Mum will not allow me to spend time with other family members

[Nomorebullshitnotavailable]

There has been a long history of this. Title not entirely accurate as I am allowed to see my dad and my brother but only if she is there.

Quick overview - parents split over 30 years ago, I live closest to my mum, dad and brother live further away but in different locations to one another. I am the only one with children, all of whom are young (under 5).

There have been many instances of me asking to spend one on one time with my dad or my brother over the years. They don’t seem keen because they know it will cause issues with mum. If I bring it up with mum I get a lot of shit back (silent treatment, guilt tripping, tears etc).

I recently went to visit my dad (he usually comes to us as children haven’t travelled well) and my mum’s response was to go and stay with him (and his wife) for 3 days. By the way, she loathes him and constantly bitches about him to me. So, as self involved as it sounds, I do feel like the visit was to make a point to me.

She frequently spends one on time with my brother (ie every visit) but I am NEVER allowed to see him by myself. Even when my dad visits, he usually goes to her house first and then they will all come over to mine.

I do know there is something very toxic here. I have had therapy and I know that my mother is a major cause of anxiety and stress for me. Even putting reasonable boundaries in place is met with the usual silent treatment and guilt tripping.

There’s a lot more I could say but don’t really know where to start and end. My two questions really are:

1. Does anyone have any idea why she could be like this?
2. I can’t cut her off (I’ve tried just taking a break and the fallout really wasn’t worth it) so how do I handle this?

I’m really at my wits end, it has a huge impact on my mental health and I would be so grateful for any insights. Thank you.

God lord, I'd just block the lot of them.

Sounds like there's some sort of family secret to be uncovered, is he definitely your Dad, is she definitely your mum?

Your mum sounds like a very domineering person. Staying with your dad and his wife is very odd behaviour indeed. My own mother is a complete nightmare in other ways and the stately homes thread is the best place as PP says because it looks as if some boundary setting and grey rocking might be necessary and it would be useful to have some support.

May well not be easy but you need to put your foot down and stop her being able to control everything with manipulation.

my own family are of a similar mindset, hence why I live happily in peace having no contact with any of them.

Your dad and brother are boat steadiers. You threaten to rock the boat so they work to steady it. You are an adult who “isn’t allowed” to spend time with your own DB without her supervision, your DM even stayed with her EXDH & his wife and “punished” you for rocking the boat, the whole thing is batshittery, everyone is bending to appease one person and that’s fine sometimes to be kind and save someone’s feelings but this isn’t that. The whole family is enabling this domineering character because the alternative is to stand up to her, but you’ve been conditioned probably from infancy not to rock the boat, knowing she will double down and “punish”. The best solution I found with my own DM was to do what I wanted and if she “punished” me - let her get on with it, shrug and ignore (sometimes for years). Life is much calmer without someone like this in it and you can’t change them, only how you react.

The following taken from reddit r/justnomil might be useful for you, I refer to it when my own DM has been off on one to remind myself to ignore her antics. Here you go:

Don't rock the boat. (Enablers Mantra)

I've been thinking about this phrase a lot lately, about how unfair it is. Because we aren't the ones rocking the boat. It's the crazy lady jumping up and down and running side to side. Not the one sitting in the corner quietly not giving a fuck.

At some point in her youth, Mum/MIL gave the boat a little nudge. And look how everyone jumped to steady the boat! So she does it again, and again. Soon her family is in the habit of swaying to counteract the crazy. She moves left, they move right, balance is restored (temporarily). Life goes on. People move on to boats of their own.

The boat-rocker can't survive in a boat by herself. She's never had to face the consequences of her rocking. She'll tip over. So she finds an enabler: someone so proud of his boat-steadying skills that he secretly (or not so secretly) lives for the rocking.

The boat-rocker escalates. The boat-steadier can't manage alone, but can't let the boat tip. After all, he's the best boat-steadier ever, and that can't be true if his boat capsizes, so therefore his boat can't capsize. How can they fix the situation?

Ballast!

And the next generation of boat-steadiers is born.

A born boat-steadier doesn't know what solid ground feels like. He's so used to the constant swaying that anything else feels wrong and he'll fall over. There's a good chance the boat-rocker never taught him to swim either. He'll jump at the slightest twitch like his life depends on it, because it did .

When you're in their boat, you're expected to help steady it. When you decline, the other boat-steadiers get resentful. Look at you, just sitting there while they do all the work! They don't see that you aren't the one making the boat rock. They might not even see the life rafts available for them to get out. All they know is that the boat can't be allowed to tip, and you're not helping.

Now you and your DH get a boat of your own. With him not there, the balance of the boat changes. The remaining boat-steadiers have to work even harder.

While a rocking boat is most concerning to those inside, it does cause ripples. The nearby boats start to worry. They're getting splashed! Somebody do something!

So the flying monkeys are dispatched. Can't you and DH see how much better it is for everyone (else) if you just get back on the boat and keep it steady? It would make their lives so much easier.

You know what would be easier? If they all just chucked the bitch overboard.

Thank you all - more than one person has suggested some kind of family secret. That doesn’t feel like what is at the root of this. It wouldn’t explain all the insanity (for example, punishing me because she felt “left out” at my child’s birthday party).

The “boat rocking” analogy. Yes I can totally relate to this. I try my best not to engage with the crazy to her face now and just ignore and move on, because I know she wants the attention, but I’m still working on not letting it get to me in private. My husband is the first person who’s ever seen her for who she is and validated my feelings. I can’t tell you what a difference it has made to have someone say “YOU are not the crazy/unreasonable one here”.

You have a family problem and not just a mother problem. This all sounds very toxic. You need to stand up to everyone and set out your boundaries - if they choose to ignore them, then go low or no contact. You need to look after yourself.

I have a mother like this and a family dynamic like this.

My Dad died recently and i am so very sad that my entire relationship with him was through my Mum's permission/ control/ judgement. The endless bad-mouthing, one sided recounting of their long finished marriage.

Why i am telling you this is Let Her be angry/ ignore you and see and do what you want.

It's too late for me and my Dad but you have the chance. Honestly fuck em. Do what you want. How she reacts is up to her.

Er, how does she even know, OP? If you want to stay with/see someone, just arrange it with that person. There's absolutely no reason to tell your mother.

I think you need to learn to disconnect from your mother, and make sure she's less involved in your life. She has no right to interfere in this way. Grow a backbone!

I can’t think of a nice way to say this, so apologies in advance, but honestly, your entire family is fucking nuts and that’s really all there is to it.

As for ‘why’ your mother is like this - who knows? Who cares? There probably is no reason other than yeah, she’s nuts. You can’t rationalise any of this because it isn’t rational. It also isn’t rational that your father tells her when you visit him, when he knows full well what the fallout will be. It isn’t rational that anyone involved puts up with this bullshit.

Your brother, I suspect, is just fucked up by your mother.

Why do you actually want to see any of them? Your brother and mother are unpleasant to you. Your dad is presumably nice to you but still seems to put pandering to his ex-wife above his relationship with you and indeed with his current wife, so is equally culpable here.

Disentangle yourself from this nest of lunatics and live your life.

Nah, that's a bit of a reach. There are plenty women like OP's mum who's entire identity is wrapped up in their role in the family. Often have no life outside 'the family', want to be the one to pass on everyone else's news as they have none of their own. They are emotionally immature and have never been able to manage their emotions and so resort to silent treatment, huffs etc. Their entire identity is being the matriarch, which is ironic as they usually weren't very good mothers. They get angry and jealous when their daughters become their own person and no longer need them and so resort to these control tactics with family relationships in order to stay relevant/needed. It's very sad really.

This is a family problem not just a mum problem. You have become the social glue in your family and they all need you to carry on filling this role otherwise it shines a massive spotlight on the dysfunction going on. I filled a similar role albeit for different reasons and when I stopped doing this all hell broke loose. I have no relationship with either brother now (no falling out just they never contact me) and a fragile relationship with my mum. It’s all very sad but it suddenly dawned on me these people didn’t care for me at all they just needed me to make them seem normal, and I could no longer fill that role. Drop the rope and brace yourself, in the long run you will be happier and less stressed.

I’m so sorry for your loss. I will try to take the lesson on board.

I don’t tell her - my dad tells her (apparently they have weekly chats) if he’s coming to visit. With my brother he will never arrange anything with me, only with my mum.

Thank you.

Your brother sounds awful -you're probably best to go very low contact with him and ignore whatever control he tries to exert over you. It sounds like it is worth having a serious word with your dad - tell him how you feel and that you want a relationship with him that isn't tangled up with your mother. If he agress, then happy days. If he doesn't, at least you know you've tried.

People only push you around as much as you let them. You can ignore and tell them to fuck off. If they throw a shit fit, that's their problem, not yours.

I can’t disagree with any of this. I didn’t even realise how fucked up it all was until I had my first child. The thing that makes it so hard is that on the face of it she’s a great mother - everyone loves her, she seems like such a nice person. But there’s this side to her that nobody else sees.

What was your childhood like OP, if you don’t mind sharing.

Your family seems completely toxic and dysfunctional. Your mum appears as a textbook narcissist and control freak.

I’m sorry there’s so much drama in your life. I would be inclined to totally cut the lot of them off. I appreciate families are complicated though, and lots of emotion involved, so it’s not really and black and white situation. But you need to do what’s best for your mental wellbeing.

I’d cut them all off!

And the people of MN are constantly slagging off step-mums 😀

But seriously OP, I would just fuck them all off. I'm not even joking or being flippant. They all seem to be draining the life out of you, nobody supports you and they're not a positive influence on your (or your children's) life.

Step back and wait to see if they contact you and then, if they want to see you, you can make plans to suit YOU.

My first thought was there has been some sexual abuse which has been concealed and your mum is protecting you. Dad and brother are going along with it because they don't want the secret coming out. Did you grow up with your mum and your brother was brought up with dad?

This hit home - I’ve often been painted as the troublemaker in the family but I’m also the one that everyone moans about the other to. And most importantly I have to make my mum feel good about herself if dad or brother inadvertently upset her.

I recognise this behaviour - whenever someone behaves like this it is about control. She is trying to control the relationships within the extended family.

The rest of the family either enable by becoming extreme people pleasers, or they learn to play a similar game.

The key thing you have to remember is that you cannot control other people's behaviour, you can only manage your own and your reaction to them.

I have had a lot of therapy over the last few years, and the honest way I would handle this would be:

1. Put a very clear boundary in your head about how much energy you give to your mother. Number of phone calls, how often you see her. Then stick to it - even if it feels awful and hurts.
2. Ignore any "tricks" she comes up with in return. Attacking you, victim mode, guilt tripping are tricks, they are not real
3. Use a similar technique for your family - "I would like to see you Dad, but if mum is there, I will leave. I will visit her another time". Stick to it

Good luck

There’s a reason why she’s like this. No one’s that domineering and insistent for nothing. Your Dad pandering to her when they’re separated and he owes her nothing at this stage is odd.
It doesn’t sound like any of them are worth keeping in contact with. They’re also your children’s family, are they a positive influence on what a healthy family looks like to them?
I would seriously be thinking of pulling back and have your own circle that supports you whether that’s friends or your in laws.
I’m sorry to say this aswell but something needs to be said before your parents age and you may need to care for them as they get older. If you look after your dad will your mam cause trouble?! She needs telling to back off, you’re a parent yourself, you don’t need to do as you’re told anymore.

Your mum could have issues your not supposed to know about, my mum hated my dad and tried to turn us all against him ( but he was my dad ) sisters went their separate ways one to the Airforce and one left home i was left basically looking after my younger sister.
you may never get to the bottom of this situation as also yer mums yer mum .
we never really knew till we were doing mums eulogy she certainly had issues going on . It helped me going to council training on different issues folks had she had a hard life