Mum will not allow me to spend time with other family members

[Nomorebullshitnotavailable]

There has been a long history of this. Title not entirely accurate as I am allowed to see my dad and my brother but only if she is there.

Quick overview - parents split over 30 years ago, I live closest to my mum, dad and brother live further away but in different locations to one another. I am the only one with children, all of whom are young (under 5).

There have been many instances of me asking to spend one on one time with my dad or my brother over the years. They don’t seem keen because they know it will cause issues with mum. If I bring it up with mum I get a lot of shit back (silent treatment, guilt tripping, tears etc).

I recently went to visit my dad (he usually comes to us as children haven’t travelled well) and my mum’s response was to go and stay with him (and his wife) for 3 days. By the way, she loathes him and constantly bitches about him to me. So, as self involved as it sounds, I do feel like the visit was to make a point to me.

She frequently spends one on time with my brother (ie every visit) but I am NEVER allowed to see him by myself. Even when my dad visits, he usually goes to her house first and then they will all come over to mine.

I do know there is something very toxic here. I have had therapy and I know that my mother is a major cause of anxiety and stress for me. Even putting reasonable boundaries in place is met with the usual silent treatment and guilt tripping.

There’s a lot more I could say but don’t really know where to start and end. My two questions really are:

1. Does anyone have any idea why she could be like this?
2. I can’t cut her off (I’ve tried just taking a break and the fallout really wasn’t worth it) so how do I handle this?

I’m really at my wits end, it has a huge impact on my mental health and I would be so grateful for any insights. Thank you.

This is a great summary and it in a nutshell. I have a lot of thinking and self examination to do (I’m great at giving advice but so terribly atrocious at taking it myself!) because realistically the only thing that can change here is how I let it affect my life.

A lot of very wise words on this thread.

Yet another post with such lovely and thoughtful words. I’ve never been able to open up about this outside of my husband and therapy - it means such a lot to have people take the time to offer words of support, advice, experience, encouragement and validation. Including (very much so!) the ones telling me to just grow a backbone!

Thank you all. I’m reading every comment and taking everything said as a way to move forward.

Your brother getting angry at you for you not being there for mum as a hotel when you have a 7 week old n Covid is RIDICULOUS.

Personally, I would cut them all loose. Let them see you on your terms, if at all.

Grey rock all the way. No need for a big confrontation, just phase them out!

Why do you even need to tell her. When I left home I certainly didn’t let my mum know of my daily activities, not for any other reason than it wouldn’t have occurred to me. Or indeed who was visiting me.

I would go low/no contact with the lot of them tbh she's toxic and your dad and brother enable and reinforce her behaviour . Let her cry and all the other stuff just ignore them all don't answer calls etc because from where I'm sitting none of them are worth the trouble

Bloody hell. Your mum sounds like an absolute nightmare and quite unwell, but your brother and your dad are just as bad using you to absorb her shite so they don’t have to deal with her.

I’d actually go NC with your brother and your dad and grey rock your mum. I’m really sorry to say this but I bet your brother won’t contact you if you don’t contact him first. Doesn’t sound like it would be any great loss.

You sound so sane and rational for someone who grew up amongst these people. Hold onto that x

I agree and I don’t. It’s my dad who tells her when he’s visiting me and invites her, and I have no input into when my brother visits my mum.

Thank you for those kind words. Yes I’ve realised from this thread that my brother and dad really do use me as a shield. Basically better that I have to cope with the fallout than them. Which explains the anger from my brother if I show any dissent.

it’s been quite eye opening actually.

It’s my dad who tells her when he’s visiting me and invites her

That is so rude.

To just invite her to your house.

None of them seem to act as if you are a capable adult.

Hopefully they'll be finding out soon just how capable you are!

Absolutely this ☝️ just want to reiterate it, OP. You’re so strong and you’ve got this, for yourself and your DC.

Thank you, that is so kind of you.

I’m surprised you have had therapy but are asking the therapy question on here.

Sorry I’m not sure I understand what you mean?

Honestly? I'd stop seeing all of them for a while. This family dynamic is totally toxic and it is making you really unhappy. Your mum sounds like a total narcissist and your dad and brother are her 'flying monkeys', weaponised to do her bidding the minute you step out of line. I'm very surprised that your step-mother allows her to stay. It all sounds very weird and co-dependent.

Do you have a good relationship with your in-laws? If so, hopefully your children would still have a relationship with grandparents that love them.

She’s extremely toxic and controlling and until she realises this nothing will change.

in all honesty you need to look a how much you value the relationship and decide if you want to continue to have one with her or with your dad and brother without her. Because you absolutely can cut her out of you choose peace.

As difficult as the family can be with me they do all adore my kids. If they didn’t then it would be very easy to just walk away! My in laws are quite indifferent, my husband has had his own issues with his family which isn’t my place to go into here. But I have sometimes wondered if we were drawn to one another because of the need to care for and heal the other.

I think you’d really benefit from more therapy, psychotherapy if you can, because it’ll help you understand the young child inside you who’s driving you to keep the whole dynamic going. For example…

I think basically that if I were to really stand my ground with my mum that I would lose a relationship certainly with my brother and it would make it difficult for my dad.

Do you really have a relationship with your brother? I suspect what you’d actually lose is the fantasy of a relationship. A therapist could help you move towards a reality view of your relationships. The work involves becoming okay with tolerating your feelings - the sadness, anger, loneliness of not having the relationships you need now or needed as a child. By persisting with the fantasy, you’re avoiding feeling the feelings of the reality. The fantasy and reality are jarring within you - that’s what makes this situation internally stressful. When you can grieve the fantasy and accept the reality, the stress melts away.

It isn’t your responsibility to make things easy for your dad - you’re enabling the family dynamic by doing this. This is how a child approaches things and there might be some deep beliefs you have leftover from childhood driving this. ‘If I keep dad happy, he’ll look after me’ perhaps - an parent’s love and protection is vital to survival in childhood, but as an adult you can keep yourself alive and you don’t need to be emotionally attached to your parents to ensure psychical survival anymore. Again, this is an avoidance of feeling - feeling guilty about angering your dad or for letting him down or whatever. A therapist can help you learn to tolerate feeling guilt so you can process it and choose a different path for yourself.

You said you’ve been told you have anxious attachment, but have you done much work with a therapist beyond that? The anxiety in anxious attachment is basically a fear of feeling your feelings, so some work with a therapist to learn to tolerate your feelings will pay huge dividends and help you move towards a secure attachment style. You’ll then feel free to say no, or cut contact, or whatever you need to do to preserve your peace, because you won’t be afraid of the feelings that might crop up when you take those actions. When you can face feeling your feelings, you’ll have the freedom to choose whatever is good for you throughout life (not just with your family).

Honestly? I wouldn't be speaking to him at all. He has been massively abusive to you when you were either pregnant or had just had a baby. He was actually trying to put you and your family's health at risk to pander to your mum. That rings massive alarm bells. He was able to leave home to live with his dad and yet there are no guilt trips coming from your mum. Now, he just does her bidding like the obedient flying monkey that he is.

You need to cut contact with him at the very least. He isn't a safe person for you and your family to be around.

Thank you, this is really helpful. That all makes sense to me because it’s my reaction to the expected fallout that I struggle so much with. I can see that therapy would really help me with this. I will try to find another therapist.

This was hard to read because when you put it like that I can see how awful it really was.

it’s quite upsetting actually, I’ve always really wanted a close relationship with my brother but I’m starting to realise it won’t happen

OP it doesn’t matter why your mum is like this. What matters is that youre an adult and can make your own decisions about who you see. You will also need to decide how you deal with Mum if she kicks off.

Yes I’m starting to realise that the why is really the least important bit here! I’ve just always obsessed so much over the why, thinking that if I understood then I could fix it, but I can’t can I?

No, you can’t fix it, lovely. It’s a devastating feeling of powerlessness to truly realise that - another reality check. Be gentle with yourself as you come to terms with it all

There is no fixing other people, just ourselves.

It is beyond freeing to really understand and accept this.
Life changing and enhancing.

I agree that your brother is seriously abusive and has abused you, a vulnerable pregnant and new mother.
Unforgivable.
He is not someone to have near your family I'm afraid.

I think you need to reframe your motivation.
Your children and family, their safety and well-being are your sole priority.
Your actions and future decisions and contact with your family need to be guided by what is best for the whole family.

I remember someone once telling me that her huge light bulb moment was her excellent therapist telling her that often abusive parents will present as great grandparents deliberately, as they know that is a way to control their children, that might otherwise withdraw from their controlling, manipulative and narcissistic ways.

She said that knowledge and penny dropping made it much easier to severely limit contact.
Her mother became more and more hysterical about contact, until she completely blocked her.

6 months of total silence was what it took for her to lay out her conditions of her mother seeing the children again.
She made it crystal clear to her mother she really wasn't pushed about further contact.

She saw her mother for a visit once a month, no more, until her death.
She put her on a complete information diet and never shared any information about their lives again.

I think an extended break could give you some head space to figure out your path.

Grandparents that add stress to a young family are simply not worth it IMO.

Thank you - I’d never thought about that. That they could be being deliberately better grandparents than parents, I mean. That’s actually making things click in my head. My mother certainly is so over the top with the kids that it’s really uncomfortable to watch (for both me and my husband) but I’ve never understood why it feels so sickening.