He's definitely restarted the affair

[Allthegoodonesareg0ne]

2 years ago my husband had an affair and we reconciled. All was going well. He left his job for a bit and then had to go back. In March he went on a trip where she was, first time since. He came back off. I suspected, he denied. Then he said he hasn't been happy, rhe effort of dealing with my triggers from the affair was too much. He was worn out. He was planning to stay until after my hysterectomy this week and then move out. Since then its been a roller coaster. Warm some days, cold the next. In amongst it i filed for divorce. Some days he wanted to try and some days he was like an imposter in my husbands body. Over and over I asked about her he said he wasn't talking to her.
Today I got forwarded messages between them from her husband. He's been at it again.
He says he wasn't cheating, he'd already decided it was over between us he wouldn't tell me so I'd let him look after me and rhe kids through my surgery.
So now I know. I already suspected it shouldn't be a shock. I'd already said ir was over but I suppose some part of me was hanging on.
No point to this really except maybe to warn others and to get a bit or a handhold as this feels bloody unbearable.

Thank you xx

I agree with you in the sense that the responsibility lies fully with him. It was up to him to be faithful and to address any issues with our marriage with me without involving anyone else until that was concluded.
That's not to say I see her as blameless. She knowingly entered into an affair despite being married and being aware my husband was too.
The responsibility to me and the kids though was all his.
But neither me or the kids are obliged to make her feel welcome or accept her in our lives.

@Allthegoodonesareg0ne if she is going to be around, you can ask your husband to do the collection of the children as well as dropping them back? It’s only fair seeing as you will be doing the lions share of the caring and you live close by. That way you don’t see her and that will help you.

I really would encourage you to not get your children so involved in being hostile to the ap. 50% of the reason she is there is because of their dad, he had a responsibility to them and he failed them. Even though it’s painful to hear, he made a choice.
Will eow with their father be with both the dc so you both get a weekend off?

He'll be picking up from school Friday and dropping to school Monday eow so I won't need to see him at all.
I've not got the kids involved in being hostile the ap. They know I don't like her and why. I've been clear with them in encouraging them to make up their own minds.
They are quite clear They don't want to meet her at all at the moment. That might change, they may not get a choice but to have to. But their relationship with her if there needs to be one will be their own.

The reason for what? I was trying to give the child’s perspective. As someone whose mum cheated on their dad when I was a teen, if they carried on their relationship (thank god they did not!) there is no way I would have treated the OM with anything other than distain. My point was teens have strong feelings on things like this. And their feelings are valid and they shouldn’t be told to be nice and pretend it’s ok.

It’s all good to say this OW didn’t owe OP and her kids loyalty but the reality is if you have an affair with a married man and want him to break up his family, you don’t also get to demand his kids accept you. Decisions have consequences.

I was answering the previous poster. This specific OW is not the reason her parents aren't together.

But you're right that kids will probably boil it down to that to protect their idealised view of their parent. I would not want to be in her shoes as a step parent.

The ow actively encouraged my husband to leave us. Spouted all kinds of crap about how rhe kid's would be happier, how she'll support him with them, she can't wait to meet them, even encouraged him to force the sale of our house (we've two autistic kid's who need as much continuity as we can give them).
The responsibility is 100% on my husband for his choices. She was likely responding to his 'I've been unhappy for years' script. But she's not some innocent bystander in the whole mess. Neither me nor the kids owe her any kindness or opportunity.

On the upside today I'm feeling pretty furious with him! He had therapy today and came out with some drivel about how he tried so hard to make me happy he wore himself out. He's trying to work on that in therapy so that he voices his needs better and draws better boundaries.
It's left me literally raging - which is massively helpful!
He literally had everything he wanted. We had a great and frequent sex life, I did all the cooking, cleaning, childcare, life admin, organised every date. He worked.
He got a second chance after his affair and still blew it.
I wasn't perfect, I asked for more effort from him, I needed reassurance after his affair, I wanted some partnership so I could return to work too. Often I was frustrated at having to ask for these things repeatedly.
But he didn't speak up for what he needed!?
Wtaf!!

Yes I'm not saying she's an innocent angel. Those lines about how he'll be happier etc are standard lines said by anyone who is "supporting" the affairing person who is considering splitting (which would mean running into their arms). She was validating his version. Any old OW or OM does this (that's their script). I think she is just any old OW. I don't feel sorry for her. She knew this was a bad idea.

What would 'voicing his needs' be? Saying "I want to fuck someone else' before doing it, instead of just....doing it as he has done?!

He is fucking delusional and I would LOVE to know what garbage he has been spouting to the therapist. Also ime, people tend to take what they want to hear from therapy rather than truths they dont like. So for example the therapist saying 'you really need to create better boundaries around your marriage so that someone else is less likely to be a risk to your relationship' (say) and he hears them telling him to be more demanding to get what he wants otherwise he is ok to fuck someone else, as it will be your fault.

Yes. Whatever you need to boost your energy to push him away is good at this stage. His obvious fogginess and "not knowing what he wants and feeling victimised" is classic. He has a lot of digging to do into himself.

Have you read the Betrayal Bind by Michelle Mays? She describes the vascillating states of the Betrayed in a really clear and understandable way. Great book.

I haven't read it but I will thank you

@Allthegoodonesareg0ne this man has an ego to outdo Donald Trump. Unbelievable level of selfishness, ME ME MEEEEE

What a delusional self centred man. He’s done you a favour. Now you will have 50% of your time back to prioritise yourself and your career. He can take on what you always asked him to do. His share of the food shops, washing, dinner, schedules, bedtimes. He will ware himself out actually taking care of a household and kids rather than just being worn out by you asking for it. On top of that he will have a girlfriend, with her own needs that she will expect him to meet.

The reality is he got complacent and bored with family life and rather than make a positive change or focus on the good he had, he had an affair to create excitement and validation. Then he got found out and the shine went off him in your eyes and he had to put more effort in. Which was fine for a while but then he got bored of being the one in the wrong and decided he wanted to be adored again (cue OW reappearing). He’s now rewritten history to make you the problem for not getting over his affair quickly enough so he had to do it again.

The whole thing is so pathetic I’m not sure how you can look at him. Give him what he wants — freedom. Because ultimately you will gain that too. You have listed what you gave to the relationship. But what did he add? What are you losing? A self centred faithless man who is only loving and caring when it benefits him. You can’t put a price on the peace you will feel when you don’t have to listen to his self serving drivel anymore.

What sort of therapist is that?????!!!!!

Gosh, I see so many similarities. By the way, I'm pretty sure he coudn't help to lie to look good in the individual therapy.

I understand what you are saying. I'm just wondering if you have experienced betrayal in a long marriage yourself?

Honestly the stuff he was saying with a dead straight face like he's had such insight into our marriage and himself!
How he changed jobs because I asked him too, because when a wife says husband does but he should have expressed his own needs.. completely missing the fact that he was in that job for 12 years before the affair without me ever asking him to change jobs, it took him another year to decide he would look (because for rhe first year he wouldn't so that he 'didn't come to resent me') and then when he finally got one I raised multiple concerns about it! But apparently he had to take it to make me happy...
How he did everything to make me happy at his own detriment..
My only ask after the affair the first time was that he didn't have contact with ap. That was literally it. He on the other hand came up with a laundry list of things he needed from me. Some of them were reasonable to be fair, others less so but I met them all.
Then on top of his therapy insights he complained about the pressure he's under now to support two households! As if I'm rhe person to bring that complaint too!
At least its given my head a wobble!

One he hand picked himself, who market's themselves to 'high performing males'...
They are half the price of my therapist who is wonderful but just one that was local to me, not the higher end of therapy pricing

Its really handy when they stand up and say "LOOK AT ME! I AM A SELFISH CUNT!! oh and I am stupid too!"

Makes it all a lot easier as you stop questioning yourself. You finally see that.....it really is him, not you!

The point is, an affair takes two people. The fault is equal. This OW was married herself, knew OP's husband is married, but still chose to actively involve with this married man. So, yes, she was at fault, as much as he was.

Then on top of his therapy insights he complained about the pressure he's under now to support two households! As if I'm rhe person to bring that complaint too!
At least its given my head a wobble!

loooooooooooool, this makes me laugh, loooooooooooool. These idiots use affair as an escapism and all of sudden became more crushed than ever. Let them weep.

looooooool, that makes sense - ego pumping therapist for mid-life crisis men whose testosterone is taking a pathetic dive!

@Allthegoodonesareg0ne oh yes, I did all these things because you made me. I do everything you want. Except stop talking to my ap/splitting up the family/lying/being a total fuck trumpet. I’m so wonderful MEEEEE.
How can you stand him being in the same room?!

I can't be today, my blood is still boiling. Its the realisation that this is genuinely his perspective! I encouraged him to do therapy as part of the recovery from the affair the first time. It took him 18 months to decide to give it a try and find one he was happy with and this is what he takes from it.
I realised yesterday that there isn't even any point to argue it. He's genuinely convinced himself that he was a martyr to our marriage and deserves now to put him and what he wants over everything else.