Narcissitic Personality Disorder (Part 2)

[Gettingagrip]

Starting another thread for us survivors.

Hi TooMany, the 'silent streak' has been broken I'm afraid. Despite being sent a "This is my last e mail to you" last week or so I received one today.
He asked if he could pick dd up tomorrow for an hour and added, in brackets, that the boys could come too, if they wanted....

I expect to start receiving his analysis of my behaviour and life via letter/email/carrier pidgeon soon..

Bessie glad you found this thread a help. You know that there is very little you can do to stop your Uncles behaviour except to ignore him. No replying to his e mails, no responding to his accusations, no defending your Mum to him. Just ignore - with the odd neutral comment thrown in to get him off your Mums back ("Yes, whatever you say. I'll think about that...")

I was also thinking about the taking of photographs that you mentioned Saddest. Most of the photos taken of me by my ex were posed ones. He had a flashy camera and would spend hours setting up/putting me into a pose etc. Totally objectified me. There are very few 'natural' photos taken of me with the dc etc.

Another thing re photos; ex h would try on every article of clothing to create a satisfactory 'look'. Every jacket would come out (and he would have several) and he would try it on, then get me to take a picture of him on his mobile phone. It wasn't enough to just look in the mirror - he had to have a photo of himself in each outfit to see how he looked.
What do you think that was all about?

Human peacock? I'd be tempted to say effeminate also, but I don't even know many women who would do that unless they were shopping for some specific occasion. Maybe poorly integrated feminine and masculine sides of his personality? There's a large element of focusing on outward appearance of course.

The focus on photos and even chalk pictures shows how much the surface elements matter to them.

I think that that is right Math.

It's the lack of healthy integration of the feminine that seems to be the problem.

Maybe that's why they often come across as gay?

That's why they objectify the women in their lives? maybe,the women become a vessel to carry those feminine aspects of themselves, for them and woe betide if you get THEIR femaleness wrong. Which any human being inevitably will, because you cannot invade another's consciouness. That's why they tell you how ypou feel What you are thinking, what you will do. They believe they ARE you.

So the posing of you TRM was him posing his femaleness via you if you like.

I'm not explaining this very well

A screwed up version of being in touch with their femminine side?
This is interesting.
My ex has always claimed to be Mr. Sensitive-in-touch-with-my-femminine-side. But then I read Lundy Bancroft's description of the abuser/Mr. Sensitive and bingo - my ex. In other words, I believe his picture of the perfect residentual care worker (his job) required him to be Mr Sensitive and so that is what he role plays.

The posing for photos....of course, you know that a lot of these photos were 'artistic' in nature. Maybe that was it - he was using me to pose provocatively but really putting his own sexuality out there?
He is obsessed with his own personal grooming. He is meticulous about the way he dresses. He is obsessed about his weight. I could be describing a woman and it would all fit.
He prided himself in being able to pick items of clothing out for me. Always sexy revealing items, but he did it a lot! And yet, he was fiercely hetrosexual. His femminine outlet was through me huh?

My h is obsessed with his weight. I believe he may be bulimic.

He has more clothes than any man I have ever known....certainly more than I have, and yet he only wears trackybums and cheap t shirts.

H always criticised me , at first, when I still existed, if I ever wore anything provocative. I used to complain that he saw me as Ann widdecombe or something. Whereas my first h always encouraged the whore look. Both fucking weird. But again that is typical screwed up bloke...the virgin/mother and the whore. Because they are not fully integrated as whole human beings.

That virgin/ whore thing IS objectification...there is no room for a real human being in there is there?

Sorry.....proocative is...no was..... his word not mine.

I mean, when I wore something with a touch of cleavage, or hold ups instead of tights....like anyone would even know!

my xn wasn't as extreme as your examples but he wouldn't go over 12 stone as that was 'fat' and he was 6'. He bought clothes from Ted Baker, Paul Smith. (New Look for me). I was terrified to take a photo of him because although he did used to command me to take photos of him, he would criticise my 'composition' or that I'd chopped the top of his head off, or his feet off. It makes me laugh now to remember it. Sardonically, if that is the right word.

Thank God though (reading your posts) my xn didn't really care if I was 8 stone or 9 stone or wore make up or dressed up or down. I think he barely noticed.

I haven't posted for a while... been reading every post several times over and either nodding in agreement/crying or worrying once again about my behaviour.....
I'm the one who does not speak now... I haven't for a while now...when I say I don't speak, I don't engage in ANY in depth conversation with the H. If I do it ends up in an argument or I am so wound up or incensed by his lack of empathy, that I have to walk away... if I had a £ for every time I asked him to "please leave me alone...."....
The whole photo thing.... for years it was always me who took photo's... hardly ever any of me on family days out, always him and the kids or just the kids... I always thought this was wierd... Even on our honeymoon, hardly any pictures of me and those that were taken are either silly, awful or 'badly' taken... I was so upset. I also remembered that he kept 'lying' down' and 'sleeping' so that he did not have to spend much time talking to me... we never even had sex on honeymoon. This was 6 years ago..... 6 wasted years...
I actually 'threw up' and had major panic attacks on the 4th day/night of the h.moon as I realised what I had done..... married him knowing that it was wrong...
He still does that 'sleeping' and 'lying down' thing and has even done this in social occasions when he did not want to interact with people..... the excuse always being.." I'm tired... what's wrong with that?"

I am now starting to feel angry just writing things down about him.. he told me yesterday that "he had done some investigating and would not be moving out of the family home just in case things went 'wrong' he would not be in a very strong position."
So it's all about him once again... not the wellbeing of the children....
He'll be home soon, pretending everything is OK, calling me by a nickname and asking me lots of totally unconnected questions which i do not want to answer as it means interacting with him... most of this will be within earshot of the kids, so he looks like the chatty nice one and I'm the moody, nasty one...
Great.

My weight increases post birth never affected mt ex's need to 'off load' himself, ie, have sex, but once I started losing weight he became animated in the discussing of 'our' weight loss.
He lives on a diet of noodles and toast. Literally. Every time I saw him post split (and before the "I'll never e mail/set foot in your house again" row) he would report his current weight to me as a statement.
But his obsessiveness about his weight is typical about most of him. It is control to the extreme.

My ex also has more clothes then I could ever dream about. His favourite is Hugo Boss. I was bought the Boss perfume for women....the same perfume twice, infact. His clothes occupied 2 waldrobes and several suitcases when he lived here. He would order an article 'on line', say a t shirt for €100, try it on, reject it, and throw it in the bin. At the time I was living and feeding me, 3 dc (and him, albeit noodles) on lone parent benefit! Sense of entitlement me thinks?

Urgh, yes fluxy the 'sleeping' and 'lying down' thing. Snap.

It is good that you are starting to feel angry - good that you can reconnect with your feelings. Your anger at your h is what most women would feel given a description of the life you lead but what you have probably numbed yourself against.

You are predicting his behaviour and the reasons behind it. You know what is going on now. It's hard to fall back into the same old relationship pattern when you 'know' what is really going on. You are on your way to making changes, I hope xx

Really, is the sleeping/lying down/zoning out thing common with your Ns? I put it down to Asperger's.

fluxy, I think we were on the same honeymoon ...

OMG I have been reading this thread all evening.You are describing my p,mother,father,sil and ex h.Partner is currently off waiting for me to apologise for how much I have hurt him - by not being an effective mother to my 4 children (exes,not his) and to acknowledge PROFUSELY how lucky I am that an alpha male like him,so -perfect that woman he passes in the street regularly spontaneously proposition him- would deign to spend time with a " twice rejected single mother of 4 with two c for ex h's,when everyone advises get the hellout - and hey,I actually feel affection towards them"
He does EVERYTHING when here - "let me help you,I understand how hard it is for you to trust me after what those bastards did,but let me take the pressure off you,the kids make so much work...etc" but this to the point of total control over evrything everty element of the day,house,kids lives,visitors everything - BUT to raise this with him in a calm reasonable way is to "throw everything back in his face and reject help - because of how selfish [I] am"
I am lonely,alienated by the splitting and dividing.
I am facing an industrial tribunal and cd lose my job - mortgage ,house etc
I too recognise traits of myself in his behaviour - does this explain the powerful soulmate connection that pulls me back every time?
I do have 2 difficult exes one of whom was a passive aggressive bastard.I have 2 children from each, BUT
God help me I am 34 weeks pregnant with this mans child.
He has 2 children aged 28 and 30 from his marriage of 23 years,the divorce from which still enrages him.However his ex wife would no doubt identify with this thread as what he says about her wd fit - in reverse - with many xperiences recounted by women here.
Of course ,he keeps me well away from any of his friends and family.My lot are bonkers NPD 's.He was horrendously abused as a child abandoned ,fostered and abused again.
I am a mental health professional.
What would you do,please,if you were in my situation? Thank you so much for your honesty and sharing on this thread.

my children adore him and dance around trying to stay in his approval.He divides them through switching his favorite constantly.They and I have enormously enjoyed "family " stuff that we have never had before on days out,holidays,nights in when he is the worlds most fun,loving,focussed co-parent -"I'll never be your Dads ,guys,I dont want to undermine that role for them, but I'm always here for you - and your Mum is the best mother you'll ever have ..etc"
Then - on a breath of wind,for no discernible reason he'll become silent,dark eyed,then explode,shouting that we/they are "pushing his buttons" that the tone of voice used by my daughter or the look in her eyes ,is rude ,cheeky and disrespectful and another example of my failure to be an adequate mother -"everything they have achieved ,anything positive"is down to his input and him saving us all from the "state " we were in when he met me.
How dare I throw it all back on him by failing to control my awful children.How can he ever get any quality time with me when I overindulge and fawn over them?
I have ruined them with my love and deprive him of basic attention despite his total devotion and sacrificing everything to such hopeless cases - and "i ACTUALLY LOVE YOU ALL TO BITS - i ADORE YOU AND YOUR BASTATRD KIDS"

My head is fucked.
I used to work full time as a Senior Manager
I always coped with - no embraced - life as a single mother of 4.
I was proud of leaving a hopeless marriage with a passive aggressive bastard who took all my money and still causes problems.
I thought I had met my soulmate, a man so far the opposite of my ex - loving ,attentive,expressive,dynamic,exciting,capable,strong and popular with everyone....
He'll never let the baby go
He bears grudges forever
I still love him - what the fuck is that about - he's a controlling egoistical bastard.
If he lets himself back into the house and gets into bed tonight ,I'll be grateful to believe whatever rationalisation he can offer whilst inside my head fearing the next time it happens - I know it will.Am I crazy?

Hi there, it is so enlightening to read that other people have been with my ex!! I never thought that I would say that as a now normal and almost completely functional human being having left him over two years ago but still bear a few after-effects.

Most if not all of the thread I can relate to, the only one I can't relate to is the 'staying quiet and looking fearful of me'. If he ever cared about my feelings it was shown with a sickening display of fake crying in the very early weeks of our budding toxic relationship. This fake crying would emerge at times he had let his real self show and when he thought I was on the brink of dumping him for his frankly weird behaviour- then the fake tears would flow. At the time I was naive and although I thought it was fake I also thought 'fairplay, the guy must really care if he's prepared to put on such a show'... how silly was I?? .

I went on to have two children with him, one was planned and one was accidental after one evening he was actually nice to me.It was on my birthday and I had begged him to not be argumentative and controlling (that same night of rare control he displayed, I came round very drunk to what can only be described in the nicest of terms as 'anal penetration without prior consent' as I was drunk on my birthday he thought he would give himself a reward for his self control...hmm

The fake crying had stopped with almost spooky accuracy after I had become pregnant with my first child. The flood gates opened and the utter arse was there to stay. There are so many stories of the slow degradation of self at his hands. Alot of which are very similar to all of yours. I only hope these stories will help other people stuck in the same situation to realise it will never change and only serve to run you down. Which is what it is designed to do. two years later life is a much better prospect without that crap to deal with. I just feel very sorry for his latest victim (as you guys so accurately describe those poor women who have to deal with it now.) Thanks to you all for allowing me to see the final shards of broken mirror come together even two years later to show an accurate reflection of ourselves. although the cracks can still be seen, it no longer feels broken once you realise they slot together and why it was broken in the first place.

'I am now starting to feel angry just writing things down about him.. he told me yesterday that "he had done some investigating and would not be moving out of the family home just in case things went 'wrong' he would not be in a very strong position."
So it's all about him once again... not the wellbeing of the children....
He'll be home soon, pretending everything is OK, calling me by a nickname and asking me lots of totally unconnected questions which i do not want to answer as it means interacting with him... most of this will be within earshot of the kids, so he looks like the chatty nice one and I'm the moody, nasty one...
Great.'

fluxy Please just plan your get out, there is help available. I did it and I lived in another country. It will not change, if you feel like I felt you either wish you could just chuck yourself out of a fast moving vehicle or hope he dies before you do. He doesn't want to lose you. All of his antics are designed to make you stay and be afraid of the world. Your kids Know now you are unhappy and this unhappines will only affect them more, and ruin your own life at the same time. Even the excitement of getting free is better than the numbness and total shiteness of living with that! I totally relate to the 'photo' row. It is like you are a by-product of the main feature that is him and his off-spring. Only the fact is offspring take a low fitting on his list too, this is because the top ten on his list -are him. You AND the kids are just extra's in his top ten achievements you won't get a mention even as supporting act!! Please honey, I can really relate to how you are feeling now .

My god this is me, I could have written this pinemartina your below quote

'my children adore him and dance around trying to stay in his approval.He divides them through switching his favorite constantly.They and I have enormously enjoyed "family " stuff that we have never had before on days out,holidays,nights in when he is the worlds most fun,loving,focussed co-parent -"I'll never be your Dads ,guys,I dont want to undermine that role for them, but I'm always here for you - and your Mum is the best mother you'll ever have ..etc"
Then - on a breath of wind,for no discernible reason he'll become silent,dark eyed,then explode,shouting that we/they are "pushing his buttons" that the tone of voice used by my daughter or the look in her eyes ,is rude ,cheeky and disrespectful and another example of my failure to be an adequate mother -"everything they have achieved ,anything positive"is down to his input and him saving us all from the "state " we were in when he met me.
How dare I throw it all back on him by failing to control my awful children.How can he ever get any quality time with me when I overindulge and fawn over them?
I have ruined them with my love and deprive him of basic attention despite his total devotion and sacrificing everything to such hopeless cases - and "i ACTUALLY LOVE YOU ALL TO BITS - i ADORE YOU AND YOUR BASTATRD KIDS"

My head is fucked.
I used to work full time as a Senior Manager
I always coped with - no embraced - life as a single mother of 4.
I was proud of leaving a hopeless marriage with a passive aggressive bastard who took all my money and still causes problems.
I thought I had met my soulmate, a man so far the opposite of my ex - loving ,attentive,expressive,dynamic,exciting,capable,strong and popular with everyone....
He'll never let the baby go
He bears grudges forever
I still love him - what the fuck is that about - he's a controlling egoistical bastard.
If he lets himself back into the house and gets into bed tonight ,I'll be grateful to believe whatever rationalisation he can offer whilst inside my head fearing the next time it happens - I know it will.Am I crazy?' end quote

Hell no , not crazy . A result from ourselves. Some form of insecurity that resulted in us getting with these more damaged a-holes that we thought at the time were stronger than us, better than us, exciting in someway or as someone that could help to make us complete. They seem to be good at that part. The getting. It's like a radar that picks up a signal that spells out for them 'slightly insecure, yet room for improvement for a knob like me' on our foreheads. I don't actually think they know it at the time, what they are doing but it comes across in such a calculated way you can only think as such. scary.

Pinemartina, you said: "I recognise traits of myself in his behaviour - does this explain the powerful soulmate connection that pulls me back every time?"

No, my love. It's what midnightoil wrote: "Some form of insecurity that resulted in us getting with these more damaged a-holes ... It's like a radar that picks up a signal that spells out for them 'slightly insecure, yet room for improvement for a knob like me'"

It's not a soulmate connection, I'm afraid. It's him manipulating your weakness

• sorry, not to imply you're unusually 'weak' or anything ... Should have said something like 'vulnerabilities'.

He feels like your soul mate because he is reflecting you back at yourself.

They are empty vessels. The fun person the ace parent, the focussed person....is you!

My h took over absolutely EVERYTHING too. To the point where I just gave up. "People" said I was so lucky to have such a hard working h, but it left me with nothing....I rebelled once and painted one wall in our bedroom something other than fucking madgnolia....HA HA HA!!!!!!

There always seem to be loads of these "mythical people" making judgements on your relationship...and you. These "people" have told my h that he'll be better off without me, and that I will be suicidal if he leaves, well to all you mythical people......

I'M STILL HERE!

Sleeping and lying down My twat fell asleep at my brothers wedding reception, sat there in the corner and was directly behind everyone when the speeches were going on so everyone saw. That's not the only time. I thought he was just stoned. He's also nodded off on the motorway a few times. I make excuses for him to leave the dogs behind now rather than take them out with him in the car. Just in case. Is that evil?

It'sGraceAgain, I was a mess when my xn met me, still not over the break-down of previous relationship (which was perfect while it was going on but the guy just dumped me suddenly no warning and with a character assassination to make himself feel justified.)

No man in his right mind would have touched me with a barge pole, I was on anti-depressants and couldn't get through a whole day without crying.. What I was trying to hide, my vulnerability, let him know he could control me. That's what attracted him.

"He was driving but couldn't remember the way to the place we were going. Neither of the friends could remember the way. However, I could remember the way and said where to go. He ignored me - not aggressively, he was a very placid chap. We got lost. In the end he found the place, exactly where I had said it was.

The realisation that he thought so little of me that he saw any suggestion of mine as obviously and utterly worthless, even if he had no idea of his own in opposition to it, was a revelation."

This was posted by 'balloon slayer" on another thread about realising it was over... this made me laugh out loud, as for years this was my experience too.
He, of course, would deny this but has on many occasions had me 'screaming' in the car with frustration....

Push those buttons / wind her up ... then sit back and watch her go.... oh and just for good measure laugh or smirk about it... then when she is crying with utter despair ask her what the problem is..... lovely.

Maggie00 'What I was trying to hide, my vulnerability, let him know he could control me. That's what attracted him.'-totally agree.

When I think back now all I can see is that I was a young, naive, insecure girl who was a prime target for an n. Just moved to another country to work, with the perfect ingredients- a mixture of lack of self esteem and fear for the future. That is what they pick up on, a malleable victim. Once you get the strength to leave them and realise this, it leaves you with an accurate radar yourself for n's. That is the beauty of it, you learn the strengths you need to make a relationship work with nice partner.

I came out much wiser and much more aware about how my own thoughts about myself shine like a neon light above my head for all to see. Best to make damn sure that light is saying 'I am strong and independant. If you want to be with me then come along on my journey if you match up to my standards'. It will take a while for anyone to get there after an n. But it will happen. Just wait for the light flicker on after spending some time getting to know yourself again free of toxic judgements.

pinemartina do not put his name on the birth certificate and plan Now to get out.

You sound on the brink of a nervous breakdown. You know you cannot stay with this man.

Stick with us on here. But do not let him screw with another child's life.

Your baby, your decision. If his name is not on the certificate and you are not married, I think this makes a difference to his position legally. You are not married to him thank god.