EHCP support thread no. 6

[Needlenardlenoo]

This thread is to support everyone engaged in the EHCP process. The purpose is two fold: so that you don't feel alone if you're involved with it, and so you can easily find posters who are experienced with the various difficulties to help point you in the right direction, whether that be by giving general advice, telling you specifically what action should, or could, be taken in a particular situation, or countering common myths you will hear, such as:

"Your child is not X enough to get an EHCP"
"The school has to do/pay Y first"
"EHCPs are only for Z situation"
"The local authority do X/say Y/won't do Z" (the SEN Code 2014 applies to the whole of England: it doesn't vary by local authority). [Wales and Scotland have different regimes].

It is particularly important at the moment to understand clearly what your child's rights actually are in law (not what the school or LA or Sendias say they are), when the government are actively trying to remove EHCPs and are leaking stories regularly to the media, with the intention, I suspect, of deflecting attention from their own shortcomings onto parents who are already in a difficult situation. If in doubt, the charity IPSEA has neutral and factual information:
https://www.ipsea.org.uk/

Here are links to previous threads:

Original EHCP support thread - www.mumsnet.com/talk/special_educational_needs/4834986-ehcp-support-thread
EHCP support thread no. 2 - www.mumsnet.com/talk/special_educational_needs/4989146-ehcp-support-thread-no-2
EHCP support thread no. 3 - www.mumsnet.com/talk/special_educational_needs/5077140-ehcp-support-thread-no-3
EHCP support thread no. 4 -
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/special_educational_needs/5197351-ehcp-support-thread-no-4
EHCP support thread no. 5 -
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/special_educational_needs/5309128-ehcp-support-thread-no-5?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=app_share [please post on here till it's full]

I agree @handmademitlove - you can't continually fight on every front.

Even the government has had little success getting the NHS to participate in EHCPs...and they fund both sides!

Even if you wouldn’t want to pursue it if they refuse, and that is a perfectly valid decision, if you know what amendments are required and have all the evidence together already, you could request the amendments to C&G (or B&F depending on the needs and health care provision because remember HCP that educates or trains is SEP) and see what, if any, are agreed.

Our SS submitted their AR paperwork to the LA this week. They said they can't meet needs and that, in their view, an EOTAS package would be more appropriate for DS.

I'm now preparing our EOTAS proposal to submit to the LA tomorrow or Monday. I put it in a table w/ references to the professional evidence, as you suggested @KeepItSpinning . It includes all of the recommendations from last month's EP report and some from a psychiatry assessment from last year. I have included rough cost estimates where possible. I haven't tackled the Outcomes or drawn up a sample timetable yet.

The EHCP will need to mostly be rewritten, but is it ok to copy the relevant needs/provision from the existing Plan into the new proposal if they still apply but aren't explicitly mentioned in the latest EP report?

We have researched online providers and have a list of ones DS said he thinks he could engage with. Do I need to list them with each corresponding provision or can I just have a dedicated providers section in section F (linked to where section B says DS requires the flexibility to move between providers, be self-directed, etc) and reference that as needed? (Eg, the EP mapped out three stages of EOTAS: a very low-demand, no live lessons period, followed by two stages of gradually increased engagement as DS is able, but some of the providers could be used in all of the stages. Is repeating them necessary?)

Where we've indicated that online or in-person tutoring might be an option, do we need to list specific tutors we want to use? I haven't managed to narrow it down that precisely! And I also expect the LA will push back with their own recommendations for providers. Could this be fine-tuned at draft stage? Will we get to see a draft before it's finalised?

The main goal is to have all "approved"/"agreed" providers in section F so that we have the flexibility to move between providers as DS is able. (This is recommended in the EP report.) This is so we don't have to ask the LA for permission every time we want to change or add a provider. And the EP recommended we request a PB and an EOTAS co-ordinator to manage it all as flexibly as DS needs.

Is it likely that the LA would agree to put it all in a PB for us/the EOTAS coordinator to manage? There are some defined periods of therapeutic intervention/EF coaching/mentoring that I guess could be paid directly by the LA, but given the flexibility we need with learning resources, I thought it might make more sense for us to manage it through a PB.

Grateful for any guidance and sorry this is so long. Thanks.

The EHCP will need to mostly be rewritten, but is it ok to copy the relevant needs/provision from the existing Plan into the new proposal if they still apply but aren't explicitly mentioned in the latest EP report?

Yes. It makes sense if you think of it as the current EHCP being amended/edited rather than the EHCP being rewritten from scratch.

Where we've indicated that online or in-person tutoring might be an option, do we need to list specific tutors we want to use? I haven't managed to narrow it down that precisely! And I also expect the LA will push back with their own recommendations for providers.

If you know who you would like to use, you can say, but don’t worry if you don’t. It doesn’t matter if you haven’t got all the details at this point. You don’t need to know the exact tutor you will use at this point. Similar for things like knowing their exact availability, which may not even be the same by the time the EHCP is finalised.

Also, while it can be helpful, especially since many have to appeal and it can be helpful in preparation for an appeal too, as I said in my pp, you can’t be forced to do what I suggested in my pp. The LA is responsible. So if it is overwhelming or you can’t do it all, don’t panic.

Could this be fine-tuned at draft stage? Will we get to see a draft before it's finalised?

If the LA propose to amend, and they must do if the school has given notice, they must inform you within 4 weeks of the AR meeting and send you the notice of amendment/amendment notice/draft. They must give you at least 15 days to comment on the proposed amendments.

can I just have a dedicated providers section in section F
The main goal is to have all "approved"/"agreed" providers in section F so that we have the flexibility to move between providers as DS is able.

Providers must not be named in section F. Case law is clear on this. The provision to be provided should be described in F, but providers cannot be named. Providers can be named in J. Flexibility can still be included in F though.

You don’t have to be limited to providers on the LA’s approved providers list/AP catalogue.

Do I need to list them with each corresponding provision…Is repeating them necessary?

You can do it however you want. I personally repeat information. That’s so there is no ‘misunderstandings’ about what provider covers what provision and so information doesn’t get lost when LAs cut and paste when they say they agree to certain things and not others.

Is it likely that the LA would agree to put it all in a PB for us/the EOTAS coordinator to manage? There are some defined periods of therapeutic intervention/EF coaching/mentoring that I guess could be paid directly by the LA, but given the flexibility we need with learning resources, I thought it might make more sense for us to manage it through a PB.

Here I think you mean direct payments? DPs are one way a PB can be paid. You can request DPs and the LA should comply unless they believe you aren’t capable of managing the monies, you would use the funds inappropriately, it would negatively affect other LA services or it is an inefficient use of resources. How likely the LA is to agree to DPs depends on the LA and the provision. Having DPs doesn’t automatically bring greater flexibility. It will depend on what is agreed and what is in the DPA. For example, even with DPs, some people have to get permission to change providers.

Hi, just to update that the LA has conceded my refusal to issue appeal and will issue an EHCP!

Thank you to @KeepItSpinning and everyone else who has given advice on these threads.

They have sent the consent order dated today to the tribunal. What do I need to do now??

Fantastic news @Namechange857 🥳

Thank you @Leafywool 🙂 Hope your draft is progressing and the school search is going okay.

@Namechange857 Hurrah! In terms of the appeal, you don’t need to do anything. You wait for the sealed Consent Order. It is a good idea to start thinking about next steps if you haven’t already. Think about what needs to be included in the EHCP. Do you know what school you would like to be named? Since DD is Y5, you should think about this for the rest of primary and also secondary.

Thank you, @KeepItSpinning 🙂

The private EP and OT reports were very comprehensive, specified and quantified, so I have a good idea what needs/provision should be included. There are other aspects that the EP recommended (eg DCD and APD assessments) that I am parking for now.

I think she should remain at her current primary... Despite the fact that they haven't been particularly brilliant, I think it would be far too traumatic to move her at this point.

Secondary school is an entirely different matter and one I am increasingly worried about. She has such a spiky profile and there are so many nuances to her, I honestly am struggling to see which (if any!) school would be the right fit. We haven't yet spoken or visited any however.

What is the timeline now for drafting and finalising and when would we have to name a secondary school?

@Namechange857 from the date of the consent order, which can take a while to come through, the LA will have 5 weeks to send a draft and 11 weeks to finalise. There are a few limited exceptions e.g. if you are out of the LA for 2 or more weeks and it is impractical for the LA to comply but even when the exceptions apply it isn’t a green light to do as they wish, they must comply as soon as it is practicable.

Thank you @KeepItSpinning

If the EHCP is produced sometime over the summer, will it just need to specify primary school or will it also need to include a secondary school?

I know next year will be the phase transfer year (and reviews in the Autumn term?), does that happen in the same way if the EHCP has only just been or is in the process of being finalised?

@Namechange857 the EHCP finalised this year will just state the primary placement. It may well be September before it is finalised given the time consent orders are taking.

Sorry, I didn’t answer your question about secondary schools.

Normally, there should be a phase transfer review in the autumn term of Y6. Following the meeting, you get the chance to state your preferred placement. Then the EHCP naming the secondary placement must be finalised by 15th Feb 2027. Your LA likes to try to use the Y5 AR, but they shouldn’t and it is something parents can challenge. Because of this the LA may try to get away with not holding a phase transfer review for DD.

Your LA likes parents to complete a form by mid September of Y6. However, you do not have to complete a separate form or give your preferred placement before the point where you receive the amendment notice/notice of amendment/draft following the phase transfer review. If you do, you can change your mind when you get to the point of the amendment notice. You do not have to state multiple options &/or include a mainstream school if your preference is SS either.

Thank you for the information @KeepItSpinning

So you couldn't make it up... This morning, someone else from the LA (from their generic SEND tribunal email address) has sent the evidence bundle to the tribunal. It was the tribunal officer who sent the consent order yesterday to the tribunal conceding the appeal. Just a case of the right hand not talking to the left?! They are ridiculously incompetent.

The tribunal officer said in reply that although they are conceding, they still need to comply with the current tribunal orders (ie to send in the bundle).

She also states that I need to sign and date the consent order that I was copied into and also send to SENDIST.

Is that correct?

Yes, the LA still has to comply for now. Although sometimes they don’t. It won’t happen in your case, but it is technically possible for SENDIST to refuse to sign off on the consent order.

As it had already been sent to SENDIST, I assumed you had already signed and dated the proposed consent order. If you haven’t, you need to do that.

Thank you @KeepItSpinning

Nope, they seem to like missing me out of the loop!

We sent our comments about the draft EHCP back yesterday. Thanks to advice on this thread! I felt so overwhelmed and didn’t even know where to start but I sent DH some screenshots from here and he did a hell if a lot of research alongside it, and spent the whole day yesterday going through it all. He has done a very good job and I feel relieved. There was indeed so much vague wording and odd things such as putting the responsibility on dd to ‘self refer’ to things (big WTF since she’s an autistic 12 year old girl with anxiety disorder). It’s just a load of shit basically and DH has pulled it to bits. I am not sure what the timeline is now to hear anything back but at least we’ve done our part for now.

We have until the 10th to name our preference on school but it’s proving difficult to actually get a response from anywhere. We’ve managed to go and see one school which is in a different town but easily reached by train. They have an RP for autistic children, but they do 80% of classes in mainstream and it’s very academic/high achieving which I think would actually suit DD very much as she is desperate to be stretched academically. She has a friend at her autism group who is in Y9 and goes there and she loves it (dd says she has the ‘same flavour’ of autism as her).

I’ve emailed and called some others but keep getting fobbed off back to sending emails and no one has responded yet. If we have to put the one we viewed down I don’t think it would be a bad thing, but I’d really like to see some others for comparison.

@Leafywool sell done Leafy and DH. (ETA: that sounds patronising, but it was a genuine well done. It can feel relentless and never-ending.) The LA has until week 20 to finalise. Sometimes some LAs will send another draft before finalising but they don’t have to if they don’t make any amendments or the amendments made are a result of your representations (and to add the placement/type of placement). They only have to reissue another draft if they propose to make other amendments.

Some schools won’t enter into conversation &/or allow visits before the LA has sent consults. Even then, some schools don’t until named. Even if schools won’t enter into conversation with you, it is worth emailing any you think may have already been consulted or will be consulted to ensure they have an accurate picture. LA consults are notorious for being incomplete and/or inaccurate.

@Namechange857 pointless SENDIST having the proposed consent order from the LA if you haven’t signed it.

Could someone please recommend a private EP that is good and would produce a report in the EHCP / Tribunal format? I am at my absolute wits end. LA refused to assess. I appealed, Tribunal ruled in my favour. LA appointed EP that didn’t listen to us or school SEN team and only briefly spoke to my child (who masks a lot at school). LA decided not to issue so back to appealing but lack of evidence. Any recommendations of thorough EPs in Kent / London on here or DMs, I would be very grateful. TIA.

You could try: Vivienne Clifford, Valarie Hero, Jemma Levy, Stephanie Satariano, Catherine Pierce, Michael Hymans, and Shirley Moyse. Craig Tribe and Nick Palmer will often travel your way. All will be busy and it can take perseverance. Depending on how quickly you need one, if the above haven’t got availability within the timescale you need, if you shout I will post another list.

KeepItSpinning - endlessly grateful thank you. I will try these. Have you heard of the Chelsea EP clinic? They have availability this month but are eye wateringly dear (parents chipping to help but I want to make sure quality of reports are worth it. LA refused to issue on Friday (after being make to assess by Tribunal) so will lodge appeal next week. My worry is secondary in September. A bit in panic mode. Any guidance would be appreciated x

I wouldn’t use the Chelsea Psychology Clinic for a Tribunal.

If I am going to spend that amount of money, and EP reports for Tribunal are expensive, there are many others I would prefer to use to get a medico-legal report.

If you haven’t even submitted the appeal yet, you will be fine for time.

Have you met with the SENCO at the secondary school DC has been allocated? Is DC having an enhanced transition? If there is a school you feel would better meet DC’s needs but you weren’t offered a place on National Offer Day, did you appeal?

I tried to get in touch with the SENCO at secondary to no avail but will try again. I contacted all the ones on your list by email, will follow up by phone. I already had one initial reply. Enhance transition was mentioned and I was approved at the school we were hoping to get. Thank you about the feedback on the Chelsea Psychology Clinic, one of my questions to them was around the specific EHCP sections in report for tribunal purposes and their reply wasn’t a firm yes, which worried me.

@ThoseBootsAreMadeForWalking if you aren’t getting anywhere with the secondary school’s SENCO, I would contact the HOY if you know who that will be or if you don’t, one of the SLT.

Thank you @KeepItSpinning not patronising at all! He has done a fantastic job. I looked at the timeline from IPSEA and your post and realise I read it wrong, thinking it was 20 weeks from our comments being submitted but it’s actually 20 weeks from me submitting the original EHCNA request? If so that is very soon!!

Just thinking ahead and assuming the worst - do you know if there’s a timeline for the appeals process? I have been looking online but can only find info saying we have 2 months to appeal after the final EHC plan is sent to us. I am sure I read in the past that it’s best to skip mediation and go straight to appeal. I’m assuming it’s one of those ‘it takes as long as it takes’ kind of things.

Thanks for advice re schools. We have ended up naming the one we visited as our preference since we couldn’t get a reply from any others. It potentially could be a good choice for her so we are ok with that, but will see what happens.