not to expect him to return. He did, about 8pm. He said that he was going to stay at his dad's but didn't as it's too far from where he works. I felt awful for him as I know his dad won't have him there. Excuse after excuse, lack of space, disruption to his daughter etc.

I spoke to son after work yesterday and he said he was going to get a council flat for independence. (The words he used were straight from his dad's mouth as per previous conversations with his father).

I was thinking of renting or buying a 2 bed flat in the area and hoping to get my son ready for independent living as I would be having to split my time between here because of my dad and in the city with my partner.

My health isn't great and right now I feel like just disappearing. My son was always a thoughtful, shy and anxious lad who unfortunately experienced bullying from a young age. He eventually started hanging around with known trouble makers and the smoking, weed use and who knows what else began. He would have done anything to fit in and I fear that now he's in too deep with these 'friends'.

Having no support from his gaslighting father is tearing me apart. I lost my mum earlier in the year so my dad is obviously in need of my time and brain power too and I just have nothing left to give.

@poppym12 hugs! Take some time for yourself, come back to the issue after some time out. You’re not on your own, there’s a whole army of mums like you out there, we all battle with this nightmare.

Thank you @SeaSidePebbles. I have nowhere to go or people to share this with for some time out. I'd love to take myself away for a few days but I have to see my dad tomorrow and I can't share anything with him regarding his grandson or our home being sold. My son just seems so down, tired and empty. Like me I suppose. Plus I don't trust him to not mess up his life and lose his job.

So glad, a safe space for us. I've read every post, can't believe the similarities...where has my 'nice' child gone? I've only ever tried to do the right thing.

My son (14) has currently got the police, schools and social services involved after making a fake allegation that his step dad assaulted him, with the intention of going to live with my mum, a place that is free of rules. The warning signs have been many over the weeks, but I ignored them hoping he would return to 'normal'. Now he has everyone where he wants us, his step dad is banned from coming to the house while the investigation is ongoing and I and his siblings are subjected to his non-stop abuse.

He has become completely unrecognisable and won't now do anything I tell him, even though the social services have told him I am his mother and I make the decisions. He is threatening me on a regular basis when I speak to him, telling me I am making him feel unsafe and I should die in hell, he hates me, he doesn't want to live here. No one is helping me, life is a living nightmare right now.

@Happy8714 welcome to the thread
We are all here because off our teenagers.
My dd1 is 16 so I don't normally look at her phone but I got a chance today she had broke screen and wanted it repaired while she was at school so I had a chance to look through and saw one off her friends had wrote a big paragraph to her about not to be committing suicide I told her after school I had read it and she said it was a couple months ago she felt in a low place.
I will constantly worry now when I give out that she will commit suicide.
She said she doesn't need counselling just needs me to let her do what she wants as a teenager.

About to lose my shit. Suspicions rose when DS 14 asked for allowance in cash and I found an old Nokia in his room, sim missing.
Raided his blazer pockets this evening whilst he was in shower and found brand new vaping kit.
I know it could be worse but he's already been caught several times stealing and drinking our alcohol(spirits).

We are now in a polka face stand off. He's realised the kit has gone but daren't ask me. I am acting bright and breezy because I want him to come clean. Going nuclear hasn't worked in the past so just don't know what to do.

He must think I'm so stupid.. I'm convinced it's only a matter of time and funds before he moves onto harder drugs

Hello I need a hug and advice DS almost 16 seems to have turned a corner revising for his mocks, pleasant some of the time and can hold a conversation if he is in the mood to do so.
However DD 14 nearly 15 is absolutely dreadful. She is dyslexic but seems to be doing ok at school and behaving. She has a tiny group of friends she sees at school but they rarely meet up outside of school. However, she absolutely hates me rarely has a civil tongue, is nasty, snappy, shouty, sweaty, angry, bone idle, filthy, lazy, has poor hygiene (often smells) and looks scruffy. If she has a biscuit or a packet of crisps she will chuck the paper down the back of the couch or throw it behind a cupboard rather than put it in the bin. Her bedroom is really filthy. I wash, dry, iron and sort her clothes out and she won’t put them away. They end up either falling on the floor and getting put back in the wash basket or she dumps them in the bottom of her wardrobe alongside dirty knickers/dirty school shirts etc. Please don’t say don’t give her pocket money as she doesn’t get any if she did it would all be spent on giant bars of chocolate. Fortunately she is very tall and is still a size 12-14 but her diet is appalling she won’t eat any meat or any fruit whatsoever and she doesn’t have many vegetables either. I have just came in from work to a pile of mail neither of them had picked up and then verbal abuse because I put the tree lights and living room lights on which she complained were too bright. Things then got much worse she has now stormed off upstairs.
I can’t remember what is was like to be a teenager but I tell her I love her and have always shown an interest in her life and her day (which really isn’t appreciated). Help!

I’ve only really read this thread and having just spent the last five minutes messy crying into my pillow (everyone is out). I realise I’m not alone.

The reason for me being upset is we have taken our dd out of school as she has been so badly bullied for a long time, it’s affecting her mental health.

I know it’s the right thing to do but it’s not helped that there is no school place for her, so I’m doing some homeschooling and with a tutor, until one comes up.

Yesterday she said she felt her old school was better as at least she had one person to talk to and the lessons were okay, but she seems to have forgotten all the tears, the being excluded, the nasty comments and horrific texts telling her no one likes you why don’t you kill your self!

This morning I was going to empty her blazer for cleaning and going through the pockets found all the detritus of school, little notes she made, pens, slips for early lunch because of clubs, bits she kept because they meant something. I just thought how much her whole world has changed and am thinking ‘what have we done?’

Naturally now she’s very angry at everything. Mainly because it’s she who’s left, not the bully, who’s still swanning around school!

I know school let her down and us down, but it’s hard to think we made the decision that has upset her world at the moment. I guess I feel so bad for her.

Paddlinglikehell - we were close to pulling our DD out of school in year 7 but she absolutely refused saying why should she move. She had a dreadful time and I still don’t know whether or not she we should have done this.
I hope things improve for you and your DD it’s not easy being a parent or a child at secondary school in today’s climate. Hugs for you.
I had a long chat with DD and she’s calmer and more cooperative today at least fingers crossed.

School can be such a challenge. I can see a lot of anxiety in my 14 y o’s rage- but I don’t know how to help. He’s often deeply stressed in school but doesn’t want to leave either

Why are kids so mean to each other.
Its causes or kids so much stress and they can't get away from it with all the social media it follows them around 24/7.
We then become their anger outlet.
I moved my dd school and she is alot happier but constantly changing friends groups depending on what boys they are going out with. This stresses me out not knowing who she is with as it can be so dangerous and this causes many arguments with me and her.
I like to know her plans the day before not an hour beforehand and then the changing plans when shes out.
We all need to hand hold through these teenage years. X

@Daddylonglegs1965. It’s a hard call to take a child out, and we are in our third week with no school and I do question if we should have stuck it out, but it’s been going on since this time last year. I think maybe they think it might be better having a hard time where they are, than moving.

Social media has a lot to answer for, I wish I could just take her phone away, it’s toxic seeing what your friends are doing without asking you.

Today she went to town with some friends from her dance club after lesson. I went to pick her up and she said one of them asked her to text when I had arrived as she had to get her bus. Dd thought it was because she saw her as a bit of a baby perhaps, as she’s a year older, I said that’s what good friends do, check they’re okay! She said none of her school friends would have bothered! ☹️