Do my parents in law want to kidnap my baby? Need advice

[Saskia98]

For context, I’m a FTM to a 3 month old. My partner and I are both 25. I’m English and my partner and his parents are Romanian (they’ve lived in England for past 15 years). LO has partners surname and as we are not yet married I don’t have his surname at the moment. This means LO has same surname as my partner and his parents but not me. LO will be having a British passport but partner also wants him having a Romanian passport so it’s easier for when he wants to travel in EU. I don’t quite know the benefits of having 2 passports, so any information on this would be appreciated.

I’ve posted about my parents in law previously, (to put shortly, my mil has made continuous ‘jokes’ about taking LO to their country without me, she’s made ‘jokes’ that he’s her baby not mine, her and fil have told my partner to break up with me throughout our relationship, even when I was pregnant, and would say to me “you look after the baby when he’s in your stomach and we’ll look after him when he’s here”. His mum constantly kept taking over with LO, even saying she needs to do his bath or at least supervise me incase I get water in his ears. These are just a few issues I’ve had with them. It honestly felt like she only wanted me out of the picture and to be a surrogate for my own child so she can have him. This is never going to happen. I finally set boundaries around a month ago and we only see them once every week or 2 now. My partner sticks up for me for the most part on the situation but we’ve had many arguments in private as he doesn’t see what his mums done wrong and think I’m being unreasonable.

I need some advice on the following situation as I’m TERRIFIED that one day they’ll try to kidnap my son. My partner and I was round their house with LO and we were talking about passport pictures for baby. FIL asks how long it takes for LO’s passport to arrive (we haven’t applied for one yet). He then asked if nowadays it would be his own separate passport or an extension from the parents one. We said a separate passport and he asked what if one parent wanted to take LO away without the other parent. My MIL states how you need permission from the other parent to take them away. I don’t know how she would know this unless she’s researched into it and my FIL asking this is the first place out of the blue is concerning to me.

Is there any way my partners parents can take LO away without me or partner? Can they just pretend they’re his parents as they have his surname and are in early 40’s so could be young enough to pass as having a baby. Can they fake a permission letter? What documents are needed when taking a baby abroad and what checks are done? I need some reassurance or advice as I don’t know how to approach this.

@ChiefEverythingOfficer I have the same experience. We always fill out the paperwork as I regularly travel with my DC and not DH, even though we all have the same surname. My parents took the 4DC to the UK alone last summer for the first time, and again, no one stopped. We don't live in the UK and so travel a lot.

That said, I have had friends who were stopped and had to show photos in their phones as proof that they were all related.

But regardless, @Saskia98 , you need to sit down rationally and talk this through with your DH and PIL. These 'jokes' are not funny, and they are causing you distress. A child should have a relaxed relationship with their grandparents and in order for that to happen, you all need to draw up some boundaries and talk honestly.

I presume his dad would have to register his birth at the Romanian consulate before he could apply for a Romanian passport. Has he done that?

To be fair to your MIL. Lots of people know about needing permission to take a child abroad. I'm sure lots iof her friends and family travel between Romania and Uk a lot. It's probably come up in conversation over the years

Also op, just from reading your other previous threads from the last few weeks, it sounds like your partner has grown up around his parents fighting and arguing and it sounds like what he sees as 'normal' is based on what he experienced growing up and he maybe hasn't got to a place yet where he really understands how not ok a lot of that was. There's maybe an element of - "well I'm fine and they raised me" - and he's not seeing that things could and should be better. That's an awful lot to unpack and probably isn't going to happen overnight.

I agree with others that a good next move is probably to try and move somewhere so you aren't renting from them - is that a feasible option for you to work towards, maybe using co ownership or similar?

Could you sit down with your partner and talk about what your hopes and goals are for ds, what type of home you want him to grow up in, what influences you want him to have and why and that might help him reflect on his parents off his own bat?

With kindness, if you trust your partner not to run off with your baby then the risks of your child being kidnapped are very very low, even if your in laws push boundaries. Having seen your previous posts when they came up I think you’re massively spiralling about the possibility of a kidnapping, likely caused by spending lots of time and energy thinking and stressing about their boundary pushing and feeling powerless in your interactions with them. I think you need to seek some mental health support as a priority, to try and reduce your anxiety and give you the support you need to implement appropriate boundaries that you’re happy with.

As someone from a non-English family, I think this is a case of cultural differences and they're just joking?!

Obviously having a Romanian/EU passport would be hugely beneficial for your child as they could then live, study and work in the EU, if they wish.

I got dual passports for my children when they were young - to be honest it’s actually a pain and expensive because you need to keep them updated - and you need both parents signatures to do that too and kids passports are changed more frequently than adults as they grow so need new photos more often. Quite frankly with your concerns I would say to your partner your son can travel to Romania on his British passport and no reason to go the expense / effort to get to get a Romanian one until he is an adult - it will literally save you thousands check Romanian website and get the costs

They don’t have friends or other family here in the UK. All their friends and family are in Romania, none of which travel to the UK. They have a house out there and go there twice a year, they want to move there and the only reason they aren’t is because my partner doesn’t want to. The chance of her knowing this without researching is very slim.

It does happen a lot. I’d be very concerned and would make sure they never have access to the passport if you do get one. Job done!

I’m not allowing them to be alone with LO. Is this an issue I would bring up with health visitor or someone else as I don’t have another appointment with them until LO is between 9-12 months?

I would apply for both passports asap and then hide them with a friend or at work or similar (obvs. your partner would have to apply for the Romanian one). Also make sure your baby’s birth certificate is well hidden. My concern is that they, if they really wanted to, could apply for the passport themselves. Also be clear with them - the baby travels nowhere without you unless you say so.

This is a tricky one OP and you’re right to be cautious IMO. My DC are grown now but I don’t think you need both parent’s signatures for a uk child PP so they could apply for one perhaps. They might also be able to apply for a Romanian one for him too, they’d need to apply for Romanian citizenship by decent first which is a formality. Anyone can apply for a birth certificate copy.
The passport office can be very slack, many years ago my DHs ex wrote to them forging my DHs signature asking to change his son’s surname to her new married one and they just did it. It caused all sorts of problems for my DH trying to prove he was my DSS’s dad she took him to live other side of the world. Seek legal advice. Sorry you’re having to go through this

Would either of you know this information to be able to apply for a UK passport without the other one knowing? Seems unlikely.

However, to add your mil 'has researched' what to do re travelling abroad with a child because she has been doing it for 15 years presumably with her own son.

Just stop the passport process.

As others have said, keep his passport (if you must have one) elsewhere. Member of your family maybe.

Unfortunately I’d say yes they could take him out of the country without you knowing or agreeing. You are supposed to have parental permission if grandparents taking their grandchildren or permission from other parent if travelling alone but in reality not all airlines ask for it. If you’re not travelling I’d delay getting a passport. Your partner needs to have serious words with his parents as they are causing you an awful lot of upset and worry

Give his passports to a trusted friend (and explain the situation to them). You can also alert the authorities to the situation and issue a “port alert” to stop your child being taken out of the country.

You can have the birth certificate changed to add your surname as a middle name up to the baby being 12 months. I don’t think you could change the surname this way but I could be wrong. I think it’s always better to give babies the mother’s surname or hyphenate both, but at least you will have your name in there if you know what I mean.

I know a couple of Romanian nationals and tbh I think it’s their sense of humour. Grandparents do get carried away with new grandchildren and overstep a bit. I suppose if all their family and friends are in Romania they want to show your baby off to them there. It doesn’t mean you have to let them though. I did wonder if you have some PP anxiety so things just aren’t funny atm? Are you feeling ok aside from this worry? Is your relationship with the baby’s dad good?

I would mention this to some sort of professional. I would go no contact and I wouldn't get a passport until your baby is older. You shouldn't have to live in fear like this. Make sure you write everything down that they say and do, make sure you date it too, as evidence.

She cannot change the child's last name without the father's consent

I’ve taken my children out of the country many times. Of course, DH agreed and we were on the same page. But I have never been questioned—are the DC mine / do I have parental responsibility / does DH know? Never been asked. Not once. Just breezed through immigration on my own.

I've always made sure to get the permission letter from my DD's father and never once have I been asked for it. They have his surname but my surname as a middle .
Sounds like you've already applied for the passports. When they arrive, you keep them. Maybe at your parents' house?

Yes but do your children have your surname? I expect they do. Mine don't and I've been questioned every time

This. If you don't get a passport they still can.

And never let them have your child alone.