Mum will not allow me to spend time with other family members

[Nomorebullshitnotavailable]

There has been a long history of this. Title not entirely accurate as I am allowed to see my dad and my brother but only if she is there.

Quick overview - parents split over 30 years ago, I live closest to my mum, dad and brother live further away but in different locations to one another. I am the only one with children, all of whom are young (under 5).

There have been many instances of me asking to spend one on one time with my dad or my brother over the years. They don’t seem keen because they know it will cause issues with mum. If I bring it up with mum I get a lot of shit back (silent treatment, guilt tripping, tears etc).

I recently went to visit my dad (he usually comes to us as children haven’t travelled well) and my mum’s response was to go and stay with him (and his wife) for 3 days. By the way, she loathes him and constantly bitches about him to me. So, as self involved as it sounds, I do feel like the visit was to make a point to me.

She frequently spends one on time with my brother (ie every visit) but I am NEVER allowed to see him by myself. Even when my dad visits, he usually goes to her house first and then they will all come over to mine.

I do know there is something very toxic here. I have had therapy and I know that my mother is a major cause of anxiety and stress for me. Even putting reasonable boundaries in place is met with the usual silent treatment and guilt tripping.

There’s a lot more I could say but don’t really know where to start and end. My two questions really are:

1. Does anyone have any idea why she could be like this?
2. I can’t cut her off (I’ve tried just taking a break and the fallout really wasn’t worth it) so how do I handle this?

I’m really at my wits end, it has a huge impact on my mental health and I would be so grateful for any insights. Thank you.

Yes control is focussed on me. I have asked occasionally if he could just keep mum busy for a while because I’ve got a lot going on but I could NEVER say it was because of my mum’s behaviour - not sure if that makes sense, apologies.

Yes. Dad and brother want an easy life so you are the barrier to soak up all the issues and deal with it. They are hiding behind you like cowards

You’ve made some really insightful points and I suspect it’s because you’ve lived through a similar dynamic. I’m so sorry for that. You also sound like a really nice person and your words mean more to me than I think you realise. Thank you.

I’m trying to pick out all the wonderful posters individually but fear I am failing! Your kind words have also really hit home. I’m so grateful to everyone taking time out of their day to comment on this thread.

I am absorbing all of it and will not let this go on.

I’m taking everything on board and it’s such a relief to know I’m not crazy. I’m autistic with ADHD and so I find it very hard to know what is and isn’t normal

You are basically the only one in your family who isn't crazy. You sound like a really nice, normal, thoughtful, reasonable sort of person. It's actually remarkable that you've turned out so well, given what you had to grow up with, and frankly, I take my hat off to you.

Sorry - to the poster who said my mother has not fucked me up - thank you again. That has been a huge fear of mine since I became a mother and I’ve fought so hard not to be that person. Hearing it from a stranger over the internet shouldn’t mean as much as it does but…it does!

Wow, I’m sorry you have to listen to that.
She really is a manipulative piece of work, isn’t she.

Are you not tempted to face her down, so when she says “I may as well kill myself” could you reply “Because not being the center of attention would be like death for you Mum? That sounds healthy.” Or even “Do you promise?” or even “Have you considered seeking medical treatment for that narcissism. Hell, I’d even pay for you to go private if it got you a cure’

You have two qualities your parents and brother lack - empathy and insight.

Drop the rope these people hold out to you and reduce all further interaction down to zero sum.

I'm a fine one to talk, but I'd say that you need to try to stand firm.

I was in a similar position to the OP's dad's wife. We let his ex off with murder, particularly when she lost her 3rd partner. She was married to my late husband, but acquired a boyfriend who died suddenly. The next partner was actually a friend of my husband's. When he died the kids used to say 'Oh, but mum's on her own...' [She wasn't really. She only officially ever had a year between men. The next partner was found quite swiftly.]. (ETA If we organised a meal out with the kids, we had to invite the ex too.)

My husband felt that he could never win and didn't want to alienate the kids; I didn't feel that I could interfere.

After Dh died (and before I finally lost it and put my foot in it, thus alienating the kids) his DIL confessed to me that she found the ex 'jealous and controlling'.

If I had my time over, I'd have put my foot down much sooner.

It started with the woman trying to gatecrash our honeymoon. [Not kidding. She booked herself and her boyfriend into the sister hotel of our honeymoon hotel.]

Then, any time DH mentioned that he was planning on visiting the kids, it would be announced that she and her partner were already doing that during those dates.

I thought that things had improved at one point, but they really hadn't - it was just that she was getting her own way.

DH died during lockdown. I was told that the kids couldn't come to the funeral for physical health reasons; the adult grandchild for mental health reasons. Could the ex represent them at the funeral? (I had expected her to attend as well as, not instead of.)

I later found out that it had been her idea all along. The final straw for me was when she tried to persuade me to change where Dh's ashes were being placed. That was when I finally snapped and behaved badly.

I feel sorry for the DIL. She hasn't a hope in hell.

I'd advise the OP to try to ignore the pressure from her mother and the acquiescence of her brother. (That sounds familiar, by the way. When the DIL finally confessed that she'd been having problems with the ex, it was over the phone...as soon as the stepson entered the room, that conversation was over.)

Wow… thank you so so much, that means a lot to hear.

Just to reassure you OP, your mum and family are totally bonkers and you are in the right. Why on earth are they even mentioning to her that you have visited? Your brother sounds like a total mummy’s boy and why on earth does your divorced dad let her stay at his when he has a new wife??? It sounds like they do all they can to pacify your mum for an easy life but they don’t mind upsetting you. I’m annoyed for you as both they and she are denying you some nice relationships with them and not respecting any of your boundaries or feelings. I’d back off from the whole lot of them for a while if I were you and refuse to engage with whatever rubbish your mum is about to throw at you for whatever tiny thing you did. Focus on nourishing friendships outside this toxic family until you feel strong enough to reengage with them on your own terms. You are not responsible for your mother’s feelings. Once you care more about your own wellbeing than hers and aren’t scared of her anymore, you’ll be able to have a healthier relationship with her. Believe me, mine is not as mental as this but she was very very scary! WAS. Years of therapy worked wonders, finally in my 40’s! Thank goodness. Carry on if you can!

I agree you sound the only balanced one.

Best wishes to you.

Ps you cannot possibly be like your mother because you realise what she is like and you try not to repeat the cycle of abuse. It took me a long time to realise that too, hope this gives you a head start! Wishing you all the best OP! And adhd is a superpower xxx

I wish I had that kind of wit in the moment but I’m the person who thinks of the perfect comeback at least a week and a half later!!

Thank you so much.

My goodness - that woman sounds utterly unhinged!! I am so so sorry for your loss. Bad enough to have to deal with that without being left to grieve in peace with those that loved him. I’m so sorry.

That's how my Mum came across.

None of us have anything to do with her now. Two of my children don;t bother with her either.

I know it's sad, but if you brother is going to shout at you every time you hold your Mum accountable. let him get on with it and cut him out as well. People put too much on blood relations, if they're toxic they're toxic.

I can't tell you how freeing it is to cut off people who're causing you so much stress. My Mum spent her whole life guilt tripping us. We would do whatever just to not set her off.

Now none of us care so she can't do or say anything that hurts us.

Definitely speak to your Dad. It's actually insane he puts his ex before his own child. I pity your Step Mum.

You also don't want your children growing up thinking this dynamic is normal.

Oh gosh - thank you, those are lovely and very meaningful words. Thank you xxxx

Absolutely - wise words. I’m sorry that you’ve been through it but massive kudos for coming out the other side. It takes such strength.

The biggest motivation for doing better is our kids isn’t it.

Very motivating words - truly, thank you.

Oh I did have one shining moment years ago when she was throwing things and threatening to kill herself and I just shouted at her to shut up! The tears dried up instantly…

Still reading the thread but the best response I ever heard of to this, similar emotional blackmail situation, was "Well that seems a bit of an extreme reaction to me not doing what you want, but if you are sure thats what yuo want to do I wont stop you".

Never got mentioned again. I admit I was shocked when I first heard about it, but the more I think about it, the more I think it is the best way. It takes the power out of the threat, so it is no longer a threat.

That’s a genius response - am mentally tucking it away!

This is great advice, OP. There's a lot of speculation in this thread about what family secret may or may not be being hidden, but until something like that explicitly comes out there's not much point trying to figure out why your DM has to be this in control and why your DF and DB are enabling it. What you do know is it's out of order, these relationships are becoming impossible, and no one in your family is supporting you in it for their own reasons (apart from your DH by the sounds of things, which is great).

It sounds like any plans to meet your dad or brother get straight back to your mum because they tell her. As you've already said, your brother has a very different relationship with her and doesn't see a problem. He's going to continue to protect and accommodate her until something changes drastically for him, if that ever happens. If I was you, I'd have to start seeing DB as an extension of her and, very sadly, a lost cause. This is no doubt going to be tough to accept because it means your relationship with your brother will suffer as a result, but arguably he's already set that train in motion by behaving in some unacceptable ways and refusing to see the hurt being caused. You can't change his decisions to enable your mum. That's on him, not you. You can only control how you respond and how you protect your DCs from it. No contact is a massive step and I can see why you wouldn't want to do it, but low contact might have to be the way.

As well as the above suggestions, I'd have a look at more reputable/first-person advice about how to put boundaries up around toxic parents and go low contact. There are already great ideas in this thread from people who've clearly been in similar positions. It might be good to just see how other people are dealing with similar/comparable situations. It's really easy for people to say "just tell her to fuck off" when they haven't dealt with such a toxic, complex, enmeshed family dynamic. You need to hear from people who've been there.

I also think you read as amazing.
Amazing as a normal healthy woman with a seriously fxxked up family.
Amazing as a mother trying to protect her family.

Your family are absolutely toxic and honestly people like that in reality add nothing to the lives of grandchildren if they stress and abuse their grandchildrens parents!

I think you should relentlessly focus on your back, recovery, your children and family.

Be too busy.
Practice grey rock and medium chill methods of saying nothing and backing away.

Be unavailable.
The further away you step, the greater the peace and clarity.

Relationships with your brother and father are simply not worth the conditions of engagement.

We are here for you.