Support thread for those in Emotionally Abusive Relationships - thread 29

[CharlotteCollins]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
A check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
Warning signs you’re dating a loser Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie If you’re a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out - You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
Heart to heart - a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

What couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
Should I Stay or Should I Go bonus materials This is a site containing material for men who want to change - please don’t give him the link - print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
What you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

It's very creepy. I suppose it's how they attempt to maintain control over us once we're separated. What worked for so long whilst we were living together might still work if it's just modified a bit. Wow, that is dark.

Your friends idea sounds solid, I fear my fw wouldn't put his name to anything he saw as tying him down. It's hard enough tying him to a specific day each week! Maybe a little further down the line when he has his place livable. Although I have to admit, the thought of him being responsible for 3 babies he's barely done anything for, and becomes easily irritated and frustrated with, is making my blood run cold.

Stbxh chose today as his contact day. He was arriving at 1pm. I text at 2pm to ask where he was. His reply was this 'If you can be awkward about contact, so can I. I do not need to tell you if I've decided to cancel. This is how you wanted it.'

What does that even mean??? How is that 'how I wanted it'?

Gaaaaaaahhhhhhh!!!!!

In other news, yet another friend on the way to biting the dust. He moved down south a few months back and we've kept in touch via twitter. I'm a bit protective of my phone number and he was ok with that. Now I find out he's been googling how to find my number, attempting to video call me via gmail (?) and other stalkery things. Then his latest message is very sexually explicit in what he really wants to do. This after I confided in him, after I told him plainly that we are friends, and arms length friends at that. I've never given him the impression it's ok to do that, he knows my history ffs. I've told him to back off..he knows I don't need this kind of crap.

Gaaaaahhhhh!!!

And breathe.

Okay. So he cancelled. So that's it. No more contact then until next week. And keep the texts and document it all. He'll look like an utter prat if he ever tries to drag you into court. And as he chose today for contact, any other time he bothers you, ring the police, as it's harassment.

As far as the friend is concerned, he is no friend.

I have the texts saying 1pm today, all very civil. One from me at 2pm asking where he is. His ridiculous response. Back to the crap behaviour in a heartbeat.

Now I have one requesting Sunday instead. My response was "no, I made plans for sunday as we agreed contact would be today. Please text me again after the weekend to arrange for next week."

Now I'm the bitch keeping him from seeing our DC.

DOES HE JUST NOT GET IT????

I haven't responded.

Yes I think 'friend' is indeed no friend at all. Why is it so hard to just be a regular joe with no underlying agenda?!?

It's one of those days. Ah well.

Now if he texts you, then you need to make a harassment report with the police. Show them ALL of those texts. They will see that he is trying to harass you. Get a police paper trail going. Don't back down. He needs to understand that you will report each and every bit of harassment to the police. You've told him not to text you until after the weekend, and only for child contact, so he's got no reason to be bugging you before then and then should only be contacting you in order to arrange the contact visit.

Anything else is harassment. Report it.

Curt hope you're doing okay today and he's not bothering you. (fingers crossed!)

I've come to the conclusion that stbx will never be happy.

He wasn't happy with us - he didn't like the day to day tasks and chores that having children involved - medical, dental appointments, school runs, kids fighting, bedtimes, tidying up after them, laundry - all that stuff. He didn't like the fact that we couldn't just drop everything and go on holiday (or that we couldn't afford it) or that we couldn't just go down to the pub for the evening without dealing with a sitter (an impossibility anyway with DS1's disabilities).

He wasn't happy when we separated - he didn't like to be tied down to regular visits, he didn't like having to pay child maintenance, he didn't like to have to be reminded that he was still actually a parent with responsibilities, he didn't like living with his mum, he didn't like not having someone available "on tap" for sex, and he didn't like not having any money (no benefits).

He wasn't happy when he went with OW - he was still tied down with children (although he wasn't technically responsible for them I suppose), he didn't have friends, he didn't have a job (as he quit his), so he didn't have money.

He isn't happy now that he's separated from OW and back at his mum's.

But he's actually got the freedom from any child-related responsibility. He doesn't have to do school runs, ill children, doctor or dentist appointments, eye appointments, bedtimes, nighttime wakings, laundry, making meals for the kids. He can go to the pub whenever he wants, sleep in, do what he wants with his free time, he's not tied down. And yet... he's still not happy.

alice I could have written that post (aside from the OW part). Absolutely my stbxh to a T.

He now has a lovely place, getting it fully furnished for free (!), has the single life/freedom/no responsibilities he always craved when we were together..and he STILL isn't happy.

Hello every one. I hope youre all doing well Thank you for the welcome.

In answer to the question of why ive gone back- he makes it too hard to leave. I cant take the harassment after ive told him to fuck off (all wrapped up in promises, and apologies, as well as nastiness, and almost-threats). Police have been called, reports been made, nothing has ever been accomplished. Hes defeated me really right now. I'm too tired of it all. I think he's most manipulative of the fact that I'm a nice person, does that make sense? I dont want another person suffering, he plays on that, he puts fault on me, paints me as making him suffer, knows I want him to be happy even if he doesnt extend the same courtesy to me.

I'm lucky in that I'm young, have no children, were not married. I can get out and be truly rid if I manage it. My biggest fear is falling pregnant. I think he wants me to, that scares me. I want children very much, but I cant bring a child into this

He's never hurt me physically. Hes never once been violent toward me. But I think if he ever is, it wouldnt be a slow build up, I think he'd go all in. Ive believed for a long time that if I stay with him, he'll kill me one day. He used to joke about it a lot. I know how horrible it is, but I just came to terms with it one day.

On the brighter side I think being on mumsnet is helping me a lot. Ive come to expect more, want more for myself, stand up to a lot of his manipulative behaviors.

FFS. I set up the contact at a park, but as the weather report says it may rain, I emailed stbx and said let's meet at the high street instead, and the dcs can have lunch and do something in town weather permitting. And he STILL is going on about coming to my house instead. I am going to lose my mind. Why does he not get it? He says "I promise no hostilities.. please give me this one chance.." You have had 9 months of chances during contact visits and it made not a jot of difference. No.

Oh alice you're back to this again. He obviously thinks he's a decent enough human being to have in your home. Talk about deluded.

I haven't heard a word from fw, which whilst a calm time, just leaves me waiting for what he's going to do next.

curt it's like a revolving door, it really is. I've managed to reroute it to the high street (emailed him a copy of the bus schedule as he insisted it didn't go that far). So contact arranged. We'll see what happens. I imagine in person it'll be nonstop pressure to have the next contact at my house. I'm going to have to just say "look if you're going to keep pushing this, I'm going to have to just make arrangements for you to see them at the contact centre. I'm tired of being bullied." Maybe then he'll back off a bit. I hate being pressured.

Nothing from your fw?? Dare we think that no news is good news? At least he's no longer dropping by every day, right? (always looking for the positive )

sadie that's very worrying. Unfortunately for your own safety, I think you're going to have to get past any concern over him and what may become of him. If he used to joke about killing you, you really need to get out of there. Have you discussed all of this with Women's Aid at all?

alice No doubt you'll be told you're unreasonable..obstructive..hostile..blah blah blah

I spoke too soon. Two missed calls while I was in the garden with DC. And then lo..there he is at my door. Says he knows it's short notice but he has job interviews all week and could he see DC for a bit. I agreed but said I will hold him to today being contact day. He went into my kitchen, took my calendar down and wrote 'visited kids' on today. Then turned it to july and wrote 'visit kids' on saturday before saying 'there. now you have it in writing. saturday ok?' As it happens it is but err..excuse me is this your home?!?

That was at half 4. He's still in the garden with DC. I've told him bathtime at 6 so he can either leave or bath them. He says he'll go at 6. We shall see.

curt fingers crossed for you. Annoying, but is he at least being "slightly" more cooperative than previously?

I know what you mean though. It's like they just cannot help themselves.. they MUST push the boundaries in some way. I just dread the contact, as I know he's going to spend a fair amount of time insisting he can come to the house for future visits, and I'm going to have to quash it. Yes, I'm sure I'll be called unreasonable and if he gets irritable, then I'll just be a bitch. He won't put it in a message, he'll save that for FB and in person. That's just the way he is (he knows I keep everything for documentation).

alice slightly, yes, at least he called twice instead of just turning up. Probably if I'd heard the phone I would've agreed anyway, gets it out of the way for this week! On the other hand, he can't resist the odd dig. He saw a pair of scissors on the counter (well out of the way from small hands) and made a comment about did I think it was suitable to keep them there? Well I don't keep them there, that's just where they happen to be now! And so I defended nyself and over explained when I promised myself I wouldn't do that. Then he said DD1 is getting heavy and am I filling her full of mcds? Once again defence and over explanation.

Ah well. Just went to run DC's bath. He's supposed to be leaving in 5 minutes so best go round them up.

curt hope everything went well yesterday and he left without incident.

DCs will be having their first (brief) contact with stbx this weekend. It'll be the first time they've seen or spoken to him in over 4 months. I am a bit worried about the fallout and hope that he doesn't upset them in any way. I also hope that he doesn't continue to put pressure on me to visit them in my house, because it's just not going to happen and it will only make the visit strained.

I've decided to be proactive about the stress that I'm dealing with.
1- he is no longer stbx. He is kd (kid's dad). Someone mentioned it on another thread, and I like it - it removes the whole "our relationship" part of it and focuses on what he actually is (in theory )

2- I am going to commit at least one hour an evening to working on some craft stuff. To destress, to make christmas gifts, to do something interesting. Rather than just spacing out in front of the telly.

Im fucking tired. emotionally and physically.

of course im being accused of all and sundry. was not allowed to sleep all last night. now he's kicked off and im not allowed to text him, because i refused to apologize for something that he accused me of, that I didnt do.

i'm fine with not texting him, but hes of course still hurling abuse at me over text.

maybesadie not allowed to sleep..not allowed to text. You know you need to leave, right? I managed it with 3 babies in tow, please don't waste your life on this man, you only get one go at it. I don't know what your family/financial set up is like, but you really need to formulate an escape plan and stick to it.

alice ..KD I saw that on the other thread and I'm adopting it too. Another very positive way of disengaging. I like your craft idea. I've gotten back into writing again so I find once my DC are in bed I pick up my pen and pad and next thing I know, it's bedtime. Plus it's amazingly theraputic (and I got a short story accepted my a publisher). And KD said I'd never get anywhere with it

Oh..he hung around while I bathed DC but left as I was settling them. One very polite text since saying thank you for letting him see them at short notice and he'll see us on saturday.

curt wow. polite text and he'll see you on saturday. I'm pleased that being firm has gotten a good response from him. Long may it last!!

sadie he's keeping you awake to make you vulnerable and off kilter, so he can take advantage of it. He doesn't want you thinking straight because he knows if you are alert and oriented, you will kick his arse to the kerb and walk out. This is torture - sleep deprivation is something they did in POW camps, hun. Is this the kind of life you want? Please ring Women's Aid (or somebody!) and talk to them. Let them help you. He sounds unbalanced - and dangerous!

alice ..so far so good. I'm wary and still don't trust this new behaviour but at least there's no agro.

maybesadie..sleep deprivation is abuse. Mine used to love doing all he could to keep me awake, even so far as purposefully banging about or shouting whilst our babies were asleep, then once they woke up he'd walk off downstairs saying "looks like you're not getting any sleep tonight.." Vile behaviour. Please, please don't let that be your life.

Coming up to 6 months anniversary of me walking out.

curt I'm just waiting for this weekend. I'm worried that in person, it's going to be constant demands about going to my house and asking questions that are none of his business. Or that he's going to be aggressive towards the dcs.

alice Must be playing on your mind and I don't blame you. It's been a few months since your DC saw him, you've not had to deal with him in person, and suddenly he's thrust back into all your lives making demands and snooping into your business. I've almost gotten used to that now. As much as I try to disengage, he still manages to elicit a response. There comes a point when I have to say "Look, I don't know what you think I am but no, I don't have men coming in and out at all hours, I don't have anyone coming in and out at all hours!"

Sadie hope you're okay.

curt hope things have settled down for you a bit and that he's not coming around all the time. You're right, it's been playing around in my head for a few days now. I can see the "charm" attempt already in a few messages. Apparently he's "borrowed" enough money to offer to pay for lunch this weekend - after he couldn't even borrow enough to come visit the dcs. Oddly he sent a message late last night that is on another site that I'd have to register and log in to retrieve. I'm not going to do that. I sent an email saying I'm not sure what exactly that was all about, but if you want to contact me you have my email. I'm not playing these kind of games. Just annoying. I'm putting a small lager in the fridge in the morning, so it's cold by evening. I have the feeling I'm going to need it.

Ah, well, at least I've figured that weird message out. He replied that he didn't mean to send it to me. It was apparently something he meant to send to some woman on a dating website. Utterly charming, he is.

alice sending you some good vibes to help get you thru the next 36 hours.

I had a phone call from him at stupid o'clock this morning. When I didn't pick up he text "Stupid drunken phone call just as well you didn't answer or I'd have made a tit of myself. Are you alone?"

I did a bit of an inward groan. Half expected him to turn up at my door but thankfully, no. I sense a 'I deserve a second chance' coming on. He's following his 'pattern' from when we last separated. Difference is last time I was open to it, I was living in the family home and I wasn't fully aware of how atrocious he could be. This time I'm living in MY home, and I'm armed with the power of knowledge. I'm in a far stronger position than I was before.

Contact day tomorrow. DC don't know, I'm still wary of telling them in case he blobs. Saves a whole world of upset. Do your DC know they're seeing dad tomorrow alice? How do they feel about it?