I think I have to leave my husband

[PlaidJane]

I have had a nice little life the past few years with my DH, we get on well he’s a nice guy generally and we have an enjoyable time together. He’s quite insecure in his looks and not overly confident so I do feel I fall into the pattern of being a bit motherly, you know giving him reassurance. He says a lot of the time that I’m out of his league. This isn’t wildly attractive I’m sure some people would agree and I can find it annoying as I am not that shallow, I want someone who makes me feel loved and is nice that’s all.

I’d say the issue in our relationship up until now is that I feel like I am putting on a perfect persona all the time as he finds it hard to cope with me in any other raw format version. He gets defensive and upset if I have any Big Feelings - even if they aren’t related to him at all. Therefore I don’t share many big or small feelings with him. Hence the plodding along.

Over time I recognise I feel friendly affection for him with our lives tied together in a house and joint assets etc and I wasn’t going to disrupt anything.

I am a people pleaser and I find it so hard to let people down or put myself first.

I have been working on a short term project with another man for some months now which has ended. During this time we got along great, but I didn’t think anything much of it as I knew the project would end and mostly thought just this guy is a nice guy.

I don’t think we spoke emotionally or overshared our personal lives more than normal colleagues, we worked well as a team and had good fun in the process. As the project came to an end and we said goodbye, we both simultaneously appeared to realise we had formed some kind of feelings for each other.

I assume this is what happens to movie stars on film sets or strictly shows, when you spend a lot of time with someone in close proximity. So I’m not sure it’s real at all. I got worried I was in limerance so was working on detachment

We have had one honest in person conversation about this where we shared exactly identical experiences and thoughts about each other - it’s so weird and uncanny. I feel like we just wanted to check we were not going mad and deluded in our own minds? These moments in our minds were totally identical realisations or memories, matched each other in sync. This has never happened to me before. We both admitted we had grown attracted to each other physically but more than that, we liked each others personalities and couldn’t stop thinking about the other. It’s affecting both our sleep and appetites. We have agreed we need to detach because it’s very dangerous

Running off together is ridiculous, this isn’t some big romantic movie, also this is an awful thing to do to my husband. I’d rather be single right now and have none of this hassle I just want to run away from everything and everyone

I think I’m having a midlife crisis of some kind and I have to leave my DH but I don’t know where to even begin to detangle our complex finances. We don’t have any savings and a huge mortgage and the market is terrible right now for selling. I also feel sick at the thought of telling him I’m not romantically in love with him as it would break his heart.

Good, you're realising this is not for you
And honestly it's not, it sounds like a shit way to live. And to top it off you say he gets angry and shouts. Wtf!?!

How easy is it to leave him cos you absolutely must.

Thanks.

I attempted to discuss the situation with him again as he was calmer. He did not like this at all as he said I was just repeating everything I already said and it was unnecessary. He invalidated my reasoning that I didn’t feel heard the first time, as he was being so angry and shouting at me which wasn’t a functional conversation plus also, everything is not resolved.

This time around he had done some deeper thinking and went in for the weak spot I have of my vulnerabilities - the broken relationship I have with my family. He is the golden child of his, and I’m the black sheep, and it felt like he was lording this over me somewhat, sitting up there on his high horse telling me I’m a product of a dysfunctional family bringing dysfunction to his life which is making him angry.

He acknowledged that he is going to address his anger but doesn’t want to talk about his plans for that with me. I said that he was projecting insecurities onto me and he should look at that too

Its left that we are being civil but I am withdrawn and told him I will remain there because I do not feel safe emotionally to let my guard down

Oh wow OP he's so manipulative!!!

Honestly, how can you stand him?!

Gosh - I’ve read to the end and in summary - he’s a massive twat!

You will never be enough for him regardless of what you do, how you look or how accommodating you are of his twatish behaviour.

It must be like living with a self centred toddler!
No house is worth staying in for that amount of manipulative nonsense!

Big girl pants time 💪

Wow! That is a very significant update, OP! An outsider can see that he has weaponized your childhood and your family estrangement to control you and sees demeaning you as his best strategy to keep you close. Once you see it you can’t unsee it. Try to expand your sicial life and get to a minimum safe distance. Don’t fall fir fake attempts to see your side/get anger management/improve communication. Its all bullshit. He will say whatever to tie you down but he is an awful human being and that will never change.

Of course you are the black.sheep. its how men ljke this get their hooks in.

I am in the exact same position and I think I was married to a vulnerable narcissist having read this thread. He played the victim all the time and controlled me with his moods and sulking. I ended up being pretty much a Stepford wife because I wanted the kids to grow up in a home without arguing and we really couldn't speak to each other by the end without an argument so I just didn't speak.

Two years post divorce I am thriving. About 18 months ago I met the most adorable bloke he is wonderful and I can completely be myself with him without any pretenses whatsoever I can say anything I like doing without thinking that he's gonna get jealous or sulky. It really is wonderfully liberating.

Oh it gets worse. He’s initiating conversations with me then getting really mad and saying I’m bringing it up.

He cannot seem to understand why I do not want to just go back to acting like everything is normal.

He says I’m working on himself, what more can I possibly want? Apparently all I do is dump things on him all the time and he is carrying the burden of all of everyone else’s problems all the time, no one understands what this is like for him, they just keep piling it on.

He demanded I explain everything and got a pen and paper out to make notes, then just shouted at me whenever I brought up any issue.

I explained what having boundaries looked like, and guiding people into finding their own solutions i.e. being open and supportive but not taking on all the role of fixer because it’s leading to resentment. I’m not asking him to fix things or take it from me

He said this approach is a waste of energy, people should either just fix it with a solution or stop bringing it up.

I asked if he had spent any time considering that perhaps Father’s Day is a difficult day for me or whether he only thought about himself. He had not. I said that I was unsettled by his insinuation that my family estrangement was a self inflicted issue, i.e. I could make more effort to be nicer and more accommodating to them. I explained these people who were meant to love me unconditionally had hurt me and broken my trust and I was protecting myself from more hurt, and I had made my peace with this, but this doesn’t stop me thinking about feeling alone or unloved from them at times.

He said it wasn’t his fault he was the golden child so I shouldn’t punish him for it.

There was a lot more, but I heard more about all the ways I’m causing him stress by being emotionally draining. He can’t cope with my needs as they so unreasonable and I don’t explain myself properly etc etc

OP, I would recommend that you stop talking about it with him - you're trying to get him to see your point of view and he can't. And in his head, you can't see his. So it just creates drama and more reasons for him to shout and yell and play the victim.

I would suggest that you simply distill it down to the most basic level of what you are struggling with and keep it very practical. Tell him that you want to be supporive but you can't spend all your time attempting to boost him up, or constantly reassuring him when, for example you're out with friends and just want to behaving a good time. Tell him tht you'd really lilke him to work on that becuase you do love him, but this pressure is not something you can maintain. Re emotional support, I'd say something like, "If I ask you for a hug or to listen to my concerns, I just need you to do that."

And then leave it at that. Right now, he's feeling attacked and insecure and he's turning it on you. if he was an emotionally healthy person, he would use this as an opportunity to reflect. He'd think about whether you have a point and what he can do to improve. he m ight also think about what he needs from you in terms of any changes or whatever. I don't think that will happen here, but it's the first step. And then you see how it goes.

He is deeply unpleasant, isn't he OP? I fear you will tie yourself in knots trying to understand why he is the way he is or to get him to see your point of view. He certainly isn't interested in hearing your perspective or meeting you halfway. Interesting, too, that he responds with shouting and defensiveness to what should be a calm exchange of differing opinions and approaches. Kind men don't react this way. Kind men make your life easier, not harder.

So you have a man who either quietly seethes or explodes, refuses to see your perspective, encroaches on the things you do for yourself and appears to only value the way you look. To top it off he's previously left you twice and the baseline in your marriage is bumbling along with a quiet sense of dissatisfaction and not really being seen - on your part, that is. He is no prince, @PlaidJane

He is taking notes? Get out:fast.

The gaslighting attempts are interesting. As he’s initiating conversations with me then angry with my responses. I explained I only have a few options, be honest (which is important to me as part of my moral integrity) or lie/pretend. lying and pretending is leading to me detaching.

I can see he’s finding very hard to look inside himself, this is the anger. It probably feels horrible.

He keeps saying WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM ME and then hates the answer. He wants to know what I’m also doing to try to change.

This isn’t really about me anymore. I’m just a bystander now to his internal meltdown.

I have heard all these things about myself before, I’m 43, years of hearing these things it just becomes so normal it doesn’t even hurt my feelings.

I’m too much, too needy, overthink everything, ask too many questions, probe too deeply, think I know everything, want to know the answers, repeat myself too much, don’t know when to stop. Perhaps I am and this is something I need to work on.

if I was heard and had my needs met then these issues do not come up, I’m not like this in any of my friendships or other relationships.

I’m too much, too needy, overthink everything, ask too many questions, probe too deeply, think I know everything, want to know the answers, repeat myself too much, don’t know when to stop. Perhaps I am and this is something I need to work on.

I think it's unlikely. But even if you do, then that just means this relationship isn't the one for you. And to be honest, even if you take a simple view - he doesn't give you what you need/want, and it sounds like you don't give him what he needs/want. So what's the point of this relationship?

@PlaidJane You are continuing to overthink this massively - I'm reminded of my 3 year old daughter when she dropped an ice cream on the floor at the zoo - she just cried and screamed at the big blob of ice cream wanting it to magically fix itself and reappear on the empty cone on her hand. You are not 3!

I don't think you need to know any more than you do - you're deeply unhappy, you are being horribly mistreated and he couldn't give a damn about you as all he's thinking about is himself and how to blame you for everything. He's a very spoilt individual.

In the middle of these attempts by him to deconstruct you and the dynamic between you do you ever say - "this is the worst first date I've ever had" - think about it - why is he treating you this way? Is this the best he can do? Is this your dream partner in life? You know the answer.

I don't think you are either the right person or in the right situation to start making sense of him and I think you are wasting your time on all of these fronts anyway. You are not going to find the magic key to unlock him and make everything right.

Forget him, what are you going to about your life, what do you want?

@mmmarmalade I am not wanting this, I don’t want to be in this conversation and I don’t need to know more or deconstruct him. I don’t want it to be fixed either or try to understand it really. It’s just the weird part now where I am trying to delicately extract myself from the situation, obviously he is going to fight me on this, so I need to be careful. The magic key can go fuck itself 😂

the urge to run away is so strong now I can’t imagine not feeling any other way about it

Tbh it sounds like he just doesn’t have a personality.

He sounds a bit like a “Vulnerable/victim narcissist”. All “woe is me”.

Terrified that you’ve finally realised that he is empty. And more-so, angry because you make HIM focus on that fact.

@PlaidJane ‘I’m not like this in any of my friendships or other relationships’ is the standout here. As is your overwhelming urge to run…so how can you best ‘escape’?
Housing situation? Have you seen a solicitor?

I haven’t had any legal advice yet as I am still navigating home life situation day to day.

I am being cowardly rather than honest and I am not sure why I am not being upfront that I don’t want to work on our marriage. Well I suppose as I don’t feel safe to share my feelings? I am confused whether I am the issue or not. Plus also we once were friends and lovers and got along and I am sad that things have gone this way. I also feel terribly guilty about checking out of our relationship and keep giving things a chance in the past when I had a gut feeling it wasn’t right. I feel like I’ve led him on

I understand that he is upset (angry) I’ve checked out. He says he’s doing the work on himself and keeps asking me for a hug. I haven’t been forthcoming on the hug because I’ve explained to him my barriers have come up in an emotional safety mechanism. The hug would make him feel better but I am not sure this would meet my needs right now. This seemed to make him angry as he started saying he’s not going to hit me so why do I feel unsafe. I said it’s triggered how I used to feel as a child unsafe and I don’t think he’s seeing my needs in the picture because if someone told me that, I don’t think I would keep continuing to get mad at them. He keeps saying he’s making loads of effort with me to talk to me and gets nothing back.

He keeps saying he’s trying to fix things and make it better and now he’s giving up because I am cold. I am perplexed that he’s annoyed it’s only been a short period of time, how would he expect things to go back to how they were this fast? I said if I go back to normal it would be me pretending and also it runs the risk of him not putting in the work. He then twisted this to say I’m manipulating and controlling him by withholding affection and being distant. I do talk to him though it’s just not enough for him.

He’s stormed out saying it’s me who doesn’t make him happy and he’s done

He says this to me about himself and it’s true, he’s not like this with his friends or family. He is like it behind closed doors. Perhaps I am also not a nice person indoors who knows anymore

Maybe it would be helpful to reframe the situation not in terms of whose fault it is but just accepting that the relationship isn’t a good match, regardless of fault. That said, he sounds awful, but I just mean in respect of you worrying about whether you are a nice person or not. If you know you are a nice person with everyone else, it’s the relationship (or him) not you.

This is the ‘sting of the dying wasp.’ None of his normal tricks are working.

If you are SO bad why doesn’t he leave then?

He is a highly manipulative man. And also, the only interesting thing about him was you. He must hold on to you yet control you.

Be careful.

I am curious as to why you married him.

and why did he marry you.

I had a long chat with a friend today who has a background in this type of psychology and it was so helpful.

I’m aware that he is having to see himself in the mirror and he hates it. He wants me to come back and repair everything to how it was, and because I know if I do that, his progress will stop.

I’m just still and not moving. She told me this is my boundary. I’m not being cruel I am just stepping back and saying he has to feel these feelings and process them without me coming to sooth him because nothing will change long term for anyone otherwise. So he wants to run away because he is afraid of how horrible this feels.

I don’t see fault, I see fundamental incompatibility and I suspect he does too. However I don’t want to be stung 1,000 times in this process so I need to stop engaging as much

In terms of money and house it’s clean split really, just no idea how long we would have to share a house together in the process

Well you can start a divorce today, online
this website takes you through all the stages

https://www.gov.uk/divorce/file-for-divorce

and today you can contact 3 estate agents to come and value the property then choose one of them and put the house on the market.

If you believe it's a clean split, then you could be divorced in time for Christmas / New year

and you never know the house could be sold within weeks.

Your friend is absolutely right. It’s ok to have boundaries. You don’t owe anyone making yourself uncomfortable to make them feel comfortable.

That “I won’t hit you” comment is actually quite chilling by the way, people who would never consider hitting you would never need to say “I would never hit you”. That comes from people who would or, want you to fear that they would.

I’d speak to a solicitor and maybe see about moving any important documents somewhere he can’t get to, before mentioning divorce at all.

A sit might seem like a clean split. But it sounds like he’s going to do all he can to make it difficult for you.