Mum will not allow me to spend time with other family members

[Nomorebullshitnotavailable]

There has been a long history of this. Title not entirely accurate as I am allowed to see my dad and my brother but only if she is there.

Quick overview - parents split over 30 years ago, I live closest to my mum, dad and brother live further away but in different locations to one another. I am the only one with children, all of whom are young (under 5).

There have been many instances of me asking to spend one on one time with my dad or my brother over the years. They don’t seem keen because they know it will cause issues with mum. If I bring it up with mum I get a lot of shit back (silent treatment, guilt tripping, tears etc).

I recently went to visit my dad (he usually comes to us as children haven’t travelled well) and my mum’s response was to go and stay with him (and his wife) for 3 days. By the way, she loathes him and constantly bitches about him to me. So, as self involved as it sounds, I do feel like the visit was to make a point to me.

She frequently spends one on time with my brother (ie every visit) but I am NEVER allowed to see him by myself. Even when my dad visits, he usually goes to her house first and then they will all come over to mine.

I do know there is something very toxic here. I have had therapy and I know that my mother is a major cause of anxiety and stress for me. Even putting reasonable boundaries in place is met with the usual silent treatment and guilt tripping.

There’s a lot more I could say but don’t really know where to start and end. My two questions really are:

1. Does anyone have any idea why she could be like this?
2. I can’t cut her off (I’ve tried just taking a break and the fallout really wasn’t worth it) so how do I handle this?

I’m really at my wits end, it has a huge impact on my mental health and I would be so grateful for any insights. Thank you.

Hard to say without the back story, but going to stay with your ex husband of 30 years and his wife is a really extreme thing to do. Presumably your dad is ok with it and with going to hers before visiting you which would suggest there is an agreement. Either she doesn’t trust you with him, or trust him with you.

If you won’t go no-contact, you just have to live with it. I assume you’ve already asked her what the problem is and she won’t tell you.

What does she say is the reason, OP (aware she makes it difficult to have discussion) have you ever managed to say 'why is it okay for you to see them on your own but not me?' Or would she just refuse to respond?

“I recently went to visit my dad (he usually comes to us as children haven’t travelled well) and my mum’s response was to go and stay with him (and his wife) for 3 days.”

Sorry, what? Why would your DF’s wife let his ex-wife stay with him? If my DH wanted his first wife to stay, he’d get a very dusty answer leaving him in no doubt that it wouldn’t be happening. As for your brother, why don’t you ask to meet up with him somewhere, without your DM? It sounds as though your DM is a control freak and she is worried that if she lets you meet up without her, then you might gang up against her behind her back. OP, you are all adults, and I simply wouldn’t stand for this. Tell your DF that you are coming to visit, and that you want to see him without your DF being present. If he refuses, then it’s he who will be missing out on seeing his DD (you) and DGC. As for your DB, invite him round to yours. Or meet him out for a meal. This is absolutely ridiculous, and unless and until you all stand up to your DM, it will continue. And yes, your DM will put on her parts and try everything in her armoury to try to stop it, but you just have to be strong and do it - it seem your DM has browbeaten you all into doing her bidding, and things need to change. She too needs to understand that if she wants a relationship with you and your DC, she has to allow you to see your DF and DB on your own, and on your own terms.

There actually isn’t much back story, it’s just always been this way. There’s no reason not to trust my dad, my brother or me - it more seems as though she needs to be the centre of any family gathering if that makes sense?

Yes, my dad knows what she’s like but still cares about her and I think is just relieved he’s not on the receiving end of it anymore. I’ve always been my mum’s emotional support and validation I guess.

She would not acknowledge there is a problem, cry and say either that she may as well kill herself or that she’ll be dead soon anyway (she’s been saying this for decades and is fine).

How does she know you’re seeing them? Cut her off from knowing your business!

All completely sensible advice. The biggest issue is that neither dad nor brother will support me in this. In my most self pitying moments I do sometimes feel like quality time with me is just not worth the aggro to them. So then I come full circle and wonder why I bother!

I never tell her if dad is visiting, he tells her and then before I know it she’s invited herself along. With my brother, he always just visits her and I might see him while he’s there (with her).

Well, that would be her decision, if she did decide to end her life. Regardless of her decisions, you don’t need her permission to see your father or brother. Just see them. Don’t tell her.

This is a bad siutuation for you but the fall out will have a sad effect on your DCs lives. Why not put them first and tell DM you are stepping away from her issues. Reduce contact.
Your DCs are embroiled in a weird arrangement which they will be involved in and aware of as they get older.

Then gradually over time do what suits you and your DCs most. Ie not kowtowing to her

also this might finally help her to move on -she is no longer the matriarch

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head - she wants to be the matriarch (I don’t particularly want to be taking that role but naturally life moves on somewhat). Interestingly, she doesn’t have an issue with my brother and dad spending time alone together, it’s only me.

I’ve reduced contact in the past and said it was too stressful and I was stepping away but the fallout was so so bad (I had my brother yelling at me when I was 7 months pregnant) that I tried to rebuild on my terms but it’s just never good enough for her. I shield my kids as much as possible but recognise that they will inevitably become aware to some degree. I do think that she wouldn’t dare fuck around when it comes to my kids because that’s the only time I’ve ever had a proper go at her.

I think basically that if I were to really stand my ground with my mum that I would lose a relationship certainly with my brother and it would make it difficult for my dad.

“The biggest issue is that neither dad nor brother will support me in this.”
“I never tell her if dad is visiting, he tells her and then before I know it she’s invited herself along.”

Are your DF and DB bothered about seeing you? Why can’t you tell your DF that you are asking him to visit and you don’t want your DM at the same time, so will he please not say anything? And if your DM does get wind of it and asks to come, then say yes, but not when DF is visiting. I can’t believe that your DF’s second wife is so cast aside in all this. My DH has an ex- wife, but our paths never cross - which seems to me to be perfectly normal. OP, YOU are going to have to stand up against your DM. Surely you can control what goes on in your own house, and who visits when? As your DC get older, I should imagine it will become more difficult to accommodate them all at once in any case. What does your DH say about all this? And what of your stepmother - how has she been suckered into this whole dysfunctional situation? OP, you are going to have to be strong, and a start would be refusing to have your DF and DM to stay at the same time in your house. You do have control over that.

In the nicest possible way...your family sounds absolutely mental.

Why was your brother yelling at you while you were pregnant?

Why haven't you told you father not to tell your mother that you're meeting?

Why can't you meet your brother independently of her?

And most of all...why haven't you told your mother to fuck off yet? She can only dictate who you see if you let her. Find your backbone.

OP, I really feel for you. My mum is just the same, all contact with ‘the family’ (dad, sibling, grandparents) must go through her or she’ll throw an absolute fit. Woe betide me if I tell a grandparent something I hadn’t told mum and she hears about it from them rather than me.

It definitely seems to be a control thing and I think a really fragile ego or deep insecurities about people talking about her behind her back. Maybe that rings true for your mum too? In any case, I’m really sorry you’re living with this. Like yours, mine has also made my life hell when I’ve tried to reduce contact, but I’m going LC now for the sake of my DS. Hugs and solidarity to you!

I actually don’t think they are that bothered, no. Which does make me really very sad. I have told her this time that I would rather see dad on my own and I will see her the following day. I’m still waiting for the fallout which, I suppose, is why I wrote this post. I just need some kind of reassurance that I’m not the crazy one, I suppose!

I feel for my dad’s wife, she’s a lovely woman and dotes on the children, but she (I do NOT understand) seems absolutely fine with it all?!

I'd put money on her being worried that they will tell you stuff she doesn't want you to know. No idea what, might be nothing earth shattering, just she wants control. My sister was like this with her kids and made them miserable. They are now NC with her.

You don't have to put up with being treated this way op.

I am going to start setting boundaries for visiting. And ask my dad to keep visits to just us unless it’s a whole family thing.

I have told my mother to fuck off before and that life doesn’t revolve around her - it went about as well as you would imagine!

This is your problem then - your dad and brother have allegiances to your mum, and no allegiance to you at all.

Have you tried speaking with your dad and brother separately about what you need from them to be able to feel like you have a valued and secure relationship with them, and how they could give it to you?

eg one to one time, not telling your Mum about the arrangements between you etc.

Explain the toll it’s taking on you to have your Mum involved in every aspect of your life and that you would value being able to develop relationships with them individually.

They either will or won’t understand this and be able to follow through.

If they can - great. Build the trust back up over time.

If they cant’t - that’s sad and lonely for you. It’ll likely cause you some anxiety to come to terms with their inability to meet your needs. This is grief work and would be great if you can get some therapist support. If you’re going to recover your mental/emotional strength and heal from anxiety, you’ll need to let go of the fantasy you have of how a family should work, and grieve.

It’s hard work to tease it all out - have been there and done that. But if you can brave working through this - clearly stating your needs, accepting your family members for who they are, and grieving the consequences for yourself - you’ll end up in a much stronger, happier place.

We took you to stately homes is a series of threads on here you may get good advice and support on.

Thank you, that’s very kind. I am sorry that you have similar issues. I don’t know if it’s that she’s worried about being gossiped about - she doesn’t have issues with my dad and brother meeting up, it’s only me seeing other people. Sometimes I’ve wondered if it’s a really fucked up competition with the other female in the family? I don’t know - I can’t quite articulate it further than that.

That’s interesting - and thank you.

It doesn't matter what the reason is. You either do as you are manipulated to do, or you learn to shrug off the consequences.

Everything in life has consequences, they can't always be nice unfortunately.

That’s good advice. I will have that conversation with my dad. I fear that my brother is a lost cause, he cannot hear anything even remotely negative about my mum (probably because he and I have very different mothers!).

I will look for that, it rings a bell. Thank you.