Mum will not allow me to spend time with other family members

[Nomorebullshitnotavailable]

There has been a long history of this. Title not entirely accurate as I am allowed to see my dad and my brother but only if she is there.

Quick overview - parents split over 30 years ago, I live closest to my mum, dad and brother live further away but in different locations to one another. I am the only one with children, all of whom are young (under 5).

There have been many instances of me asking to spend one on one time with my dad or my brother over the years. They don’t seem keen because they know it will cause issues with mum. If I bring it up with mum I get a lot of shit back (silent treatment, guilt tripping, tears etc).

I recently went to visit my dad (he usually comes to us as children haven’t travelled well) and my mum’s response was to go and stay with him (and his wife) for 3 days. By the way, she loathes him and constantly bitches about him to me. So, as self involved as it sounds, I do feel like the visit was to make a point to me.

She frequently spends one on time with my brother (ie every visit) but I am NEVER allowed to see him by myself. Even when my dad visits, he usually goes to her house first and then they will all come over to mine.

I do know there is something very toxic here. I have had therapy and I know that my mother is a major cause of anxiety and stress for me. Even putting reasonable boundaries in place is met with the usual silent treatment and guilt tripping.

There’s a lot more I could say but don’t really know where to start and end. My two questions really are:

1. Does anyone have any idea why she could be like this?
2. I can’t cut her off (I’ve tried just taking a break and the fallout really wasn’t worth it) so how do I handle this?

I’m really at my wits end, it has a huge impact on my mental health and I would be so grateful for any insights. Thank you.

You can't get your head around your's parenting style because it is bat shit crazy.

Distance yourself physically and emotionally.

Focus on your husband, children, friends and, most of all, yourself.

You can't get your head around your mum's parenting style because it is bat shit crazy.

Distance yourself physically and emotionally.

Focus on your husband, children, friends and, most of all, yourself.

This brought tears to my eyes, I’m grateful - thank you.

Thank you for all your kind words, I’ve read all of them.

Yes everyone here has made me realise this. I am going to work on grey rocking, clear boundaries and keeping my distance from everyone a bit, I think. I’m usually so busy that this isn’t a problem - I have time right now to stop and think because I’m laid up with a bad back which was actually probably the best thing that could have happened right now!

I’m wondering if DBs over reaction is that he sees you as DMs carer and a shield for him? I wouldn’t chase people who aren’t prioritising a relationship with you …sorry it sounds really hard to bear 💐

@Nomorebullshitnotavailable

You're brother was screaming at you! Why?

Can you have an honest, frank discussion with your dad and brother about this? Whereby, you all agree that any contact you have is not your mother’s business? If not, why not? Your dad especially, has no obligation to your mother anymore. He certainly doesn’t need to be talking to your mum about contact he has with his adult children.

Given the amount of anxiety she causes you, it doesn’t sound like having her spending too much time with your own children is a good or healthy for them. I keep several members of my own family at arms length for similar reasons btw. It took me several years to do that but I just wanted to break the cycle for them.

This is the most wonderful YT account with little comedic skits showing unhealthy mother/child dynamics and how people can break patterns, and yet at the same time it's so gentle and kind and also funny. I'd give it a watch. This is just one skit but there are lots following the same fictional family and i find it quite healingnin a way. https://youtube.com/shorts/b-i1VSdUUZ0?si=E0V_I9CDcu5IjCBb

So basically when I was pregnant with my second my relationship with my mother really deteriorated and we had just been told that our eldest should be assessed for ASD (in hindsight it was obvious but it was a shock at the time, she wasn’t even 2, it was Christmas Eve and I was 6 months pregnant) so it was a very emotional time.

My mum was making my life worse, not better, by that point and I told her, calmly, that I needed to take some time away until the baby was here because I was genuinely worried the stress was affecting my pregnancy.

I was also still working and one day my brother called on my lunch break and had a massive go at me for taking a break from my mum. He was just really really angry with me.

It’s not the first time he’s done that. When lockdown hit I had a 7 week old who had been treated for a respiratory infection at birth so Covid was scary at the time. My mum had undertaken a big house project and was staying close to her house in an Air b and b. She wanted to come and stay with us instead but because she was on and off site and around lots of people, my husband and I were not comfortable. She seemed ok with it but then my brother called me to have a massive go at me for not letting my mum move in.

I could try to have that conversation with my dad but my brother would just get really angry with me, I have to be very careful about what I say to him.

My dad has really only been keen on visiting me since I had children and my brother will visit my mum regularly but I’m not really part of that planning.

I do somewhat think I’m the background character in my family. Which is fine. Because my kids are a thousand times better than all of them so I win in the end!

Both of the instances you describe your brother getting angry seem to be about when you couldn’t be there for your Mum. Maybe someone up thread is right, he wants you to do the hard lifting when it comes to Mum, otherwise it will all fall on him.

Also you have used the word ‘punished’ a lot. You are an adult, how can a parent punish you? Any treatment you would count as punishment is unacceptable and part of a toxic coercive relationship, as is her using suicide as a threat.

You have to square up to her and say bring it on. Whatever she does is absolutely her decision and if she were to hurt herself as she threatens, it would not be even 1% your fault. It’s a common threat made by people trying to exert control.

Oh ffs stop pandering to this absolute dickhead of a woman. Stop telling her what you're doing, just do it. Keep her at a distance......and stop subjecting your kids to this ridiculous behaviour......do you really want them turning out like you have ? Because you're leaving them at risk of abusive relationships in the future.

Do it for them if you can't be bothered doing it for yourself. And if there is a fallout just turn your damn phone off. If anyone shows up in person causing trouble phone the police. Draw your line in the sand and do it now.

Then maybe you need some distance from your brother too? It sounds harsh but I do believe with things like this, people can only treat you like this if you let them. If your mum kicks off, let her. Tell her you are not going to listen to any more of her nonsense, hang up, don’t engage. If she continues to behave like this that’s her problem. And your brother’s if he starts too. Focus on your own family. You can’t make your mum and brother behave like reasonable people but you don’t have to put up with their shit.

@Nomorebullshitnotavailable
I can't believe what I just read - this is one of the most screwed up family imbalances that I've read for a while. I have a work background in psychology and my first thought is that your mother has a personality trait suggesting a narcissism complex which unfortunately means that it's extremely unlikely that she would ever change or actually want to change. Quite simply - this is her as damaging as it is.

You already know that boundaries haven't and will not work here. Her psyche will not allow her to modify or adjust her behaviour, even though it insidiously poisons everything and everyone, because she believes absolutely she is right and deserving of every belief & desire in her life.
So my question to you is this: What can she do to you if you choose to remove yourself and your family unit from the game?
What do you fear so much that you allow the status quo to continue despite your evident distress?
Why do you allow her to dominate your life?

Your DH sees her for what she is and probably wonders how this will affect your own DC when he can see the person he loves being trodden over so thoroughly. Your father has for some reason allowed your mother to dictate his relationships with you and his own wife and that makes him the enabler in this sad situation. I suspect that he feels guilty about the marriage failing and in turn selected a new wife who will be compliant to his first wife to the point that he allows your mother to come to his home and piss over her boundaries and needs.

Have you ever had therapy to unpick this and your childhood? If not find a good therapist and if you have then please go back and work on setting yourself right. YOU deserve that - YOU

@Nomorebullshitnotavailable - sorry meant to add:
Work towards going no contact but have therapy first so you can arm yourself and protect yourself from the fallout. NC boundaries need to be very strong and determinedly kept with people like your mother.

Just before you deal with your mother, make sure you block your brother first. I definietely wouldn't want to accept his abusive calls, so it's probably best you don't even know he's trying to contact you to deliver an undeserved bollocking.

Having good one-to-one relationships with family members just isn't too important to a lot of men. It can be very frustrating if the we'd always some other person around, particularly if they happen to be a control freak who needs to be the centre of attention, but they don't see it as an issue.

So you are going to struggle to get your brother and dad to concede that you and your mum are separate people. They are going to cast you as the difficult one who is making a fuss about nothing, because antagonizing you is the easy option compared to antagonizing her. And all you can really do is leave them to it and focus on the people who genuinely love you.

Yes! There have been many times when my brother has asked me to keep mum off his back for a while because he’s going through something and can’t bear the pressure. Hadn’t thought of it quite like that. Thank you!

My dad has really only been keen on visiting me since I had children and my brother will visit my mum regularly but I’m not really part of that planning.

So your brother gets autonomy?

I do somewhat think I’m the background character in my family.

So is your mum's control more focussed on you?

I think that you need to take a big break from all of them tbh.

Do they really bring you anything but stress?

If a friend treated you so badly you would likely drop them without a second thought.

This should also (imo) apply to family.

They all treat you appallingly.

There have been many times when my brother has asked me to keep mum off his back for a while because he’s going through something and can’t bear the pressure.

Am I wrong in thinking that he wouldn't/doesn't do the same for you?

But this is just classic guilt tripping and controlling behaviour.
it’s up to you whether you put up with it or not. It will continue and may even worsen if you let it go on. Might therapy help you to deal with it?

I think you need to accept that your brother doesn't bring anything positive to your life - he's mummy's golden boy - even though he left to live with his Dad! - and he's decided that you're responsible for keeping your mother on an even keel, so she doesn't bother him.

You won't lose anything by cutting contact with him. I'm NC with my horrible brother, who was the golden child. I was worried that my DCs were losing a close family member, but he'd have turned on them at some stage - only my mother was worthy of love in his eyes. Can you think about just letting that relationship fizzle out?

Your Dad sounds as if he was quite damaged by his relationship with your mum, he's still enmeshed, possibly scared of her suicide threaths, so he continues to walk on egg shells around him.

But he's your Dad, he needs to actively put you first, he's not responsible for your mother, he needs to unlearn the role she's cast him in.

And your mother sounds awful, I'm sorry. I think you're right that there's an element of competition with you for status of the main woman of the family. My mother was a bit like this, had to be loved the most, claimed my kids always wanted to be with her, not me, when they were babies (and couldn't speak to express a preference!). She didn't like cooking, and I do, so all family meals had to be cooked by her, in her home, to make the point that she was the ubermother.

Your mum is so much worse than mine - please set down boundaries, and go very LC, or NC if you feel you can. If your brother calls to shout at you, just block his number.

Not seeing my horrible brother, an awful bully, has really improved the quality of my life. The only events where we've been in the same place in the last 10 years is the odd family funeral, where he glares at me and DH, but such a relief not to speak to him.

So glad your husband is so supportive, as others have said, you sound like a really nice person, your mum has not managed to fuck you up.

I’m hopeless at trying to tag people but I absolutely need this no nonsense take from the last few posters. And to the poster who talked about setting a good example for my children - totally right.

I didn’t know what I was hoping for from this thread but you’ve all made me see that it’s the entire family dynamic that’s the problem.

I have had therapy, which has helped me to identify how the past is affecting me now. My main aim for this was so that I don’t continue this awful cycle for my kids. I’ve got to start growing more of a backbone. There is zero point in having it out with any of them. But I absolutely will only engage when and how it suits me and my family.

And whenever I need a reminder that I am not the unreasonable and batshit crazy one I will return to this thread!

Someone asked about me using the word punishment a lot. I suppose because it feels a very familiar and targeted reaction to me “stepping out of line”. I have a physical reaction to it - stomach ache, tight chest, tense body. I know it’s coming and I know she’ll hit me with it when it’s most likely to be effective (right before an interview was particularly memorable). It’s that reaction that I want to overcome. If I can genuinely not care, not anticipate it, then the power over me is gone.

Your brother is using you, he probably feels that you shield him from your mum. Your brother chose to leave your mum but she still chases him, so his ego is fine, he can do no wrong in her eyes.. you are useful to him as you soak up all the negativity from her so he doesn’t have to deal with it. Him being angry with you for cutting her off at times is him panicking he will have to fill the role.

Your dad is really letting you down too by engaging with this insanity for an easy life. And look what he’s taught your brother!

None of them really deserve you