Feeling suicidal due to lack of sleep - 8 month old

[PocketRocket12]

Hi all.

I genuinely cannot take any more. My 8 month old wakes hourly, screams unless held and rocked and often is awake for hours on end. He will not co sleep, just screams and rolls around more until I stand.

We have tried various forms of gentle and more firm sleep training techniques out of desperation at 7 months. These improved my little one’s sleep and mood massively for a short while but due to a series of events (teething, illness and then moving in with our in laws), little one is more wakeful and hysterical than ever at night.

He is on three good meals, plenty of milk, is usually happy in the day and has only ever slept in his cot day and night - he doesn’t sleep in the car or pram. We have a good routine and have paid lots of money for sleep consultants etc who helped things improve for a short while. Health visitor also can’t offer any form of advice other than the usual (white noise, dark room, routine, food etc... been doing it all since he was tiny).

We are living with my in laws whilst we build a house (also stressful!) and they are very strongly against sleep training of any sort. I can’t bear the argument and fall out when they are being so kind and generous letting us live here for a while so I spend my nights rocking my son for hours on end so the rest of the house can get some rest.

I can’t see a way that our situation will ever improve whilst we live here (another 9 months here).

I am so emotionally exhausted. My husband has crashed his work vehicle twice due to exhaustion. Feel like an absolute failure of a mother. Every night at the 6th/7th wake up I plan how I might kill myself the following morning to make it all stop and to give my son a better caregiver to attend to his needs.

I can’t engage with him in the day properly as I’m so exhausted. I love him dearly but often feel I’ve made a terrible mistake.

Sorry if this sounds dramatic... I’ve slept 6 hours straight twice in 8 months... I didn’t think it was possible to feel this broken and still going.

@ZazuMoon sorry to hear you’re having such a tough time. I totally symathise, my almost 20 month old DD is similar. The ‘it’s a phase’ and ‘this too shall pass’ isn’t helping much anymore. I don’t think she’s as bad as she was previously, but we never get a run of good nights, just the odd one here & there, which I’m not sure is any better as it gives false hope.
I bought the £45 package from Just Chill Mamma. It’s ok and as it didn’t break the bank I wasn’t too bothered. I think it helped with bedtimes and to an extent the night wakings, but we’ve never been able to crack the split nights, despite lots of advice. I don’t think nursery has helped, if anything probably made her worse. She loves it though & it’s really good for her development. They can’t seem to get her to nap longer than 45 mins, where at home she’d do 3 hours if we let her! Napping has been good for a long time, just Overnight is utter hell.
Hope it gets better for you soon.

@LillyMac500 thanks. We have the same with naps at nursery. 35 mins is the standard. With us will only nap in the moving pushchair though and has never napped in the cot/bed.
Considering a sleep consultant but not sure if it’s going to be one of the many programmes/methods we have tried that have not worked.

@ZazuMoon I am so so sorry for everything you are going through. Sleep deprivation is no joke. I have found that working on putting my little one down awake did increase the amount he slept in the first part of the night before his first wake. It took a lot of patience and consistency and I rubbed his back and didn’t leave him but it did make an impact.

Unfortunately my little one has now started nursery and things are absolutely awful after a few weeks of us getting down to 2 wakes a night (bliss) and peaceful bedtimes.

He used to sleep 3 hours over the day with me but at nursery they are only managing about 1.5 hours at the minute (they are respecting our routine and doing all the can to facilitate sleep at the moment but think it’s all so new to him). He comes home completely exhausted, has been screaming for two hours at bedtime as he’s so overtired and then wakes hourly. Does it get better? I’m hoping he just needs a few weeks to adjust but after a tiny bit of respite my anxiety and depression are through the roof and I honestly don’t know how to manage this all with my return to work x

@PocketRocket12 It’s so bloody hard, isn’t it? Especially as you are managing the transition to nursery and your return to work. Nursery I did find he settled after a couple of weeks. He’s never slept there as much as at home but we try to get him to bed as early as possible on nursery nights as he’s tired out. Maybe bring forward bedtime? Which is rubbish because you’ve not seen him all day, but it might make things easier? Mine definitely did adapt to sleeping a bit more at nursery though if that is of any reassurance. Your DS is still young enough that this could all be a distant memory very soon. I’m starting to worry with my almost 2 year old that this is just how sleep will be.

Thank you @Welikebeingcosy, it’s encouraging to know that. We are still battling on, little one has a cough and cold now so more sleepless nights. I start work tomorrow, feel so overwhelmed about it all. Every time we make headway we take 5 steps back so just resigned myself to life always being this way.
The night wakes are so random, at completely different times, at completely different frequencies and I’ve been told to not sleep train when son is poorly or going through change (ie starting nursery)… when are they ever not either of those two things??

My son is 10 months now and friends and family have started asking my partner out to do things - dinners, a few drinks, bbqs etc. I’m literally running out of ways to so “no we can’t as my baby doesn’t sleep so I have to be home to do bedtime and the night wakes”. I worry whether there will ever be a time when me and DH can socialise again, where I can see friends and have a semblance of normal life as well as being a mum? He’s only 10 months but my friends seem to think it’s bonkers that I won’t / can’t leave him at night time. We also have a close friend’s wedding coming up in September that I already want to say we can’t attend as I just cannot face my in laws or my parents having to cope with a sleepless night and my son crying because his mum and dad aren’t there in the night.

I’m sorry to moan. I’m truly sick of my own voice moaning but I just feel so “not like other mums”, completely consumed by work and then sleep / lack of sleep with not even a second to myself or to spend with my partner.

What are your thoughts?

Moan away- it’s so important to vent. I remember those feelings well. I honestly thought I was going to go mad (and probably did in some ways!)

I know there will have been a hundred different suggestions thrown your way, and I may have forgotten previous posts, but have you heard of Lucy Wolfe? It was the only system that made any improvement to my LOs sleep. I did let it unravel a bit when he got ill but I remember feeling like we’d made a tiny bit of progress. She has lots of useful resources on her Instagram.

I feel for you so much, in future I’m determined to help new mums who are struggling with sleep because I remember how poorly it had/ has made me. For now, just get through the first few days at work. Gently does it. Don’t put any extra pressure on yourself

@PocketRocket12 I did, and still do, feel the same as you when it comes to leaving my poor sleeper with someone else. She has had one night at my in-laws and she’s 20 months almost. I’ve actually had the pandemic as a pretty good excuse not to have her stay elsewhere, but she’s had a lot of daytimes at my in laws. Sometimes she’s fine and will nap well, other times she’s not happy, but I know they will do their best to pacify her, whether that’s with dummy in the day, cartoons, or without my knowledge/agreement, chocolate 🤦‍♀️
The night they did have her she was fine. And they say to me what I used to say to my brother when I offered to take my nephew- it’s one sleepless night for your babysitter, they can catch up the next day.
We’re still not in a great position and have a meeting with a sleep consultant on Wednesday 😭 xx

Thank you @thebearandthemare - can you come and live with me?!! I truly believe lack of sleep is the route cause / trigger of my depression, anxiety. It honestly feels like a trauma, I just can't explain it. Sleep training improves things and then the tiniest change / illness / new food throws everything off course dramatically - it is just an exhausting merry-go-round.

Am at work today. Feels strange being here but the start of a new chapter for me and my son. I slept for 40 minutes between the hours of midnight and morning last night so feel like I am partaking in some sort of extreme sport but I am here and I am functioning...

Hello everyone. I am not sure if anyone is still on this thread but thought I would reach out incase anyone is reading in a similar position and would like to know progress.

Little one has started randomly sleeping 3/4 hour stretches again. Wake ups average at 2/3 a night which is acutely more bearable than life before. Day naps were by the clock. My anxiety around sleep goes up and down but isn't as suffocating as it once was.

My MIL has my son on a Monday. He usually wakes sometimes between 5-6 which means he needs a nap around 9/9.30 and 2 to get a reasonably bedtime (he thrives on this routine with me). She will not put him down any earlier than 10, usually 10.30 which means he then gets tired around 3.30, has an awkward late cat nap until 4 and then will not go to bed anytime before 8pm. If he goes to bed later he does not wake up any later so he's accumulating a big of a sleep debt and I'm also exhausted by that time too!

What do I do? Let it go? Bring it up? Just have a later bedtime on this day? I've said this to her a few times but she doesn't seem to listen! At nursery his naps start somewhere between 9-10 and somewhere between 1.30-2.30 and he's always ready for bed by 7ish.

I would say to her, or get your partner to. It’s not her that has to deal with the later bedtime or night wakes - my MIL was similar so I got my husband to really drill it in about routine. Maybe ask why she’s waiting so long to put your little one down so late?
I feel your pain, glad to hear things are improving with the night wakes xx

Good to hear that there has been a tiny improvement in the number of night wakings. I understand what you mean about the way you feel shifting depending on the tiniest changes in sleep. I have a clear bright line of just not being able to deal with a 5am start AND a 10pm bed time and night wakes. It just sends me over the edge. I can remember if you are doing shifts with your DH? We do that when it is really bad so we each get a block of sleep.
As for the routine.. I think you need to be clear on the routine and if it isn’t complied with then your DS will go to nursery. If you have found something that works for you both, you don’t want anyone messing with that. Good luck!

Hello! Happy new year. Not sure if anyone is still out there. I’m still hanging in there. Things are pretty painful at the moment and I guess new year always brings things into sharp focus.

Little ones sleep improved a little, was managable, my mental health was under control, house build is almost complete, sort or repairing marriage. Then for the last month my 16 month old son has been going to bed at 8, waking at 10 and staying awake until 4. Every single night. Seriously. Two hours sleep a night is sending me down the darkest of rabbit holes, husband and I are barely speaking as we are so low and I can’t seem to find any answers as to why it’s happening.

If anyone can offer any words of wisdom or encouragement right now I would really appreciate it. I’m in tears most evenings thinking about how I’ve ruined my life by becoming a mum and then feel wracked with guilt about that thought.

Hi @PocketRocket12 no words of wisdom but this seems to be a common issue on mumsnet for children that age. My ds is younger so we haven't had this yet but we've had many sleep issues so I've read threads about older children so I'm prepared . I also know some people in real life who have been battling split nights too and there seems no rhyme or reason to it. Sounds so tough but I doubt there is anything your doing wrong as it seems so common. Sorry I'm not being very helpful but I just wanted to reassure you.

Basically I'm sure you're doing a really good job.

Thank you @LGBirmingham, it means a lot to know we are not alone! He can’t even stay awake for that long in the day so I’m baffled as to how he can at night. It’s utterly gruelling!

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/sleep/4324992-split-nights-anyone-solved-this-pure-hell

I've read through a bit of the above thread but not all. Maybe someone in there has cracked it? I know of two babies who have done this in real life. One of them stopped after being treated for a double ear infection and learimg to walk at 16 months. The other, I'm not sure they've cracked it yet as I'venot seen them in a bit, but they were shifting her routine a little earlier so they could all get back to sleep for a bit when she's finally ready to go back down.

You're definitely not alone. I'm also dreading this happening to us at some point as it seems quite common.

Thank you @LGBirmingham. That thread used to be our life and I had come to terms with it, my son would sleep 4 hours ish, wake for two hours (to the minute!) and then go back to sleep for 5 hours. It was horrible but we just got on with it. Now he’s sleeping for about 2 hours, being awake for 5-6 hours, then sleeping another 2 hours. It’s absolutely brutal and unsustainable as I work full time and I just don’t know how or why. Thank you for reaching out and I hope your little one doesn’t do thus, positive thoughts!

Oh sorry, I didn't realise you were already on this thread! It does sound like it's got a lot worse for you at night. I really hope it improves for you soon. He surely can't start being awake for longer than 6 hrs at night can he!? The only way is up

Is he sleeping in the daytime?

He used to reliably nap 2/2.5 hours in his cot no problem @Abbsie but the last few days he hasn’t even been napping longer than 20 minutes. So he’s getting 5/6 hours sleep in a 24 hour period.

He’s had a bout of illness, chest infection followed by a cold, so I don’t know if he is still feeling some discomfort from that / a bit bunged up. Have tried EVERYTHING. If it is that, then it will naturally pass in a few days hopefully but if not…. Who knows.